# PMK oil synthesys from PMK (CAS 28578-16-7 wax form) large scale



## btcboss2022

Hello,

After check and test the methods posted in the thread http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhn...-methyl-pmk-glycidate-conversion-to-pmk.2013/ I decided the post the best method for me:

1. Put 47,5 liters of H2O in the reactor and add 2,5kg of sodium bicarbonate, stirring until complete dissolution, take out the mixture and keep it.
2. Put in the reactor 7L of H2O
3. Add while stirring 1,2kg of sodium hydroxide
4. While the H2O and the sodium hydroxide are mixing and getting temp put 5kG of wax PMK to melt by low heat.
5. When PMK is melted add it to the reactor and put the mixture at 80 °C reflux during 1 hour stirring.
6. Add 3,25kg of HCL 37% in small portions, once all added keep the mixture at 80 °C reflux during 1 hour stirring.
7. Stop stirring and put the mixture at 25 °C.
8. Discard the water top layer.
9. Put again in the reactor the oil top layer.
10. Add the H2O and sodium bicarbonate mixture, stirring 2-3 minutes.
11. Add 10 liters of DCM (from freezer preferably).
12. Let it get separated around 10-15 min.
13. Evaporate DCM from the bottom layer.

PMK oil (MDP2P; cas 4676-39-5) yield is 3,72kg.


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## G.Patton

*Reaction scheme:*


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## ChingShih

btcboss2022 said:


> Hello,
> 
> After check and test the methods posted in the thread http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhn...-methyl-pmk-glycidate-conversion-to-pmk.2013/ I decided the post the best method for me:
> 
> 1. Put 47,5 liters of H2O in the reactor and add 2,5kg of sodium bicarbonate, stirring until complete dissolution, take out the mixture and keep it.
> 2. Put in the reactor 7L of H2O
> 3. Add while stirring 1,2kg of sodium hydroxide
> 4. While the H2O and the sodium hydroxide are mixing and getting temp put 5kG of wax PMK to melt by low heat.
> 5. When PMK is melted add it to the reactor and put the mixture at 80C reflux during 1 hour stirring.
> 6. Add 3,25kg of HCL 37% in small portions, once all added keep the mixture at 80C reflux during 1 hour stirring.
> 7. Stop stirring and put the mixture at 25C
> 8. Discard the water top layer.
> 9. Put again in the reactor the oil top layer.
> 10. Add the H2O and sodium bicarbonate mixture, stirring 2-3 minutes.
> 11. Add 10 liters of DCM( from freezer preferably)
> 12. Let it get separated around 10-15 min.
> 13. Evaporate DCM from the bottom layer.
> 
> Yield: 3,72kg of PMK oil



btcboss2022
You always Impress with those complete synthesis reports, keep it up brother! Congratulation on success


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## Bennychairman

Thanks for saving us time ! just got mine , so just in time. thanks a lot !


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## Bennychairman

8. Discard the water top layer.
9. Put again in the reactor the oil top layer.

how many layers will there be? the top was discarded water and then ?


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## btcboss2022

Bennychairman said:


> 8. Discard the water top layer.
> 9. Put again in the reactor the oil top layer.
> 
> how many layers will there be? the top was discarded water and then ?



Bennychairman2 layers, when you discard water layer you must wash the oil layer with water+sodium bicarbonate solution as the procedure explains.


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## Dafunkphenomena

btcboss2022 said:


> Hello,
> 
> After check and test the methods posted in the thread http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhn...-methyl-pmk-glycidate-conversion-to-pmk.2013/ I decided the post the best method for me:
> 
> 1. Put 47,5 liters of H2O in the reactor and add 2,5kg of sodium bicarbonate, stirring until complete dissolution, take out the mixture and keep it.
> 2. Put in the reactor 7L of H2O
> 3. Add while stirring 1,2kg of sodium hydroxide
> 4. While the H2O and the sodium hydroxide are mixing and getting temp put 5kG of wax PMK to melt by low heat.
> 5. When PMK is melted add it to the reactor and put the mixture at 80C reflux during 1 hour stirring.
> 6. Add 3,25kg of HCL 37% in small portions, once all added keep the mixture at 80C reflux during 1 hour stirring.
> 7. Stop stirring and put the mixture at 25C
> 8. Discard the water top layer.
> 9. Put again in the reactor the oil top layer.
> 10. Add the H2O and sodium bicarbonate mixture, stirring 2-3 minutes.
> 11. Add 10 liters of DCM( from freezer preferably)
> 12. Let it get separated around 10-15 min.
> 13. Evaporate DCM from the bottom layer.
> 
> Yield: 3,72kg of PMK oil



btcboss2022
Hello , thats my method, (im Fring, just lost the fucking password)
ive seen you added some steps, questions:

you deceided to use sodium bicarbonate instead of NaOH washings , why exactly? (i tried both all worked)
and in the final step, you say "evaporate the DCM from the bottom" , why evaporate? would not be better separate the layers? 
or you mean , after separate put it to vacuum distill to get rid of some possible water residues?

and the PMK colour? dark red-brown, or yellowish as the old one?


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## Curiousonion

Does this method work, did anyone try this? 
Seems by far the simplest method and too easy.


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## Curiousonion

UnknownRadar said:


> It’s correct for pmk oil but after that you have to reduce the oil and process it to get mdma. I think you know that. For pmk oil it’s not the most simple way. Many seller in china talking crap so there are a bunch more of easy ways… try his method



UnknownRadarWell this method is for pmk CAS 28578-16. So you can get that in powder form then it turns into oil after you finish with the reaction.
But this seems extremely easy, has anyone tried this?


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## ChingShih

Curiousonion said:


> Well this method is for pmk CAS 28578-16. So you can get that in powder form then it turns into oil after you finish with the reaction.
> But this seems extremely easy, has anyone tried this?



Curiousonion
The method is proven and this is why the OP posted it, try for yourself and see


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## Curiousonion

ChingShih said:


> The method is proven and this is why the OP posted it, try for yourself and see



ChingShihPerfect, I shall. Just wanted to make sure because there seems to be a lot of confusion about pmk oil and its different versions.
Thanks


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## G.Patton

Curiousonion said:


> Perfect, I shall. Just wanted to make sure because there seems to be a lot of confusion about pmk oil and its different versions.
> Thanks



CuriousonionThis post is good explanation, which was posted @btcboss2022 (thank you). I confirm, that it is proved and working method.


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## Curiousonion

That's fantastic, maybe this needs to be made a sticky since it's so useful?



G.Patton said:


> This post is good explanation, which was posted @btcboss2022 (thank you). I confirm, that it is proved and working method.



G.Patton


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## btcboss2022

Hello,

Sorry I was very busy these days, all the methods that I posted have been done and tested by myself as I say in the same post, it's more many of them tested and only the best one posted.
Thanks.


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## btcboss2022

Dafunkphenomena said:


> Hello , thats my method, (im Fring, just lost the fucking password)
> ive seen you added some steps, questions:
> 
> you deceided to use sodium bicarbonate instead of NaOH washings , why exactly? (i tried both all worked)
> and in the final step, you say "evaporate the DCM from the bottom" , why evaporate? would not be better separate the layers?
> or you mean , after separate put it to vacuum distill to get rid of some possible water residues?
> 
> and the PMK colour? dark red-brown, or yellowish as the old one?



DafunkphenomenaHello,

Firstly I don't think you created that process, in fact I had this similar info long time ago from Chinese suppliers, anyway I made some changes as you can see.
Sodium bicarbonate is a softer washing method and in this case is safer to use it to avoid to damage the product.
About DCM obviously I mean to separate the bottom layer(DCM layer) and evaporate it sorry if my explanation is not clear.
To avoid water after separate layers you can dry it with anydrous sodium sulfate and filter it before evaporate the solvent( in fact I always do it in all my processes)
Thanks.


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## Curiousonion

May I ask what method you use to crysyalize the final product?


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## btcboss2022

Curiousonion said:


> May I ask what method you use to crysyalize the final product?



CuriousonionBefore crystalize you must get the freebase, for freebase I use NaBH4 method and to crystalize the freebase there are a lot of methods.


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## Curiousonion

Ah ok so I was confused, I thought the final product that you got from your reaction was the mdma freebase. 



btcboss2022 said:


> Before crystalize you must get the freebase, for freebase I use NaBH4 method and to crystalize the freebase there are a lot of methods.



btcboss2022


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## Curiousonion

Do you use ammonium acetate for the reduction or MeNH2 gas?


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## Dafunkphenomena

btcboss2022 said:


> Before crystalize you must get the freebase, for freebase I use NaBH4 method and to crystalize the freebase there are a lot of methods.



btcboss2022i assume you are not following the hcl gas route , but im curious, why you cristallize the free-base?


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## Curiousonion

Dafunkphenomena said:


> i assume you are not following the hcl gas route , but im curious, why you cristallize the free-base?



DafunkphenomenaTo make little mdma crystals, if not you just left with a liquid. You need to make it into shards


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## Dafunkphenomena

Curiousonion said:


> To make little mdma crystals, if not you just left with a liquid. You need to make it into shards



Curiousoniontnx friend but this is not my question


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## btcboss2022

Dafunkphenomena said:


> i assume you are not following the hcl gas route , but im curious, why you cristallize the free-base?



DafunkphenomenaI use temperature and freeze acetone.


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## Curiousonion

btcboss2022 said:


> I use temperature and freeze acetone.



btcboss2022For the bicarb wash, do you really need to use 47 liters of water for 5 liters of pmk?
Or do you just wash it enough just to neutralize the acid?


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## Dafunkphenomena

btcboss2022 said:


> I use temperature and freeze acetone.



btcboss2022
i mean that i suppose u are doing alkali-acid extractions , not gassing directly from methanol(or other) after the al/hg amalgam right?
whats the yield of mdma? and final colour?

the glycidate to PMK in large is very easy and just a direct multiplication , but did u tried large scale with the alkali-base-crystallization with good yields?

tnx in advance


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## btcboss2022

Curiousonion said:


> For the bicarb wash, do you really need to use 47 liters of water for 5 liters of pmk?
> Or do you just wash it enough just to neutralize the acid?



CuriousonionIs to wash, neutralize, solve possible salts....


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## btcboss2022

Dafunkphenomena said:


> i mean that i suppose u are doing alkali-acid extractions , not gassing directly from methanol(or other) after the al/hg amalgam right?
> whats the yield of mdma? and final colour?
> 
> the glycidate to PMK in large is very easy and just a direct multiplication , but did u tried large scale with the alkali-base-crystallization with good yields?
> 
> tnx in advance



DafunkphenomenaAmalgam? I think you don't read the info of that post.


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## RA!NER

btcboss2022 said:


> Hello,
> 
> After check and test the methods posted in the thread http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhn...-methyl-pmk-glycidate-conversion-to-pmk.2013/ I decided the post the best method for me:
> 
> 1. Put 47,5 liters of H2O in the reactor and add 2,5kg of sodium bicarbonate, stirring until complete dissolution, take out the mixture and keep it.
> 2. Put in the reactor 7L of H2O
> 3. Add while stirring 1,2kg of sodium hydroxide
> 4. While the H2O and the sodium hydroxide are mixing and getting temp put 5kG of wax PMK to melt by low heat.
> 5. When PMK is melted add it to the reactor and put the mixture at 80C reflux during 1 hour stirring.



btcboss2022
Is it possible to carry out the quantities in the same ratio with 1 litre of water etc.? I have calculated everything in smaller quantities in the same ratio.


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## btcboss2022

RA!NER said:


> Is it possible to carry out the quantities in the same ratio with 1 litre of water etc.? I have calculated everything in smaller quantities in the same ratio.



RA!NERSure.


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## Mr.Blanks00

hello, sorry if this picture is pmk oil, and what is the cas number for pmk oil.


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## btcboss2022

Yusuf said:


> hello, sorry if this picture is pmk oil, and what is the cas number for pmk oil.



YusufFor that synth is
CAS 28578-16-7 wax form​Final product of that synth is CAS 4676-39-5


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## Mr.Blanks00

Ok thank,e friend for information.


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## Dafunkphenomena

btcboss2022 said:


> Amalgam? I think you don't read the info of that post.



btcboss2022of course i did...man im talking about following steps: mdp2p-mdma


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## Curiousonion

How long do the 2 layers take to seperate once it cools down to 25c?


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## btcboss2022

Dafunkphenomena said:


> of course i did...man im talking about following steps: mdp2p-mdma



DafunkphenomenaI what part of the post you see something about any amalgam, I'm totally lost now.


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## btcboss2022

Final "Cola" MDMA ;-)


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## btcboss2022

Today I started the process with same PMK cas but in powder form we will see go it goes I will update you if interested.
Thanks.


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## JJRLL

Yusuf said:


> hello, sorry if this picture is pmk oil, and what is the cas number for pmk oil.



Yusuf28578-16-7


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## Curiousonion

I thought the original process was from powder form. So it was originally from the oil pmk version that you started not the wax powder? (I tried from the wax powder and once cooled down to room temperature the material does not seperate into 2 layers)



btcboss2022 said:


> Today I started the process with same PMK cas but in powder form we will see go it goes I will update you if interested.
> Thanks.



btcboss2022


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## JJRLL

btcboss2022 said:


> Final "Cola" MDMA ;-)



btcboss2022Hey which color is best，white purple or like cola？Thanks


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## Curiousonion

Sorry, meant to say the white powder form.
So there are 3 forms, wax, oil and powder?


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## btcboss2022

JJRLL said:


> Hey which color is best，white purple or like cola？Thanks



JJRLLPure and clean one is transparent.


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## btcboss2022

Curiousonion said:


> Sorry, meant to say the white powder form.
> So there are 3 forms, wax, oil and powder?



Curiousonion2 I think, wax and powder and both get oily heating at low temp.


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## JJRLL

btcboss2022 said:


> Pure and clean one is transparent.



btcboss2022Thanks


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## btcboss2022

IF



Curiousonion said:


> I thought the original process was from powder form. So it was originally from the oil pmk version that you started not the wax powder? (I tried from the wax powder and once cooled down to room temperature the material does not seperate into 2 layers)



Curiousonion If you followed the process step by step you should have 2 layers, explain me point by point what you do exactly


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## Curiousonion

Added h20 with distilled water, while it was warming up melted the powder then added it. 
Refluxed for an hour, then added hcl and refluxed for another hour. 
Stopped reaction, waited for it to cool and seperate.
No separation occurred.


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## btcboss2022

Curiousonion said:


> Added h20 with distilled water, while it was warming up melted the powder then added it.
> Refluxed for an hour, then added hcl and refluxed for another hour.
> Stopped reaction, waited for it to cool and seperate.
> No separation occurred.



CuriousonionH20 with distilled water?;-) 
I Guess is a writing mistake you woukd mean NaOH.
What PH has your mixture now?Seems not enough HCL.


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## Curiousonion

Yeah sorry, Naoh. 
I added the exact amount of hcl as written in the procedure.
Once you add the hcl is start boiling and fuming and when you reach the hcl saturation levels the reaction just settles and changes color to yellowish.


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## btcboss2022

Curiousonion said:


> Yeah sorry, Naoh.
> I added the exact amount of hcl as written in the procedure.
> Once you add the hcl is start boiling and fuming and when you reach the hcl saturation levels the reaction just settles and changes color to yellowish.



CuriousonionWhat is the current PH?


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## Curiousonion

_that I don't know anymore, I did that workup last night and neutralized the acid.
What is the ph supposed to be?
I mixed the reaction with a bicarb solution then seperated it with dcm. That seems to work, dcm with oil goes to the top for some reason._


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## Curiousonion

I will try another reaction now, what is the ph of the final solution after it cools down to 25c supposed to be?


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## btcboss2022

Curiousonion said:


> _that I don't know anymore, I did that workup last night and neutralized the acid.
> What is the ph supposed to be?
> I mixed the reaction with a bicarb solution then seperated it with dcm. That seems to work, dcm with oil goes to the top for some reason._



CuriousonionIs not only about neutralize the acid is about to turns the mixture acid.PH after HCL process must be at least in 2. DCM goes to top?Something is wrong for sure now web must Discover what is.
I did that synth yesterday again and allí smooth like always.


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## Curiousonion

Ok so I will try it again. 
But I followed the exact procedure you wrote.
The dcm with oil in it has that smell that mdma usually has.
I also find it strange that the dcm goes to the top


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## Curiousonion

btcboss2022 said:


> Is not only about neutralize the acid is about to turns the mixture acid.PH after HCL process must be at least in 2. DCM goes to top?Something is wrong for sure now web must Discover what is.
> I did that synth yesterday again and allí smooth like always.



btcboss2022UPDATE:
Tried it again at same ratios provided in original recipe for 333 grams pmk powder.
All ingredients were scaled down. 
Upon adding the HCL to the reflux, waited another half an hour, measures ph, it was slightly above 2. 
Added more hcl until ph was at 2. 
Ended reflux, clear separation occurred.


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## Curiousonion

One question, when the 2 layers seperate the oil looks very nice and clean.
Is the bicarb wash that really necessary? Can't the oil be used as such and impurities washed away when doing crystallization at the end?


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## ChingShih

btcboss2022 said:


> Final "Cola" MDMA ;-)



btcboss2022
How did you get such big rocks of crystal? buchner funnel with vaccuum so the crystals get pressed?
And what was your yield from 1L of mdp2p oil to mdma hcl, how many dried Cola mdma crystals you got from 1l mdp2p?
If you maybe know the dry yield already


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## btcboss2022

Curiousonion said:


> One question, when the 2 layers seperate the oil looks very nice and clean.
> Is the bicarb wash that really necessary? Can't the oil be used as such and impurities washed away when doing crystallization at the end?



CuriousonionIn my opinion is necessary because is not only about impurities the final mixture is too acid so is not good idea to use it directly, the bicarbonate-water washing will remove part of that acid and any future process will be smoother.


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## btcboss2022

ChingShih said:


> How did you get such big rocks of crystal? buchner funnel with vaccuum so the crystals get pressed?
> And what was your yield from 1L of mdp2p oil to mdma hcl, how many dried Cola mdma crystals you got from 1l mdp2p?
> If you maybe know the dry yield already



ChingShihThe crystals are made with normal crystallization process first with acetone and later with water you can find a lot of different techniques for that.
From 1L I got around 900gr.


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## btcboss2022

btcboss2022 said:


> Hello,
> 
> After check and test the methods posted in the thread http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhn...-methyl-pmk-glycidate-conversion-to-pmk.2013/ I decided the post the best method for me:
> 
> 1. Put 47,5 liters of H2O in the reactor and add 2,5kg of sodium bicarbonate, stirring until complete dissolution, take out the mixture and keep it.
> 2. Put in the reactor 7L of H2O
> 3. Add while stirring 1,2kg of sodium hydroxide
> 4. While the H2O and the sodium hydroxide are mixing and getting temp put 5kG of wax PMK to melt by low heat.
> 5. When PMK is melted add it to the reactor and put the mixture at 80C reflux during 1 hour stirring.
> 6. Add 3,25kg of HCL 37% in small portions, once all added keep the mixture at 80C reflux during 1 hour stirring.
> 7. Stop stirring and put the mixture at 25C
> 8. Discard the water top layer.
> 9. Put again in the reactor the oil top layer.
> 10. Add the H2O and sodium bicarbonate mixture, stirring 2-3 minutes.
> 11. Add 10 liters of DCM( from freezer preferably)
> 12. Let it get separated around 10-15 min.
> 13. Evaporate DCM from the bottom layer.
> 
> Yield: 3,72kg of PMK oil



btcboss2022UPDATE:

In big scale step 6 must be done in cold, is very dangerous and slow to make that step in hot.


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## wannabeechemist

I thought refluxing it with HCl was enough. I know it would work with methyl glycidate, but what about ethyl? Is this krapcho decarboxylation?


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## Curiousonion

btcboss2022 said:


> UPDATE:
> 
> In big scale step 6 must be done in cold, is very dangerous and slow to make that step in hot.



btcboss2022Yes you are very very right. let the solution cool down after refluxing with naoh and only then add the hcl and heat it up again to 80c.


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## ChingShih

btcboss2022 said:


> UPDATE:
> 
> In big scale step 6 must be done in cold, is very dangerous and slow to make that step in hot.



btcboss2022
Because HCL starts fuming and volcano style reaction happens? 
Do you think conversion can be made in stainless steel vessel?


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## Curiousonion

ChingShih said:


> Because HCL starts fuming and volcano style reaction happens?
> Do you think conversion can be made in stainless steel vessel?



ChingShihNo hell no, hcl will eat that shit right up.


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## ChingShih

Curiousonion said:


> No hell no, hcl will eat that shit right up.



Curiousonion
So then only option is Big glass flasks or Glass reactor 100l for large scale conversion?
But how are then the big guys doing it? I thought in big stainless steel vessels...


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## Curiousonion

Glass reactors are the best option


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## btcboss2022

Hello,

Stainless steel with acids is impossible forget that.
You can use glass reactor or s316 reactor in the scale that you want depend on your money ;-)


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## btcboss2022

Now I can confirm that CAS 28578-16-7 in powder form is more pure and clean than the wax form, method is exactly the same.
Thanks,


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## Curiousonion

btcboss2022 said:


> Now I can confirm that CAS 28578-16-7 in powder form is more pure and clean than the wax form, method is exactly the same.
> Thanks,



btcboss2022How so, higher yield or what, how do you determine the purity?


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## Curiousonion

I read on another pmk thread that the guy only does bicarb washes and then vacuum distills the remaining water without doing a dcm extraction, what's your opinion on that?



btcboss2022 said:


> Now I can confirm that CAS 28578-16-7 in powder form is more pure and clean than the wax form, method is exactly the same.
> Thanks,



btcboss2022


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## btcboss2022

Curiousonion said:


> I read on another pmk thread that the guy only does bicarb washes and then vacuum distills the remaining water without doing a dcm extraction, what's your opinion on that?



CuriousonionPossible is more work than evaporate only the DCM anyway I dont understand what is the problem with the original synth that you want to change it all time hahah


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## btcboss2022

Curiousonion said:


> How so, higher yield or what, how do you determine the purity?



CuriousonionYes higher yield and purity is about colour, smell...can't determine % of course but higher than wax for sure.


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## Curiousonion

btcboss2022 said:


> Possible is more work than evaporate only the DCM anyway I dont understand what is the problem with the original synth that you want to change it all time hahah



btcboss2022Ah it's because i read on the other pmk thread that uses the exact same method as you do except at the end it does bicarb washes and a water wash and no dcm extraction. 
So I'm just looking at all the methods to try to understand this rxn better


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## Curiousonion

wingroupamarvelio said:


> the picture is not pmk oil， I can supply good pmk oil



wingroupamarvelioOh wow, you can tell a chemical compound just by looking at it and here we are fools trying to figure it out by boiling points, melting points etc.


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## btcboss2022

wingroupamarvelio said:


> the picture is not pmk oil， I can supply good pmk oil



wingroupamarvelioReally? I think I know what is happening here, it's fake PMK, we are producing fake MDMA and everybody is having fake highs possibly these people are actors contracted by the fake PMK supplier to make us continue buying his product!
I see all clear now was evident I'm very stupid to no see it before! 
Thank you wingroupamarvelio I don't know how to thank you enough we are extremely lucky to have you in the forum.


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## btcboss2022

Here is the last batch of the fake MDMA ;-)


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## btcboss2022

btcboss2022 said:


> Here is the last batch of the fake MDMA ;-)



btcboss2022From 1.25kg from PMK oil(from PMK powder form) I got 1.3kg of final stuff.


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## Curiousonion

what method do you use to transform the pmk oil into mdma freebase? (If you dont mind sharing) thats a fantastic yield.


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## ChingShih

btcboss2022 said:


> Here is the last batch of the fake MDMA ;-)



btcboss2022
Thanks for update btcboss2022 - looks nice
You have any pictures when the crystals are dry? Do they become more transparent brown - or they stay dark like on this picture?
And last question, How did you calculate the ratios of other reagents (methanol, Nabh4, Methylamine, Naoh) if using 1.25kg of pmk oil?


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## btcboss2022

Curiousonion said:


> what method do you use to transform the pmk oil into mdma freebase? (If you dont mind sharing) thats a fantastic yield.



Curiousonion


http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhni37ybtt7mkbjyxn2pgllzxf2qgyd.onion/threads/methamphetamine-synthesis-from-p2p-by-nabh4-reduction-medium-scale.600/#post-9603



All details in my post of that thread.


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## btcboss2022

ChingShih said:


> Thanks for update btcboss2022 - looks nice
> You have any pictures when the crystals are dry? Do they become more transparent brown - or they stay dark like on this picture?
> And last question, How did you calculate the ratios of other reagents (methanol, Nabh4, Methylamine, Naoh) if using 1.25kg of pmk oil?



ChingShihHello I will make new pics but color is more or less the same, I can do it completely transparent and crystalline but people demand this color I will never understand this but they rule.
They want "cola" they have "cola" ;-) 
About ratios you can take it from my post in that thread:


http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhni37ybtt7mkbjyxn2pgllzxf2qgyd.onion/threads/methamphetamine-synthesis-from-p2p-by-nabh4-reduction-medium-scale.600/#post-9603


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## ChingShih

btcboss2022 said:


> Hello I will make new pics but color is more or less the same, I can do it completely transparent and crystalline but people demand this color I will never understand this but they rule.
> They want "cola" they have "cola" ;-)
> About ratios you can take it from my post in that thread:
> 
> 
> http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhni37ybtt7mkbjyxn2pgllzxf2qgyd.onion/threads/methamphetamine-synthesis-from-p2p-by-nabh4-reduction-medium-scale.600/#post-9603



btcboss2022
Thank you again for clarification 
I see people are the same everywhere, you offer them purity they want the impure junk, it's the same everywhere


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## luckyboy888

btcboss2022 said:


> Hello,
> 
> After check and test the methods posted in the thread http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhn...-methyl-pmk-glycidate-conversion-to-pmk.2013/ I decided the post the best method for me:
> 
> 1. Put 47,5 liters of H2O in the reactor and add 2,5kg of sodium bicarbonate, stirring until complete dissolution, take out the mixture and keep it.
> 2. Put in the reactor 7L of H2O
> 3. Add while stirring 1,2kg of sodium hydroxide
> 4. While the H2O and the sodium hydroxide are mixing and getting temp put 5kG of wax PMK to melt by low heat.
> 5. When PMK is melted add it to the reactor and put the mixture at 80C reflux during 1 hour stirring.
> 6. Add 3,25kg of HCL 37% in small portions, once all added keep the mixture at 80C reflux during 1 hour stirring.
> 7. Stop stirring and put the mixture at 25C
> 8. Discard the water top layer.
> 9. Put again in the reactor the oil top layer.
> 10. Add the H2O and sodium bicarbonate mixture, stirring 2-3 minutes.
> 11. Add 10 liters of DCM( from freezer preferably)
> 12. Let it get separated around 10-15 min.
> 13. Evaporate DCM from the bottom layer.
> 
> Yield: 3,72kg of PMK oil



btcboss2022
how many pmk-glycidate beginning?


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## Curiousonion

btcboss2022 said:


> http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhni37ybtt7mkbjyxn2pgllzxf2qgyd.onion/threads/methamphetamine-synthesis-from-p2p-by-nabh4-reduction-medium-scale.600/#post-9603
> 
> 
> 
> All details in my post of that thread.



btcboss2022Thanks man, I was really searching for that method but could only find the methylamine gas route. This one seems much easier and safer.


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## Curiousonion

btcboss2022 said:


> http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhni37ybtt7mkbjyxn2pgllzxf2qgyd.onion/threads/methamphetamine-synthesis-from-p2p-by-nabh4-reduction-medium-scale.600/#post-9603
> 
> 
> 
> All details in my post of that thread.



btcboss2022That method is for methamphetamine synthesis which is sensitive to water. 
Since you are making mdma base I don't think the reaction needs to be kept anhydrous so the addition of the dessicant is not necessary. 
Any one has any opinions on this?


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## btcboss2022

luckyboy888 said:


> how many pmk-glycidate beginning?



luckyboy888???I think you didn't read carefully the text, 5kg mate!;-)


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## btcboss2022

Curiousonion said:


> That method is for methamphetamine synthesis which is sensitive to water.
> Since you are making mdma base I don't think the reaction needs to be kept anhydrous so the addition of the dessicant is not necessary.
> Any one has any opinions on this?



CuriousonionHello,

Is totally necessary is not about meth or mdma is about amine production in a water free reaction. With water inside this mixture the amine won't be produced correctly but anyway always you can test it yourself ;-)
Thanks.


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## btcboss2022

btcboss2022 said:


> Hello I will make new pics but color is more or less the same, I can do it completely transparent and crystalline but people demand this color I will never understand this but they rule.
> They want "cola" they have "cola" ;-)
> About ratios you can take it from my post in that thread:
> 
> 
> http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhni37ybtt7mkbjyxn2pgllzxf2qgyd.onion/threads/methamphetamine-synthesis-from-p2p-by-nabh4-reduction-medium-scale.600/#post-9603



btcboss2022Clean one before crystalize, after crystallization is even more clean ;-)


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## btcboss2022

btcboss2022 said:


> Hello,
> 
> Is totally necessary is not about meth or mdma is about amine production in a water free reaction. With water inside this mixture the amine won't be produced correctly but anyway always you can test it yourself ;-)
> Thanks.



btcboss2022Sorry is imine production not amine haahah


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## luckyboy888

btcboss2022 said:


> Clean one before crystalize, after crystallization is even more clean ;-)



btcboss2022
sir
Could you please make an example of the steps after getting the oil what method to apply after getting the oil to get the ''cola'' mdma


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## Selassi

Totally different question about this conversion... Hope u have an answer



Swim is going to do this conversion but his ptfe stirring rods for mixing havent arrived yet. 

Can he for once stir with a 316 steel stirrer for once maybe for 1.5 hr? I know the hcl eats away the 316 but doesnt matter if its trash afterwards. 

Does the steel which is solved by the hcl during the conversion impact or influence the conversion itself? 

Or maybe colorchanges to the oil? 



Swim needs to do thr conversion and cant wait untill thr ptfe stirring rods arrive...



Maybe someone has an alternative option?


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## G.Patton

Selassi said:


> Does the steel which is solved by the hcl during the conversion impact or influence the conversion itself?



SelassiI think it has influence, but it is negligible.


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## Selassi

Thats what i think too, its only 1,5hrs and the hcl is very diluted with water and there is also caustic to neutralize a part. 
Its not like with 5449 that needs 5 hrs with stronger solutions

But if someone has xp with this let me know, swim starts saturday conversion


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## Selassi

Swim already succeeded the testconversion on phosphoric acid with 500gr of 28578


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## ChingShih

Selassi said:


> Swim already succeeded the testconversion on phosphoric acid with 500gr of 28578



Selassi
If i see correctly yield is somewhere between 350-370ml from 500g starting material?
Starting material was powder or wax oil?


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## Selassi

White powder starting material was this test, i also have sample from yellow waxy lumpy powder. 
Swim will do a small testconversion tomorrow also on phosphoric acid...


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## ChingShih

Selassi said:


> White powder starting material was this test, i also have sample from yellow waxy lumpy powder.
> Swim will do a small testconversion tomorrow also on phosphoric acid...



Selassi
Thanks very much for answers
Can you tell me what was temperature and time when converting it with phosphoric acid? 
What was your ratio of reagents, if you could write down your synthesis in few steps it would be very nice contribution to community


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## Selassi

1kg P
1kg water
150gr NaOH

Mix and melt at 85/90 for 1hr

450gr Phos and again 1,5hr at 85/90

After should be immediate separation from the layers


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## Curiousonion

Selassi said:


> 1kg P
> 1kg water
> 150gr NaOH
> 
> Mix and melt at 85/90 for 1hr
> 
> 450gr Phos and again 1,5hr at 85/90
> 
> After should be immediate separation from the layers



SelassiAfter this do you neutralize it with a bicarb solution and extract with dcm or use it as such?


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## Selassi

Yes washing after is prefferable as the oil is going to contain less contaminants. 
But ye i also know people who just yank the oil straight into the reactionvessel after conversion.


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## Curiousonion

Ah ok, so you just do a bicarb wash or also a dcm extraction?
I noticed after the bicarb wash it looks grainy and once you extract it with dcm and evaporate it you get a pure oil


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## btcboss2022

Selassi said:


> White powder starting material was this test, i also have sample from yellow waxy lumpy powder.
> Swim will do a small testconversion tomorrow also on phosphoric acid...



SelassiBoth have the same behaviour but powder is more clean or pure if you prefer ;-)


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## Selassi

I also hear the yellow waxy one has less yield, but we will see after test


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## Bennyboy88

Selassi said:


> Swim already succeeded the testconversion on phosphoric acid with 500gr of 28578



SelassiThe powder u had was white or yellowish in color I notice the separation of the oil is flowing on top. Is that because u used phos acid???.


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## btcboss2022

G.Patton said:


> *Reaction scheme:*
> View attachment 7369



G.PattonHello,

Ratio, temperature and timing of NaHCO3 route please?
Thanks.


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## G.Patton

btcboss2022 said:


> Hello,
> 
> Ratio, temperature and timing of NaHCO3 route please?
> Thanks.



btcboss2022These are already written in your post, I just added scheme in order to improve and clarify information.


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## Bennyboy88

If phos acid will works. Woukd citrus acid can work too. Any comments anyone.


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## G.Patton

Bennyboy88 said:


> If phos acid will works. Woukd citrus acid can work too. Any comments anyone.



Bennyboy88Citric acid is weak, I'm not sure that it will work


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## btcboss2022

Hello,

Here is my last achievement make it to crystallize naturally in the molecular form of the crystal itself. More pure impossible!! ;-)
Seems handmade but trust me are naturally formed!


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## ChingShih

btcboss2022 said:


> Hello,
> 
> Here is my last achievement make it to crystallize naturally in the molecular form of the crystal itself. More pure impossible!! ;-)
> Seems handmade but trust me are naturally formed!



btcboss2022
What is this? Mdma Hcl ?


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## btcboss2022

ChingShih said:


> What is this? Mdma Hcl ?



ChingShihOf course


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## ChingShih

btcboss2022 said:


> Of course



btcboss2022
Never seen such pure mdma thats why i ask, nice


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## btcboss2022

ChingShih said:


> Never seen such pure mdma thats why i ask, nice



ChingShihMe either until now ;-)


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## Gale

One of my very early synths, back when it only made sense to make product of this purity, but not very many people appreciate it for what it is..sadly.

This was back before when I did synths for a passion, being locked in labs told to make purple shit was whack.


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## Bennyboy88

Well done btcboss2022. Nicest crystal I seen.


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## Gale

MDMA HCl -monohydrate 
I moved towards making the anhydrous form, not as pretty but still similar looks


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## Bennyboy88

btcboss2022 said:


> Hello,
> 
> Here is my last achievement make it to crystallize naturally in the molecular form of the crystal itself. More pure impossible!! ;-)
> Seems handmade but trust me are naturally formed!



btcboss2022What method of crystallization you use to achieve these beauty. Do you mind sharing your method. Thx


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## Gale

I call these healing stones, for anyone wondering I used Dh20 and a gravity separation method I learned a while back inspired by JOR.

MDMA from 28578 yields a more dark brown or light yellow crystals via al/hg gassed


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## btcboss2022

Bennyboy88 said:


> What method of crystallization you use to achieve these beauty. Do you mind sharing your method. Thx



Bennyboy88Temp+Freeze Acetone+72hours freezer/Filter+water+temp+48 hours RT


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## Bennyboy88

btcboss2022 said:


> Temp+Freeze Acetone+72hours freezer/Filter+water+temp+48 hours



btcboss2022What is the ratio of freebase:acetone. Your filtered starting powder have to be very clean in order to get clear crystal like at the end correct. Thx


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## btcboss2022

Bennyboy88 said:


> What is the ratio of freebase:acetone. Your filtered starting powder have to be very clean in order to get clear crystal like at the end correct. Thx



Bennyboy88Hello freebase:acetone ratio is 1:10, I dont filtered the starting powder what you mean exactly?
Thanks.


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## Bennyboy88

btcboss2022 said:


> Hello freebase:acetone ratio is 1:10, I dont filtered the starting powder what you mean exactly?
> Thanks.



btcboss2022With 1:10 ratio. The filtered product should be very clean. 

The powder I was referring to is the fine crystal from the freezing actone mixture. Then use these filtered crystal and melt with h20 again. Correct. Thx.


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## btcboss2022

Bennyboy88 said:


> With 1:10 ratio. The filtered product should be very clean.
> 
> The powder I was referring to is the fine crystal from the freezing actone mixture. Then use these filtered crystal and melt with h20 again. Correct. Thx.



Bennyboy88Hello,

I got very small amount of powder after crystallizing in acetone are mostly big crystal pieces and I filter them yes.


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## tajira

Hey did anybody tried [email protected] for PMK? is it reliable?


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## Zarder

Hi, so the method described in the beginning of this thread does work? And does one vacuum distill the ketone to purify afterwards? Is this necessary?


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## Zarder

What about the enol that remains?


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## G.Patton

Zarder said:


> Hi, so the method described in the beginning of this thread does work? And does one vacuum distill the ketone to purify afterwards? Is this necessary?



ZarderHi, yes, it is still here by reason that it works. Yes, it worth to distill before further synthesis.


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## Katty Korner

I think someone asked this, but I didn't see a reply. Can the amount of water be reduced in the initial step, with all other ratios staying the same? And can one use diethyl ether in place of dcm for all uses of dcm here?


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## btcboss2022

Katty Korner said:


> I think someone asked this, but I didn't see a reply. Can the amount of water be reduced in the initial step, with all other ratios staying the same? And can one use diethyl ether in place of dcm for all uses of dcm here?



Katty KornerHello,

If you reduce the water amount possibly the oil will be less clean about replace DCM by Ether no problem.


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## Katty Korner

btcboss2022 said:


> Hello,
> 
> If you reduce the water amount possibly the oil will be less clean about replace DCM by Ether no problem.



btcboss2022Thank you! I doubt I'd ever go at this scale, but I'd probably just clean it up with the bisulfite addiction, I believe that works with ketones.


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## joejoe

btcboss2022 said:


> 1. Put 47,5 liters of H2O in the reactor and add 2,5kg of sodium bicarbonate, stirring until complete dissolution, take out the mixture and keep it.



btcboss2022Hello,does put 47 mean is adding aluminum?What is the serving size?


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## Hank Schrader

For many years we have been engaged in the production of phenylethylamines.
MDMA - high purity and no impurities.
We get the substituted ketone from methyl glycidate.
We use several technologies in the production of MDMA.
The resulting ketone after the hydrolysis of glycidate, we fractionally distill under vacuum.
The purified ketone is mixed with methylamine and dried from the formed water. The resulting imine is reduced to amine.
We select the base and distill fractionally under vacuum.
All substances that are chasing to the desired temperature are discarded. The desired fraction is collected and neutralized in ether with trimethylchlorosilane.
The resulting salt is filtered on centrifuges and washed with chemical grade acetone.
After that, it is filtered again, dried and crystallization is formed on the basis of mixtures of alcohols.
The recovered crystals are washed again with ether to dry quickly.
A cycle of 4 days allows you to get from 50 kg of finished MDMA.
We are always ready to cooperate with manufacturers and wholesale buyers.
We can guarantee the quality of our products and services.


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## Hank Schrader

As we can see, 1 cycle I have 31 liters of MD ketone with a total weight of ~ 37.5 kg
The next photo is a filtered MDMA salt.
The next photo is the vacuum drying of an MDMA crystal.
And the crystal after drying.
As a result, we get a snow-white crystal of MDMA hydrochloride with a yield of 40-43KG, which by moles is more than 85-90%+ yield for ketone.


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## Hank Schrader

Hank Schrader said:


> As we can see, 1 cycle I have 31 liters of MD ketone with a total weight of ~ 37.5 kg
> The next photo is a filtered MDMA salt.
> The next photo is the vacuum drying of an MDMA crystal.
> And the crystal after drying.
> As a result, we get a snow-white crystal of MDMA hydrochloride with a yield of 40-43KG, which by moles is more than 85-90%+ yield for ketone.



Hank Schrader...


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## CryptedMind

btcboss2022 said:


> Hello,
> 
> After check and test the methods posted in the thread http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhn...-methyl-pmk-glycidate-conversion-to-pmk.2013/ I decided the post the best method for me:
> 
> 1. Put 47,5 liters of H2O in the reactor and add 2,5kg of sodium bicarbonate, stirring until complete dissolution, take out the mixture and keep it.
> 2. Put in the reactor 7L of H2O
> 3. Add while stirring 1,2kg of sodium hydroxide
> 4. While the H2O and the sodium hydroxide are mixing and getting temp put 5kG of wax PMK to melt by low heat.
> 5. When PMK is melted add it to the reactor and put the mixture at 80 °C reflux during 1 hour stirring.
> 6. Add 3,25kg of HCL 37% in small portions, once all added keep the mixture at 80 °C reflux during 1 hour stirring.
> 7. Stop stirring and put the mixture at 25 °C.
> 8. Discard the water top layer.
> 9. Put again in the reactor the oil top layer.
> 10. Add the H2O and sodium bicarbonate mixture, stirring 2-3 minutes.
> 11. Add 10 liters of DCM (from freezer preferably).
> 12. Let it get separated around 10-15 min.
> 13. Evaporate DCM from the bottom layer.
> 
> PMK oil (MDP2P; cas 4676-39-5) yield is 3,72kg.



btcboss2022
hello again , just to be sure, i need a more extense explanation in couple points, i was using with success the Fring metod, the one you mention here with a link, and yours there are a thing i need to be sure before to try/loss something, so:

in the finalm step, he just wash with NAOH and the remaining oil is vacuum distilled to get rid of the water in it , but you instead, add DCM, so the question is, i assume thats an extraction in the DCM , then you distill to get pure oil, right? i mean the oil goes to the DCM, a normal extraction?

so the step is , instead to wash with naoh, and discard the water layer, then distill to get rid of water, after you wash with bicarbonate, YOU DONT SEPARATE ANY LAYER? YOU JUST ADD DCM, THEN KEEP THIS DCM LAYER TO DISTILL AFTER? i think i understood, and sounds logicall, but i prefeer to read it from you , please let me know....


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