La traduction de l'anglais vers le français est très simple et très efficace.

Dr. MMX

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Hey je vais juste taper les réactifs utilisés par wise choice (prix/effort) disponibles à l'achat en europe
donc 1er
PCL5 avec soufre élémentaire > chlorure de thionyle

chlorure de thionyle + acide propionique > chlorure de priopionyle

Synthèse 4mp (il y a un sujet donc je vais juste mettre un lien) :
Chlorure de propionyle
Toluène
AlCl3 anhydre

http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhni37ybtt7mkbjyxn2pgllzxf2qgyd.onion/en/threads/synthesis-of-4-methylpropiophenone-from-toluene-by-friedel-crafts-reaction-1kg-scale.209/


certains peuvent avoir des problèmes pour le bromer
L'acide sulfurique nécessaire pour obtenir du Hbr est un peu cher et n'est pas souvent disponible. Au lieu de cela, nous utilisons :
de l'acide phosphorique et du NaBh pour la réaction > on obtient du HBR
H2O2 12% peut être acheté et distillé à un pourcentage plus élevé comme 25-30%.

Donc
4 methylopropione + HBR + H2O2 > 2b4m :)

Je n'ai pas calculé le coût mais il est très faible et il n'est pas nécessaire d'attendre la livraison ou d'être surpris par la mauvaise qualité du précurseur.
 
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chost

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Pouvez-vous expliquer plus en détail comment fabriquer du HBR ?
 

Dr. MMX

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Je suis vraiment désolé d'avoir fait une erreur, c'est correct :
Pour produire de l'acide bromhydrique (HBr) à partir d'acide phosphorique (H₃PO₄) et de bromure de sodium (NaBr), vous pouvez utiliser une réaction de double déplacement. La réaction peut être représentée comme suit :


  1. Réactifs: Acide phosphorique (H₃PO₄) et bromure de sodium (NaBr).
  2. Produits: Acide bromhydrique (HBr) et phosphate de sodium (Na₃PO₄).

L'équation chimique équilibrée de la réaction est la suivante :


H3PO4+3NaBr→3HBr+Na3PO4


Dans cette réaction, l'acide phosphorique réagit avec le bromure de sodium pour produire de l'acide bromhydrique et du phosphate de sodium.
 
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chost

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La distillation est-elle nécessaire ?
Et dans quelle quantité d'eau dois-je dissoudre le bromure de sodium ?
 

Dr. MMX

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Sinon, comment comptez-vous obtenir quelque chose qui est essentiellement un gaz ? :)

Cela dépend du pourcentage que vous voulez avoir, le maximum est de 47% si je me souviens bien et cela devrait déjà être le cas.
 

Benz88

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is it Safe to Distille the h2o2 to maybe 30-35% from 12%?
 

Dr. MMX

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TheVacuumGuy

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H3po4 avec NaBr pour produire du HBr ? Je vais essayer cela dans une minute.

J'ai beaucoup de HBr, mais je suis curieux de savoir si les deux réagissent.
 

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oui et Na3PO4
 

Dr. MMX

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c'est merveilleux
 
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TheVacuumGuy

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Didn't work. I think it would be easier to add sulfuric acid to a solution of KBr (or NaBr) , which would readily yield HBr at 125c
 

Dr. MMX

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I tried to override having sulfuric acid becasue here is troubles to get it. It was very extreme attempt
if there is access to sulfuric acid its easy job
 

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you can get elemental bromine from potasium bromide, dont need to use acids.
it was quite cheap as i remember
 

Toddler

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Hbr2 48% can work ?
(CAS.No: 10035-10-6)

how much ration use for bromination
Hbr2
H2O2
for 100g of 4MPP
 
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w2x3f5

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Instead of propionyl chloride, can use propionic anhydride (obtain phosphorus oxide from propionic acid), can also use propionic acid directly with polyphosphoric acid (there are many options for this reaction, you can choose the best one). If propionyl chloride is used with anhydrous aluminum chloride (can be replaced with cheaper and simpler options). Then it is best to carry out a bromination reaction before hydrolysis in Fridel-Crafts (the complex of 2b4m and aluminum chloride is very active for bromination with a high yield).
 

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In chemistry trade buissness in europe propionic acid is considered with "silent restriction" with reason it can be used as biological weapon, so should be avoided there.

very interesting choice of propionic anhydride
 

Osmosis Vanderwaal

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@TheVacuumGuy you gave him bad figures and he used them and probably ruined 100G 2B4-MP. I dont know what he paid, but I got $200 all day for 10g if it's domestic . In th rules there are a few gold nuggets. "Use the fucking search engine." That's a rule. Another one is " a good chemist i an accurate chemist." Make sure that you clearly state you are guessing when you don't know. You could say nothing at all, you could show your math or you could tell him he needs to figure it himself, but please, dont just throw out random numbers, with no disclaimer.
 

TheVacuumGuy

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Show me what's wrong then. I used these figures with success. note that hydrogen peroxide is a solution of 35%.
 

TheVacuumGuy

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i stated roughly , not stoicimeticly


reactants Coeff Molar Mass Moles (g/mol)Weight (g)
C10H12O1
148.20168
0,67100
HBr 180.911940,6754,595831842122166
H2O2134.014680,6722,951615663196257

products
1
C10H11BrO1227.097740.67153,23560434672535
H2O218.015281,3524,311843158593074

HBr 48% = 8.77 mol/L => for required 0.67m corresponds to 0,0764L (76ml)
h2o2 35% = 11.63 mol/L => for required 0.67m corresponds to 0,0576L (57ml)

Yes that's a bit off from 100 and 50, but these numbers are theoretically, which almost never applies in practice. ( like a mephedrone synthesis is given methylamine x2 but theoretically only needs x1/5 )

furthermore excess reagents are neutralized afterwards.
 
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William Dampier

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Therefore, it is better to control the bromination visually in the reaction of the bromine, because the quality of reagents (especially chinese) can be different. 4mp purity rarely exceeds 95%.
 

w2x3f5

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The best solution is the preliminary titration of 4MP, then it will be possible to use the correction factor for 4MP
 
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