# Amphetamine synthesis from P2NP via Al/Hg (video)



## HIGGS BOSSON

Your browser is not able to display this video.


Download Video






Amphetamine synthesis from P2NP via Al/Hg (video)



__ HEISENBERG
__ May 27, 2022
__ 5
__
adderall
amphetamine
amphetamine synthesis
amphetamine video
amphetamines
amphetamines salts
cas 300-62-9
cas 705-60-2
p2np
video synthesis




https://bbgate.com/threads/synthesis-of-amphetamine-from-p2np-via-al-hg-video.196/















Your browser is not able to display this video.


Download Video






Alphamethylphenethylamine (amphetamine) synthesis



__ Novator
__ Sep 27, 2022
__ 3
__
adderall
amphetamine
amphetamine salts
amphetamine synthesis
amphetamine video
cas 300-62-9
cas 705-60-2
p2np
phenethylamines
video synthesis




479Mb (.mp4)
Reductive amination of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene to α-methylphenethylamine by...


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

*In the video synthesis of **amphetamine**, reagents are used:*

10 g 1-Phenyl-2-nitropropene (P2NP);
100 ml Isopropyl alcohol (IPA);
50 ml Glacial acetic acid (AcOH);
50 g Sodium hydroxide (NaOH);
12 g Aluminium (in the form of sliced household foil);
0.1g Mercury (II) nitrate (Hg(NO3)2);
2 ml Sulphuric acid (H2SO4);
50 ml Acetone;
Distilled water;
*Equipment and* *glassware**:*

Flat bottom flask 2 L;
Retort stand and clamp for securing apparatus (optional);
Reflux condenser;
Funnel;
Sieve filter (kitchen grade is ok);
Syringe or Pasteur pipette;
pH indicator papers;
Beakers (600 mL x2, 2 L, 1 L, 100 mL x2);
Vacuum source;
Laboratory scale (0.1-200 g is suitable);
Measuring cylinders 1000 mL and 100 mL;
Cold water bath;
Glass rod and spatula;
Separatory funnel 1 L (optional);
Laboratory grade thermometer; 
Buchner flask and funnel; 
Filter paper;




​
*Description of amphetamine synthesis video.*
A solution of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene 10 g in 100 ml of isopropyl alcohol and 50 ml of acetic acid is prepared before the synthesis start. Also, an aluminium foil 12 g is cut into small pieces with a paper shredder for an aluminium amalgam preparation. It can be cut with scissors or torn by hands (in gloves).

*0:04-0:40* - An aqueous alkali solution of preparation. This solution was made in advance so that the solution has room temperature by the main reaction mixture alkalization time in this video. The alkalinization is carried out with a spontaneous heating. If a fresh hot aq alkali solution is used, then the temperature is risen higher and a reaction mass forced cooling will be required.

*0:46-2:36* - Amalgam with mercury nitrate. Amalgamated aluminium will reduce 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene to amphetamine. A small amount of gas is evolved during the amalgamation reaction, a grey precipitate is formed. It is important not to miss the moment when the aluminium amalgam is ready. This moment can be determined by a grey precipitate formation and by an increased gas evolution. It happens in 10-15 minutes from reaction start.

The water is drained without a gauze removing, the amalgamated aluminium is washed with two portions of cold distilled water. It is worth to pay attention to a gas bubbles releasing. It is noticed that bubbles are smaller and liquid color is darker in a "correct" amalgam. If the reaction is violent, bubbles are large and the color is light, the amalgam is "incorrect". This is almost certainly due to a lack of mercury salt. Please note that mercury salts are poisonous.

*2:37-4:28* - The most important part of the process is 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene reduction by aluminium amalgam. The reaction is exothermic and carried out with an abundant heat releasing. It is necessary to carefully control the temperature during the procedure. Reaction flask is cooled in an ice bath in case of overheating. It is allowed to add cold water into the flask. Sometimes the reaction isn't started, it is necessary to warm the reaction mass thoroughly and the reaction is started (with a properly prepared amalgam). Smells of a boiling alcohol and acetic acid are released during reaction. Allihn reflux condenser is used for a vapors capturing. The efficiency of Allihn reflux condenser can be increased by a running cold water, which can be connected to it.

*5:04* - The reaction flask can be rinsed with a small amount of alcohol and unredacted aluminium can be rinsed with it as well for collecting residues and increasing the yield.

*5:13* - There should be little unreacted aluminium left. You can determine an amount of reacted 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene by the residues.

*5:16-6:13* - Alkalinization. The reaction is conducted with a heat releasing. The remains of unredacted aluminium will additionally react with alkali and heat the mixture as well as create by-products.
A separation into visible layers occurs within 30 minutes after alkalinization. The pH of the top layer should be 11-12.

*6:18-7:23* - Decantation. Collect the top layer with amphetamine base in alcohol. It can be dried by a small amount of anhydrous magnesium sulfate. The slag can be extracted with a non-polar solvent (ether, benzene, toluene), then a solvent is evaporated.

*7:24-8:50* - Preparation of the sulphuric acid solution in acetone. This solution is necessary for smoother acidification. If concentrated sulphuric acid is used, local over-acidification of the product is happened. Hence, the yield is dropping.

*8:51-10:53* - Product acidification and amphetamine sulfate obtaining. To the upper yellow layer, which was collected at the previous stage, a prepared solution of sulphuric acid is added dropwise. Flakes of salt are formed with each drop of acid solution. This stage is very important, it is necessary to carefully control pH to avoid over-acidification. Acidification is continued until pH 5.5-6. The over-acidified product has pinkish color. The product will be spoiled in case of a total over-acidification.

*10:55-11:38* - Amphetamine sulfate filtration from solvents in a Buchner funnel under vacuum. The product can be additionally rinsed with cold acetone at this stage by pouring it through Buchner funnel with the amphetamine sulphate cake.

*11:41-12:28 *- Filtration using improvised tools. Any thick fabric can be used as a filter. The resulting product is dried in a warm dry place for several hours to remove residual solvents. It is recommended to store it in a vacuum package.

*The yield is 60-70%.*​


----------



## Bill Gates

What do you think about using ethyl acetate instead of acetic acid to reduce phenylnitropropene?


----------



## William Dampier

Bill Gates said:


> What do you think about using ethyl acetate instead of acetic acid to reduce phenylnitropropene?



Bill GatesIt can be used, especially technical grade ethyl acetate because it contains alcohol and acetic acid if it was not additionally purified in production.


----------



## rickyrick

Hi,is it viable to scale it up?What kind of reaction vessel would be needed to handle the exothermic reaction and what kind of condenser?overhead stirring maybe?Means of cooling?You are a boss for this video tho.Thanks.


----------



## William Dampier

Yes, overhead stirring, maybe. You can use plastic barrels for this reaction, using water cooling "barrel in barrel" system.


----------



## rickyrick

William Dampier said:


> yes, overhead stirring maybe. U can use a plastic barrels for this reation, using water cooling "barrel in barrel" system



William DampierDoes it need reflux condenser then?Or sealed hermeticaly?Pressure release of some kind?Thank you very much for your answer.


----------



## William Dampier

Without a reflux condenser, we will deal with the evaporation of alcohol. If the precipitate turns into a stone, add pure alcohol to the reaction again. Fully sealed barrel is not suitable, as we will deal with strongly increasing pressure


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

Unfortunately, this reaction scales with a loss in yields. Optimally, I was able to load 100 g of phenyl nitro propene in a 20 L flask, with cooling in a basin with ice water, the solution of p2np in amalgam was added in 3 portions.


----------



## rickyrick

thanks for your answers guys.What amount of P2NP would be able to get reacted in a 200l barrel with good cooling and constant overhead stirring?Do you think it is viable due to loss in yields?


----------



## William Dampier

Max quantity what I know was 2,5 kg P2NP per this reaction, but need good control for temperature. Gradual scaling of the reaction - the best choice. With any problems with scaling, it is better to solve them on smaller quantities. We can help on this path, with feedback.


----------



## William Dampier

You can use radiant floor tubing and cold water for chilling. Tubes twist the spirals inside the barrel and let the flowing cold water, when necessary. And when necessary, let the hot water for heating. Plastic tube does not react with mixture. For overhead stirrer, you need polypropylene shaft or teflon coating


----------



## rickyrick

William Dampier said:


> U can use radiant floor tubing and cold water for chilling. Tubes twist the spirals inside the barrel and let the flowing cold water, when necessary. And when necessary, let the hot water for heating. Plastic tube does not react with mixture. For overhead stirrer u need polypropylene shaft or teflon coating



William DampierAny special type of plastic tubing that can handle the heat from reaction and cold/hot stress?Thank you sensei.


----------



## William Dampier

rickyrick said:


> Any special type of plastic tubing that can handle the heat from reaction and cold/hot stress?Thank you sensei.



rickyrickHDPE or HDPP marks well suited for most of our tasks


----------



## cyb3r0

video not open plz reload video
thank you


----------



## HEISENBERG

cyb3r0 said:


> video not open plz reload video
> thank you



cyb3r0http://chemforum.info/data/video/0/582-82d9b86b01560ce17d310f3fd2a79ca9.mp4


----------



## HEISENBERG

There are no problems with watching the video


----------



## Xiaoyan

what about the orange speed? i have a chemical recipe. supposedly the same products, but when precipitate is occurring, it came in pink color (during boiling) and orange when its cold.
anyone knows some about that?


----------



## HEISENBERG

Xiaoyan said:


> what about the orange speed? i have a chemical recipe. supposedly the same products, but when precipitate is occurring, it came in pink color (during boiling) and orange when its cold.
> anyone knows some about that?



XiaoyanRose - the product is overoxidized (part of the amphetamine salt, due to the overuse of acid, turned into decomposition products and colored the rest of the powder).
Yellow - the product is not oxidized (due to a lack of acid, not all of the base was converted into salt, and its residues colored the rest of the powder).
Red - phenyl nitropropene did not react completely on amalgam, the reaction mixture was alkalized and acidified into salt, giving this color.
Green - mercury salts are contaminated with other metals, which result in color. In addition, it affects the formation of amalgam.
Brown - formation of resins during synthesis.

Study this thread http://chemforum.info/index.php?threads/amphetamine-assessment-protocol.349/


----------



## Xiaoyan

Wow... i have no words.
really thanks
im really interested in doing the synthesis, if i can found all i need.... ;P
do you have any advice for this amateur chemist?
first of all, thanks


----------



## HEISENBERG

Xiaoyan said:


> if i can found all i need.... ;P
> do you have any advice for this amateur chemist?
> first of all, thanks



XiaoyanYou can voice the problems that stand in the way of success. And we will try to find a solution together.


----------



## Kai

thanks for the video it was quite enlightening to bad my crappy network speed made it watching this a nightmare


----------



## HEISENBERG

Kai said:


> thanks for the video it was quite enlightening to bad my crappy network speed made it watching this a nightmare



KaiVideo instructions are very convenient for those who are just taking their first steps. For more experienced chemists, simple instructions are sufficient. You can download this video.


----------



## Xiaoyan

HEISENBERG said:


> You can voice the problems that stand in the way of success. And we will try to find a solution together.



HEISENBERGyes, i willi try.
my english is very poor, soit might take a while to answer
first i want to ask about P2PN
where can i find a trusted seller?
(dont know if can i do this question here, if i cant, tell me to erase it please)


----------



## HEISENBERG

Xiaoyan said:


> yes, i willi try.
> my english is very poor, soit might take a while to answer
> first i want to ask about P2PN
> where can i find a trusted seller?
> (dont know if can i do this question here, if i cant, tell me to erase it please)



XiaoyanCreate ticket

Our experts can help you solve problems


----------



## Xiaoyan

HEISENBERG said:


> Create ticket
> 
> Our experts can help you solve problems



HEISENBERGwhere can i ask for it?


----------



## HEISENBERG

Xiaoyan said:


> where can i ask for it?



Xiaoyanhttp://chemforum.info/index.php?tickets/create


----------



## Hans-Dietrich

Xiaoyan said:


> first i want to ask about P2PN
> where can i find a trusted seller?



XiaoyanNowhere.

It is an exclusively criminal product. Try to synthesize yourself. This is not difficult. Instructions are here.


----------



## cyb3r0

welcome
My friend in the video, specifically this picture in the bag, says that it is sodium hydroxide and it is in the form of crystals, and the hydroxide I have is liquid. Can you explain this point to me?





The second thing, is p2np here, the topic in the video is powder, crystals or liquid, and if it is liquid, how was it converted from crystals to liquid or powder, thank you


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

Sodium hydroxide initially has a crystalline structure. Next, an alkali solution is made from it by adding water. Phenylnitropropene is also a powder, but for this reaction make its solution in isopropyl alcohol and acetic acid. Before the start of the synthesis, the laboratory assistant prepared a solution of 10 g of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene in 100 ml of isopropyl alcohol and 50 ml of acetic acid.
0:04-0:40 - Preparation of an aqueous solution of alkali. In this video, it was made in advance so that the solution cools down by the time the main reaction mixture alkalizes. Alkalinization proceeds with the release of heat, and if a fresh hot alkali solution is used, then the exothermic will be more pronounced and forced cooling of the reaction mass will be required.


----------



## tankikan

Hans-Dietrich said:


> Nowhere.
> 
> It is an exclusively criminal product. Try to synthesize yourself. This is not difficult. Instructions are here.



Hans-DietrichHi. Do you mind to provide the exact link for my refference to synthesize the p2pn? Sorry noob request here. Just afraid i'm referring to the wrong post later. Thanks in advance.


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

tankikan said:


> Hi. Do you mind to provide the exact link for my refference to synthesize the p2pn? Sorry noob request here. Just afraid i'm referring to the wrong post later. Thanks in advance.



tankikanhttp://chemforum.info/index.php?thr...nyl-2-nitropropene-100-1000g-scale-mw-syn.52/


----------



## salaubry

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> *In the video synthesis of amphetamine, reagents are used:*
> 10 g 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene;
> 100 ml isopropyl alcohol;
> 50 ml glacial acetic acid;
> 50 g sodium hydroxide;
> 12 g aluminium (in the form of sliced household foil);
> 0.1g mercury nitrate;
> 2 ml sulphuric acid;
> 50 ml acetone.
> 
> *Description of amphetamine synthesis video.*
> Before the start of the synthesis, the laboratory assistant prepared a solution of 10 g of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene in 100 ml of isopropyl alcohol and 50 ml of acetic acid. Also, for the aluminium amalgam, 12 g of household aluminium foil was prepared, which was cut into small pieces with a paper shredder. It can be cut with scissors or torn by hand.
> 
> 0:04-0:40 - Preparation of an aqueous solution of alkali. In this video, it was made in advance so that the solution cools down by the time the main reaction mixture alkalizes. Alkalinization proceeds with the release of heat, and if a fresh hot alkali solution is used, then the exothermic will be more pronounced and forced cooling of the reaction mass will be required.
> 
> 0:46-2:36 - Amalgam of mercury nitrate. Amalgamated aluminium will reduce 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene to amphetamine. During the amalgamation reaction: little gas evolves, a grey precipitate is formed. It is important not to miss the moment when the aluminium is ready: this can be determined by the formation of a grey precipitate and by the increased gas evolution; this happens in 10-15 minutes after the load.
> The water is drained without removing the gauze, the amalgamated aluminium is washed with two portions of cold water. It is worth paying attention to the release of gas bubbles: it is noticed that with the "correct" amalgam, these bubbles are small, and the colour of the liquid is darker; if the bubbles are large and the colour is light, and the reaction looks violent, the amalgam is bad. This is almost certainly due to a lack of mercury salt. Please note that mercury salts are poisonous.
> 
> 2:37-4:28 - The most important part of the process is the reduction of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene on aluminium amalgam. The reaction is exothermic, proceeds with abundant heat release. During the process, it is necessary to carefully monitor the temperature, in case of excessive overheating, to cool in an ice bath, it is allowed to add cold water to the flask. There are cases when the reaction does not start, in which case it is necessary to warm the reaction mass thoroughly, and with a properly prepared amalgam, the reaction begins. The reaction proceeds with the release of the smell of a boiling alcohol and acetic acid mixture. To capture vapours, a spherical irrigation condenser is used, the efficiency of which can be increased by connecting running cold water to it or simply pouring cold water into.
> 
> 5:04 - You can rinse the flask with a little alcohol and rinse the unreacted aluminium with it to collect residues and increase the yield.
> 
> 5:13 - There should be little unreacted aluminium left. By the residues, you can determine the amount of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene reacted.
> 
> 5:16-6:13 - Alkalinization. The reaction proceeds with the release of heat. The remains of unreacted aluminium will additionally enter into reaction with alkali and heat the mixture, as well as create by-products.
> In the process of allowing the mixture to rest after alkalinization, separation into visible layers occurs within 30 minutes. The pH of the top layer should be 11-12.
> 
> 6:18-7:23 - Decantation: collect the top layer containing amphetamine base in alcohol. It can be dried a little with anhydrous magnesium sulfate, and the slag can be additionally extracted with a non-polar solvent (ether, benzene, toluene), the solvent is then evaporated.
> 
> 7:24-8:50 - Preparing a solution of sulphuric acid in acetone. It is made softer acidification of the product to be smoother. If concentrated sulphuric acid is used, there may be local over-acidification of the product.
> 
> 8:51-10:53 - Product acidification - obtaining amphetamine sulfate. To the upper yellow layer collected at the previous stage, a prepared solution of sulphuric acid is added dropwise. Flakes of salt will form with each drop. This stage is very important, it is necessary to carefully monitor the pH, avoiding over-acidification. Acidification is continued until pH 5.5-6 (neutral). The over-acidified product will be pinkish in colour. In case of global over-acidification, the product will be lost.
> 
> 10:55-11:38 - Filtration of amphetamine sulfate from solvents in a Buchner funnel under vacuum. At this stage, the product can be additionally rinsed with cold acetone by pouring it through the funnel with the substance.
> 
> 11:41-12:28 Filtration using improvised means. Any thick fabric can be used as a filter.
> The resulting product is dried in a warm dry place for several hours to remove residual solvents. It is recommended to store it in a vacuum package.
> 
> The yield is 60-70%.if I halve the ingredients



HIGGS BOSSON


----------



## salaubry

Some problem if I halve the ingredients of the recipe in a one liter flat bottom flask?


----------



## William Dampier

salaubry said:


> Some problem if I halve the ingredients of the recipe in a one liter flat bottom flask?



salaubry10 g can be in a 1 L flask if the reaction is controlled, but hard.


----------



## William Dampier

ArsoleDickite said:


> Round bottom flasks are designed to have round bodies with long, thin necks _to facilitate uniform heat distribution and minimize evaporation_.



ArsoleDickiteDistribution of heat for round flask, you're all right. But about evaporations - use excess solvent or reflux condenser. Flat-bottom flask, more accessible to use.


ArsoleDickite said:


> I also guess the distribution of pressure works differently. I'm not sure but isn't one part of this process explosive? I have the feeling that a fully spherical body can better withstand pressure better than a fully squared body.


If you do not deal with open burning, then everything is fine


ArsoleDickite said:


> But no, there should be no problem. I guess if you really want to you could also use a heat resistance plastic bottle.


Yes, it is possible to use plastic for these reactions, but with some conditions


----------



## salaubry

William Dampier said:


> 10g can be in a 1L flask if the reaction is controlled, but hard.



William Dampierthanks for reply!
What I would like to know is if halving the quantities the reaction will be the same.
In my country is difficult to find 2 liters flask, i only found 1 lt flask, perphaps for law on alchool distillery or other shit...
I'm happy, this forum open me a universe!


----------



## Montecristo

Awesome video! I just got some p2np and almost ready to go, I just need to get some sulfuric acid and some Hg. I am chatting to supplier about some Hg and I have a question for you guys , I can get mercury nitrate and chloride, which should i get ? The chloride is cheaper than the nitrate so i am assumming that would be better but Itll last a lifetime so i really dont mind investing in something better ($45 for chloride and $70 for nitrate).
Also , pure sulfuric acid is not available to public where I am , i think I can get 60% cleaning stuff do you think i could boil/distill this upto a good percentage or should I try harder to buy the 95% stuff?
Also, I have a 5000ml and 2000ml flat bottom conical flask, how much is the max i could run ?
also could i use a glass demijohn (21L or 11.5L) and a ice bath and do 100g runs safely? or would this be hard to work with/not able to handle the exothermic reaction?
Thanks for your time, Happy New Year!


----------



## MadHatter

You can boil down the sulphuric acid, but you will get massive amounts of corrosive and toxic fumes. So you need to do it outside. 
When you boil down the acid, you will also concentrate any impurities that might be in the acid, so you'll end up with a dirty product. To overcome this, you might think about distilling your SA. You need a good heatsource and good, professional glassware for this, since distillation of SA occurs at above 300 degrees C. Just search youtube for info, and please do educate yourself about all the dangers involved in boiling and distilling SA before undertaking it.


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

thatfella said:


> Awesome video! I just got some p2np and almost ready to go, I just need to get some sulfuric acid and some Hg. I am chatting to supplier about some Hg and I have a question for you guys , I can get mercury nitrate and chloride, which should i get ? The chloride is cheaper than the nitrate so i am assumming that would be better but Itll last a lifetime so i really dont mind investing in something better ($45 for chloride and $70 for nitrate).
> Also , pure sulfuric acid is not available to public where I am , i think I can get 60% cleaning stuff do you think i could boil/distill this upto a good percentage or should I try harder to buy the 95% stuff?
> Also, I have a 5000ml and 2000ml flat bottom conical flask, how much is the max i could run ?
> also could i use a glass demijohn (21L or 11.5L) and a ice bath and do 100g runs safely? or would this be hard to work with/not able to handle the exothermic reaction?
> Thanks for your time, Happy New Year!



thatfellaIt is better to use mercury nitrate, given that very small amounts are needed for synthesis, the costs will be insignificant. If you have difficulty buying concentrated sulfuric acid, you can evaporate water from a 65 percent solution. Glass demijohn is not heat-resistant, during an exothermic reaction, the vessel can burst and cause a lot of trouble. It is best to put the first syntheses in small flasks with minimal loads of phenylnitropropene, and with increasing experience, gradually increase the load of the precursor. The video clearly shows the process under ideal conditions, but in this reaction there are problems, and only experience helps to find solutions for them.


----------



## ch3wbacca

thatfella said:


> Awesome video! I just got some p2np and almost ready to go, I just need to get some sulfuric acid and some Hg. I am chatting to supplier about some Hg and I have a question for you guys , I can get mercury nitrate and chloride, which should i get ? The chloride is cheaper than the nitrate so i am assumming that would be better but Itll last a lifetime so i really dont mind investing in something better ($45 for chloride and $70 for nitrate).
> Also , pure sulfuric acid is not available to public where I am , i think I can get 60% cleaning stuff do you think i could boil/distill this upto a good percentage or should I try harder to buy the 95% stuff?
> Also, I have a 5000ml and 2000ml flat bottom conical flask, how much is the max i could run ?
> also could i use a glass demijohn (21L or 11.5L) and a ice bath and do 100g runs safely? or would this be hard to work with/not able to handle the exothermic reaction?
> Thanks for your time, Happy New Year!



thatfella
Adding metallic mercury to some 50% nitric acid and not inhaling the fumes, then using this to amalgamate Al in water or alcohol.
Works always, relieable and fast.
If this is now the (I) or (II) nitrate I confess I never spent a thought on.

But all mercury salts work, solubility is secondary. Mercury alone is not really the hit, but some nitric acid or some HCl and a pinch of nitrate help it to get on the way.

The amalgamation is cake from the mercury side of the fence, the problems blamed on the mercury are IMHO virtually always to blame on the aluminium in special the stupid foil which still is believed to be suitable.
Get some good 99,9% Al granules and amalgamation will be the least of your troubles, the whole reaction will then be troublefree most probably.


----------



## layman

What is preventing from having a mercury contamination in the end product?
Are there any less poisonous substitutes for the mercury nitrate?

EDIT: found a procedure that proposes nickel chloride for the amalgam


Synthesis of Amphetamine Using Urushibara Catalysts - [www.rhodium.ws]


----------



## Montecristo

ch3wbacca said:


> Adding metallic mercury to some 50% nitric acid and not inhaling the fumes, then using this to amalgamate Al in water or alcohol.
> Works always, relieable and fast.
> If this is now the (I) or (II) nitrate I confess I never spent a thought on.
> 
> But all mercury salts work, solubility is secondary. Mercury alone is not really the hit, but some nitric acid or some HCl and a pinch of nitrate help it to get on the way.
> 
> The amalgamation is cake from the mercury side of the fence, the problems blamed on the mercury are IMHO virtually always to blame on the aluminium in special the stupid foil which still is believed to be suitable.
> Get some good 99,9% Al granules and amalgamation will be the least of your troubles, the whole reaction will then be troublefree most probably.



ch3wbaccaAwesome thank you. 
I got some Mercury Nitrate on the way but if that fails i will get some thermometers! 
I have some Al granules for my pyrotechnics but it is pretty much a powder, would I be better off buying some with a coarser grain? if so, what size would you recommend?
Thanks! I'm really excited to give this a go!


----------



## Montecristo

layman said:


> What is preventing from having a mercury contamination in the end product?
> Are there any less poisonous substitutes for the mercury nitrate?
> 
> EDIT: found a procedure that proposes nickel chloride for the amalgam
> 
> 
> Synthesis of Amphetamine Using Urushibara Catalysts - [www.rhodium.ws]



laymanThoroughly rinsing the Al multiple times.
Mercury content vs final product used probably wouldn't be enough to poison you either , especially if you do rinse the majority off. Its probably most dangerous dealing with it during the reaction rather than the final product.
But ask an experienced member and they could probably spell it out for you, I am also a layman


----------



## Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton

thatfella said:


> Awesome thank you.
> I got some Mercury Nitrate on the way but if that fails i will get some thermometers!
> I have some Al granules for my pyrotechnics but it is pretty much a powder, would I be better off buying some with a coarser grain? if so, what size would you recommend?
> Thanks! I'm really excited to give this a go!



thatfellaIn my experience, aluminum foil is the best form of aluminum for amalgam. The main condition is that it does not contain any foreign components, only 99.9% Al. Powder and granules of aluminum are also suitable, but they are recommended to be taken in larger quantities for the reaction and the yield will not be as good as when using foil.


----------



## ifreezeu

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> *In the video synthesis of amphetamine, reagents are used:*
> 10 g 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene;
> 100 ml isopropyl alcohol;
> 50 ml glacial acetic acid;
> 50 g sodium hydroxide;
> 12 g aluminium (in the form of sliced household foil);
> 0.1g mercury nitrate;
> 2 ml sulphuric acid;
> 50 ml acetone.
> 
> *Description of amphetamine synthesis video.*
> Before the start of the synthesis, the laboratory assistant prepared a solution of 10 g of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene in 100 ml of isopropyl alcohol and 50 ml of acetic acid. Also, for the aluminium amalgam, 12 g of household aluminium foil was prepared, which was cut into small pieces with a paper shredder. It can be cut with scissors or torn by hand.
> 
> 0:04-0:40 - Preparation of an aqueous solution of alkali. In this video, it was made in advance so that the solution cools down by the time the main reaction mixture alkalizes. Alkalinization proceeds with the release of heat, and if a fresh hot alkali solution is used, then the exothermic will be more pronounced and forced cooling of the reaction mass will be required.
> 
> 0:46-2:36 - Amalgam of mercury nitrate. Amalgamated aluminium will reduce 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene to amphetamine. During the amalgamation reaction: little gas evolves, a grey precipitate is formed. It is important not to miss the moment when the aluminium is ready: this can be determined by the formation of a grey precipitate and by the increased gas evolution; this happens in 10-15 minutes after the load.
> The water is drained without removing the gauze, the amalgamated aluminium is washed with two portions of cold water. It is worth paying attention to the release of gas bubbles: it is noticed that with the "correct" amalgam, these bubbles are small, and the colour of the liquid is darker; if the bubbles are large and the colour is light, and the reaction looks violent, the amalgam is bad. This is almost certainly due to a lack of mercury salt. Please note that mercury salts are poisonous.
> 
> 2:37-4:28 - The most important part of the process is the reduction of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene on aluminium amalgam. The reaction is exothermic, proceeds with abundant heat release. During the process, it is necessary to carefully monitor the temperature, in case of excessive overheating, to cool in an ice bath, it is allowed to add cold water to the flask. There are cases when the reaction does not start, in which case it is necessary to warm the reaction mass thoroughly, and with a properly prepared amalgam, the reaction begins. The reaction proceeds with the release of the smell of a boiling alcohol and acetic acid mixture. To capture vapours, a spherical irrigation condenser is used, the efficiency of which can be increased by connecting running cold water to it or simply pouring cold water into.
> 
> 5:04 - You can rinse the flask with a little alcohol and rinse the unreacted aluminium with it to collect residues and increase the yield.
> 
> 5:13 - There should be little unreacted aluminium left. By the residues, you can determine the amount of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene reacted.
> 
> 5:16-6:13 - Alkalinization. The reaction proceeds with the release of heat. The remains of unreacted aluminium will additionally enter into reaction with alkali and heat the mixture, as well as create by-products.
> In the process of allowing the mixture to rest after alkalinization, separation into visible layers occurs within 30 minutes. The pH of the top layer should be 11-12.
> 
> 6:18-7:23 - Decantation: collect the top layer containing amphetamine base in alcohol. It can be dried a little with anhydrous magnesium sulfate, and the slag can be additionally extracted with a non-polar solvent (ether, benzene, toluene), the solvent is then evaporated.
> 
> 7:24-8:50 - Preparing a solution of sulphuric acid in acetone. It is made softer acidification of the product to be smoother. If concentrated sulphuric acid is used, there may be local over-acidification of the product.
> 
> 8:51-10:53 - Product acidification - obtaining amphetamine sulfate. To the upper yellow layer collected at the previous stage, a prepared solution of sulphuric acid is added dropwise. Flakes of salt will form with each drop. This stage is very important, it is necessary to carefully monitor the pH, avoiding over-acidification. Acidification is continued until pH 5.5-6 (neutral). The over-acidified product will be pinkish in colour. In case of global over-acidification, the product will be lost.
> 
> 10:55-11:38 - Filtration of amphetamine sulfate from solvents in a Buchner funnel under vacuum. At this stage, the product can be additionally rinsed with cold acetone by pouring it through the funnel with the substance.
> 
> 11:41-12:28 Filtration using improvised means. Any thick fabric can be used as a filter.
> The resulting product is dried in a warm dry place for several hours to remove residual solvents. It is recommended to store it in a vacuum package.
> 
> The yield is 60-70%.



HIGGS BOSSON
Hi

First of all thanks  And some questions below.

*1. Acids concentration question ?*

50 ml of acetic acid (*concentration ?*)
2 ml sulphuric acid (*concentration ?*)
I will youtube how to make this as we cannot get hold of this where I am

*2. isopropyl ?*
Would "IPA Isopropanol Isopropyl Alcohol 99.9%" be fine ?

*3. 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene ?*

Does the purity matter too much , do I have to recrystallise it few times. As I am getting it from someone probably.
Can I add *50Grams* of *1-phenyl-2-nitropropene *instead of *10Grams, *would I have to adjust any amounts on the other chemicals/compounds shown in the experiment?
*4. Anhydrous Acetone ?*
I cannot get hold of *Anhydrous Acetone* as its name*. *Can I use this instead *Acetone 100 ml 99.9% Pure ACS/Lab grade high Quality 

Yields ?*
How much amphetamines was produced after that experiment in grams please ?
(60-70%) of *1-phenyl-2-nitropropene ?*

Regards


----------



## MadHatter

ifreezeu said:


> Hi
> 
> First of all thanks  And some questions below.
> 
> *1. Acids concentration question ?*
> 
> 50 ml of acetic acid (*concentration ?*)
> 2 ml sulphuric acid (*concentration ?*)
> I will youtube how to make this as we cannot get hold of this where I am
> 
> *2. isopropyl ?*
> Would "IPA Isopropanol Isopropyl Alcohol 99.9%" be fine ?
> 
> *3. 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene ?*
> 
> Does the purity matter too much , do I have to recrystallise it few times. As I am getting it from someone probably.
> Can I add *50Grams* of *1-phenyl-2-nitropropene *instead of *10Grams, *would I have to adjust any amounts on the other chemicals/compounds shown in the experiment?
> *4. Anhydrous Acetone ?*
> I cannot get hold of *Anhydrous Acetone* as its name*. *Can I use this instead *Acetone 100 ml 99.9% Pure ACS/Lab grade high Quality
> 
> Yields ?*
> How much amphetamines was produced after that experiment in grams please ?
> (60-70%) of *1-phenyl-2-nitropropene ?*
> 
> Regards



ifreezeuAcetic acid can usually be found in shops specializing in beekeeping, along with formic acid, usually even highly concentrated. They're used for fighting parasites in the colony. 
However, if you need to order larger quantities, spend a few bucks on other equipment also not to raise suspicion.


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

ifreezeu said:


> Hi
> 
> First of all thanks  And some questions below.
> 
> *1. Acids concentration question ?*
> 
> 50 ml of acetic acid (*concentration ?*)
> 2 ml sulphuric acid (*concentration ?*)
> I will youtube how to make this as we cannot get hold of this where I am
> 
> *2. isopropyl ?*
> Would "IPA Isopropanol Isopropyl Alcohol 99.9%" be fine ?
> 
> *3. 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene ?*
> 
> Does the purity matter too much , do I have to recrystallise it few times. As I am getting it from someone probably.
> Can I add *50Grams* of *1-phenyl-2-nitropropene *instead of *10Grams, *would I have to adjust any amounts on the other chemicals/compounds shown in the experiment?
> *4. Anhydrous Acetone ?*
> I cannot get hold of *Anhydrous Acetone* as its name*. *Can I use this instead *Acetone 100 ml 99.9% Pure ACS/Lab grade high Quality
> 
> Yields ?*
> How much amphetamines was produced after that experiment in grams please ?
> (60-70%) of *1-phenyl-2-nitropropene ?*
> 
> Regards



ifreezeu
50 ml of acetic acid (*concentration ?*) 95-98%
2 ml sulphuric acid (*concentration ?*) 95-99%
Would "IPA Isopropanol Isopropyl Alcohol 99.9%" be fine? Yes
Purity is essential, as is the freshness of the precursor. Ideally, there should be light yellow crystals. If you have brown, darkened crystals of phenylnitropropene, then it is enough to recrystallize them once from isopropyl alcohol.
If you want to increase the load by 5 times, then you need to recalculate all other reagents proportionally. But I recommend the first syntheses to put on small amounts, such as 10 g
Yes, it will be anhydrous, you have a high quality of acetone.
If we consider the yield in grams, then when loading 10 g of phenylnitropropene, you can get 6-7 g of amphetamine sulfate.


----------



## ifreezeu

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> 50 ml of acetic acid (*concentration ?*) 95-98%
> 2 ml sulphuric acid (*concentration ?*) 95-99%
> Would "IPA Isopropanol Isopropyl Alcohol 99.9%" be fine ? Yes
> Purity is really important, as is the freshness of the precursor. Ideally, there should be light yellow crystals. If you have brown, darkened crystals of phenylnitropropene, then it is enough to recrystallize them once from isopropyl alcohol.
> If you want to increase the load by 5 times, then you need to recalculate all other reagents proportionally. But I recommend the first syntheses to put on small amounts, such as 10g
> Yes, it will be anhydrous, you have a high quality of acetone.
> If we consider the yield in grams, then when loading 10 g of phenylnitropropene, you can get 6-7 g of amphetamine sulfate.



HIGGS BOSSON
Thank you so much.


----------



## Montecristo

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> 50 ml of acetic acid (*concentration ?*) 95-98%
> 2 ml sulphuric acid (*concentration ?*) 95-99%
> Would "IPA Isopropanol Isopropyl Alcohol 99.9%" be fine ? Yes
> Purity is really important, as is the freshness of the precursor. Ideally, there should be light yellow crystals. If you have brown, darkened crystals of phenylnitropropene, then it is enough to recrystallize them once from isopropyl alcohol.
> If you want to increase the load by 5 times, then you need to recalculate all other reagents proportionally. But I recommend the first syntheses to put on small amounts, such as 10g
> Yes, it will be anhydrous, you have a high quality of acetone.
> If we consider the yield in grams, then when loading 10 g of phenylnitropropene, you can get 6-7 g of amphetamine sulfate.



HIGGS BOSSONIn terms of precursor purity, would I mix with iso filtering out impurities and then evap? or freeze precipitate?
or is this just washed with iso? My p2np is pretty brown.


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

thatfella said:


> In terms of precursor purity, would I mix with iso filtering out impurities and then evap? or freeze precipitate?
> or is this just washed with iso? My p2np is pretty brown.



thatfellaIf your p2np is brown, then it should be dissolved in hot IPA alcohol, and then cooled in the freezer until the crystals fall out. They will need to be collected on the filter, and the dirty solution of alcohol will be thrown out.


----------



## Honolulu98

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> 50 ml de ácido acético ( *concentración?* ) 95-98%
> 2 ml de ácido sulfúrico ( *concentración?* ) 95-99%
> ¿Estaría bien "IPA Isopropanol Isopropyl Alcohol 99.9%"? sí
> La pureza es esencial, al igual que la frescura del precursor. Idealmente, debería haber cristales de color amarillo claro. Si tiene cristales marrones oscurecidos de fenilnitropropeno, entonces es suficiente recristalizarlos una vez en alcohol isopropílico.
> Si desea aumentar la carga 5 veces, debe volver a calcular todos los demás reactivos proporcionalmente. Pero recomiendo que las primeras síntesis se pongan en pequeñas cantidades, como 10 g
> Sí, será anhidro, tienes acetona de alta calidad.
> Si consideramos el rendimiento en gramos, al cargar 10 g de fenilnitropropeno, puede obtener 6-7 g de sulfato de anfetamina.



HIGGS BOSSONWhat would be the best way to obtain high purity sulfuric acid? in my country the sale of acid greater than 14.5% is restricted


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

Honolulu98 said:


> What would be the best way to obtain high purity sulfuric acid? in my country the sale of acid greater than 14.5% is restricted



Honolulu98http://chemforum.info/index.php?threads/obtaining-sulfuric-acid-from-battery-electrolyte.310/


----------



## MadHatter

Actually, that way is not very good for obtaining high PURITY sulphuric acid. It can produce somewhat concentrated sulphuric acid, but the impurities will be just as concentrated. 

If you want to produce concentrated sulphuric acid of high purity, you need to distill it. There are hundreds of instruction videos on youtube on how to do this. Its not very easy though, and requires a glassware distillation apparatus made from good borosilicate glassware since the distillation is done at temperatures above 300 C. 

But if all you want is to make amphetamine sulphate from freebase, you don't really need high purity and that method should do fine.


----------



## ifreezeu

Honolulu98 said:


> What would be the best way to obtain high purity sulfuric acid? in my country the sale of acid greater than 14.5% is restricted



Honolulu98
I will have to use this one day as well 






Obtaining sulfuric acid from battery electrolyte


Important: Observe safety procedures, when handling acids. Protect your respiratory organs and eyes! If you have battery electrolyte, you can obtain high concentrations of sulfuric acid in a simple way. This is done by evaporating the electrolyte in a sand bath. To evaporate you will need: a...




chemforum.info


----------



## ifreezeu

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> *In the video synthesis of amphetamine, reagents are used:*
> 10 g 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene;
> 100 ml isopropyl alcohol;
> 50 ml glacial acetic acid;
> 50 g sodium hydroxide;
> 12 g aluminium (in the form of sliced household foil);
> 0.1g mercury nitrate;
> 2 ml sulphuric acid;
> 50 ml acetone.
> 
> *Description of amphetamine synthesis video.*
> Before the start of the synthesis, the laboratory assistant prepared a solution of 10 g of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene in 100 ml of isopropyl alcohol and 50 ml of acetic acid. Also, for the aluminium amalgam, 12 g of household aluminium foil was prepared, which was cut into small pieces with a paper shredder. It can be cut with scissors or torn by hand.
> 
> 0:04-0:40 - Preparation of an aqueous solution of alkali. In this video, it was made in advance so that the solution cools down by the time the main reaction mixture alkalizes. Alkalinization proceeds with the release of heat, and if a fresh hot alkali solution is used, then the exothermic will be more pronounced and forced cooling of the reaction mass will be required.
> 
> 0:46-2:36 - Amalgam of mercury nitrate. Amalgamated aluminium will reduce 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene to amphetamine. During the amalgamation reaction: little gas evolves, a grey precipitate is formed. It is important not to miss the moment when the aluminium is ready: this can be determined by the formation of a grey precipitate and by the increased gas evolution; this happens in 10-15 minutes after the load.
> The water is drained without removing the gauze, the amalgamated aluminium is washed with two portions of cold water. It is worth paying attention to the release of gas bubbles: it is noticed that with the "correct" amalgam, these bubbles are small, and the colour of the liquid is darker; if the bubbles are large and the colour is light, and the reaction looks violent, the amalgam is bad. This is almost certainly due to a lack of mercury salt. Please note that mercury salts are poisonous.
> 
> 2:37-4:28 - The most important part of the process is the reduction of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene on aluminium amalgam. The reaction is exothermic, proceeds with abundant heat release. During the process, it is necessary to carefully monitor the temperature, in case of excessive overheating, to cool in an ice bath, it is allowed to add cold water to the flask. There are cases when the reaction does not start, in which case it is necessary to warm the reaction mass thoroughly, and with a properly prepared amalgam, the reaction begins. The reaction proceeds with the release of the smell of a boiling alcohol and acetic acid mixture. To capture vapours, a spherical irrigation condenser is used, the efficiency of which can be increased by connecting running cold water to it or simply pouring cold water into.
> 
> 5:04 - You can rinse the flask with a little alcohol and rinse the unreacted aluminium with it to collect residues and increase the yield.
> 
> 5:13 - There should be little unreacted aluminium left. By the residues, you can determine the amount of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene reacted.
> 
> 5:16-6:13 - Alkalinization. The reaction proceeds with the release of heat. The remains of unreacted aluminium will additionally enter into reaction with alkali and heat the mixture, as well as create by-products.
> In the process of allowing the mixture to rest after alkalinization, separation into visible layers occurs within 30 minutes. The pH of the top layer should be 11-12.
> 
> 6:18-7:23 - Decantation: collect the top layer containing amphetamine base in alcohol. It can be dried a little with anhydrous magnesium sulfate, and the slag can be additionally extracted with a non-polar solvent (ether, benzene, toluene), the solvent is then evaporated.
> 
> 7:24-8:50 - Preparing a solution of sulphuric acid in acetone. It is made softer acidification of the product to be smoother. If concentrated sulphuric acid is used, there may be local over-acidification of the product.
> 
> 8:51-10:53 - Product acidification - obtaining amphetamine sulfate. To the upper yellow layer collected at the previous stage, a prepared solution of sulphuric acid is added dropwise. Flakes of salt will form with each drop. This stage is very important, it is necessary to carefully monitor the pH, avoiding over-acidification. Acidification is continued until pH 5.5-6 (neutral). The over-acidified product will be pinkish in colour. In case of global over-acidification, the product will be lost.
> 
> 10:55-11:38 - Filtration of amphetamine sulfate from solvents in a Buchner funnel under vacuum. At this stage, the product can be additionally rinsed with cold acetone by pouring it through the funnel with the substance.
> 
> 11:41-12:28 Filtration using improvised means. Any thick fabric can be used as a filter.
> The resulting product is dried in a warm dry place for several hours to remove residual solvents. It is recommended to store it in a vacuum package.
> 
> The yield is 60-70%.



HIGGS BOSSON
You lovely chaps 

How could this process or video be modified to work with L-PAC instead of P2NP ? That will be super* cool/wicked/proper & bang on* to the cause.






P2NP1-Phenyl-2-nitropropene
Phenyl-2-nitropropeneC9 H9 N O2L-PACPhenylacetylcarbinol
1-hydroxy-1-phenyl-propan-2-oneC9 H10 O2


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

ifreezeu said:


> You lovely chaps
> 
> How could this process or video be modified to work with L-PAC instead of P2NP ? That will be super* cool/wicked/proper & bang on* to the cause.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> P2NP1-Phenyl-2-nitropropene
> Phenyl-2-nitropropeneC9 H9 N O2L-PACPhenylacetylcarbinol
> 1-hydroxy-1-phenyl-propan-2-oneC9 H10 O2



ifreezeuI thought about using Phenylacetylcarbinol, but it turned out to be quite difficult to buy, the substance is not used in pharmaceuticals, and there is no one on the market in China and India. But even if you find it, you need to make ephederine from it, which can be restored to methamphetamine.


----------



## ifreezeu

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> I thought about using Phenylacetylcarbinol, but it turned out to be quite difficult to buy, the substance is not used in pharmaceuticals, and there is no one on the market in China and India. But even if you find it, you need to make ephederine from it, which can be restored to methamphetamine.



HIGGS BOSSON
I was going to try to use this guide in the future to make it L-PAC ? https://www.thevespiary.org/talk/index.php?topic=12453.0

I am totally novice to chemistry but I know I can put the pieces together, with your guys help 

So hopefully L-PAC with the process above could be a great fun experiment


----------



## layman

Can anyone enlighten me on what the GAA is responsible for?


----------



## layman

Is there any specific reason to prefer isopropanol over ethanol?


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

layman said:


> Is there any specific reason to prefer isopropanol over ethanol?



laymanIsopropanol is cheaper and more legal, in some countries it is difficult to buy ethanol due to legislative restrictions, but it can also be used in this synthesis.


----------



## G.Patton

ifreezeu said:


> I was going to try to use this guide in the future to make it L-PAC ? https://www.thevespiary.org/talk/index.php?topic=12453.0
> 
> I am totally novice to chemistry but I know I can put the pieces together, with your guys help
> 
> So hopefully L-PAC with the process above could be a great fun experiment



ifreezeuI can help you with synthesis, you can ask me in private messages any question about.


----------



## chubaca

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> *In the video synthesis of amphetamine, reagents are used:*
> 10 g 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene;
> 100 ml isopropyl alcohol;
> 50 ml glacial acetic acid;
> 50 g sodium hydroxide;
> 12 g aluminium (in the form of sliced household foil);
> 0.1g mercury nitrate;
> 2 ml sulphuric acid;
> 50 ml acetone.
> 
> *Description of amphetamine synthesis video.*
> Before the start of the synthesis, the laboratory assistant prepared a solution of 10 g of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene in 100 ml of isopropyl alcohol and 50 ml of acetic acid. Also, for the aluminium amalgam, 12 g of household aluminium foil was prepared, which was cut into small pieces with a paper shredder. It can be cut with scissors or torn by hand.
> 
> 0:04-0:40 - Preparation of an aqueous solution of alkali. In this video, it was made in advance so that the solution cools down by the time the main reaction mixture alkalizes. Alkalinization proceeds with the release of heat, and if a fresh hot alkali solution is used, then the exothermic will be more pronounced and forced cooling of the reaction mass will be required.
> 
> 0:46-2:36 - Amalgam of mercury nitrate. Amalgamated aluminium will reduce 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene to amphetamine. During the amalgamation reaction: little gas evolves, a grey precipitate is formed. It is important not to miss the moment when the aluminium is ready: this can be determined by the formation of a grey precipitate and by the increased gas evolution; this happens in 10-15 minutes after the load.
> The water is drained without removing the gauze, the amalgamated aluminium is washed with two portions of cold water. It is worth paying attention to the release of gas bubbles: it is noticed that with the "correct" amalgam, these bubbles are small, and the colour of the liquid is darker; if the bubbles are large and the colour is light, and the reaction looks violent, the amalgam is bad. This is almost certainly due to a lack of mercury salt. Please note that mercury salts are poisonous.
> 
> 2:37-4:28 - The most important part of the process is the reduction of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene on aluminium amalgam. The reaction is exothermic, proceeds with abundant heat release. During the process, it is necessary to carefully monitor the temperature, in case of excessive overheating, to cool in an ice bath, it is allowed to add cold water to the flask. There are cases when the reaction does not start, in which case it is necessary to warm the reaction mass thoroughly, and with a properly prepared amalgam, the reaction begins. The reaction proceeds with the release of the smell of a boiling alcohol and acetic acid mixture. To capture vapours, a spherical irrigation condenser is used, the efficiency of which can be increased by connecting running cold water to it or simply pouring cold water into.
> 
> 5:04 - You can rinse the flask with a little alcohol and rinse the unreacted aluminium with it to collect residues and increase the yield.
> 
> 5:13 - There should be little unreacted aluminium left. By the residues, you can determine the amount of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene reacted.
> 
> 5:16-6:13 - Alkalinization. The reaction proceeds with the release of heat. The remains of unreacted aluminium will additionally enter into reaction with alkali and heat the mixture, as well as create by-products.
> In the process of allowing the mixture to rest after alkalinization, separation into visible layers occurs within 30 minutes. The pH of the top layer should be 11-12.
> 
> 6:18-7:23 - Decantation: collect the top layer containing amphetamine base in alcohol. It can be dried a little with anhydrous magnesium sulfate, and the slag can be additionally extracted with a non-polar solvent (ether, benzene, toluene), the solvent is then evaporated.
> 
> 7:24-8:50 - Preparing a solution of sulphuric acid in acetone. It is made softer acidification of the product to be smoother. If concentrated sulphuric acid is used, there may be local over-acidification of the product.
> 
> 8:51-10:53 - Product acidification - obtaining amphetamine sulfate. To the upper yellow layer collected at the previous stage, a prepared solution of sulphuric acid is added dropwise. Flakes of salt will form with each drop. This stage is very important, it is necessary to carefully monitor the pH, avoiding over-acidification. Acidification is continued until pH 5.5-6 (neutral). The over-acidified product will be pinkish in colour. In case of global over-acidification, the product will be lost.
> 
> 10:55-11:38 - Filtration of amphetamine sulfate from solvents in a Buchner funnel under vacuum. At this stage, the product can be additionally rinsed with cold acetone by pouring it through the funnel with the substance.
> 
> 11:41-12:28 Filtration using improvised means. Any thick fabric can be used as a filter.
> The resulting product is dried in a warm dry place for several hours to remove residual solvents. It is recommended to store it in a vacuum package.
> 
> The yield is 60-70%.



HIGGS BOSSONFirst of all, thank you so much for sharing your knowledge. i just have mercury chloride, HgCl2, it's works ? I need change sommething in the synsthesis ? Can you help-me ?


----------



## William Dampier

chubaca said:


> First of all, thank you so much for sharing your knowledge. i just have mercury chloride, HgCl2, it's works ? I need change sommething in the synsthesis ? Can you help-me ?



chubacaIt's work


----------



## chubaca

William Dampier said:


> It's work



William DampierThank you very much!


----------



## MilfMaker

Does anyone here happen to be able to get me mercury nitrate?


----------



## Montecristo

MilfMaker said:


> Does anyone here happen to be able to get me mercury nitrate?



MilfMakerthere is a seller on amazon that ships it from ukraine.


----------



## MilfMaker

thatfella said:


> there is a seller on amazon that ships it from ukraine.



thatfellaDo you have a name or link?


----------



## Montecristo

MilfMaker said:


> Do you have a name or link?



MilfMaker





Mercury (II) Nitrate, Powder, 99.88%, Analytical Reagent (ACS), 25 g: Amazon.com: Industrial & Scientific


Mercury (II) Nitrate, Powder, 99.88%, Analytical Reagent (ACS), 25 g: Amazon.com: Industrial & Scientific



www.amazon.com


----------



## Montecristo

Mercury (II) Nitrate, Powder, 99.88%, Analytical Reagent (ACS), 25 g: Amazon.com: Industrial & Scientific


Mercury (II) Nitrate, Powder, 99.88%, Analytical Reagent (ACS), 25 g: Amazon.com: Industrial & Scientific



www.amazon.com


----------



## Montecristo

amazon com /Mercury-Nitrate-Powder-Analytical-Reagent/dp/B07GWW8BKS


----------



## MilfMaker

thatfella said:


> amazon com /Mercury-Nitrate-Powder-Analytical-Reagent/dp/B07GWW8BKS



thatfellathank you 

Can anyone tell me where I can get sulfuric acid?


----------



## MadHatter

It depends on where you are in the world (don't answer that !!!).
If you are in a region where sulphuric acid is controlled, such as the EU, the safest way to source it is from old car batteries. Otherwise you might find battery acid sold in the hardware store.
Acid from batteries is dirty and usually one needs to at least let it stand for a week or so to let all the impurities fall to the bottom. Then you decant off the clean acid and boil it down to evaporate water (water boils at 100 C, sulphuric acid well above 300). There are several descriptions of the process here on the forum.






Obtaining sulfuric acid from battery electrolyte


Important: Observe safety procedures, when handling acids. Protect your respiratory organs and eyes! If you have battery electrolyte, you can obtain high concentrations of sulfuric acid in a simple way. This is done by evaporating the electrolyte in a sand bath. To evaporate you will need: a...




chemforum.info










Production of concentrated sulfuric acid at home


For our experience, we need a battery electrolee. I bought at once a can of 5 liters with a density of 1.28 g / cm3 (which corresponds to about 36% concentration). As probably everyone knows, the electrolyte is dilute sulfuric acid. In order to obtain more concentrated acid, we need to try to...




chemforum.info





To get clean, concentrated sulphuric acid, you need to distill it. Check youtube for this, it's not exactly dfficult but can be unsafe and produces a lot of corrosive/toxic fumes.


----------



## MilfMaker

How many % must the sulfuric acid have?


----------



## Montecristo

DocX said:


> It depends on where you are in the world (don't answer that !!!).
> If you are in a region where sulphuric acid is controlled, such as the EU, the safest way to source it is from old car batteries. Otherwise you might find battery acid sold in the hardware store.
> Acid from batteries is dirty and usually one needs to at least let it stand for a week or so to let all the impurities fall to the bottom. Then you decant off the clean acid and boil it down to evaporate water (water boils at 100 C, sulphuric acid well above 300). There are several descriptions of the process here on the forum.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Obtaining sulfuric acid from battery electrolyte
> 
> 
> Important: Observe safety procedures, when handling acids. Protect your respiratory organs and eyes! If you have battery electrolyte, you can obtain high concentrations of sulfuric acid in a simple way. This is done by evaporating the electrolyte in a sand bath. To evaporate you will need: a...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> chemforum.info
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Production of concentrated sulfuric acid at home
> 
> 
> For our experience, we need a battery electrolee. I bought at once a can of 5 liters with a density of 1.28 g / cm3 (which corresponds to about 36% concentration). As probably everyone knows, the electrolyte is dilute sulfuric acid. In order to obtain more concentrated acid, we need to try to...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> chemforum.info
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To get clean, concentrated sulphuric acid, you need to distill it. Check youtube for this, it's not exactly dfficult but can be unsafe and produces a lot of corrosive/toxic fumes.



DocXmy still has a pipe attachment at the end to stop pressure buildup etc, can i divert the fumes into a basic mix to neutralize this? or should i just have the pipe leading outside?


----------



## Montecristo

MilfMaker said:


> thank you
> 
> Can anyone tell me where I can get sulfuric acid?



MilfMakerall goods man, just beware its likely deemed hazmat in most countries and likely prohibited in some, the seller doesnt ship as hazmat or as mercury though so im sure it will arrive safely ( dependant on location )


----------



## MadHatter

thatfella said:


> my still has a pipe attachment at the end to stop pressure buildup etc, can i divert the fumes into a basic mix to neutralize this? or should i just have the pipe leading outside?



thatfellaI'm sorry, your "still"? Is it a metal still? You cant boil sulphuric acid in metal, its corrosive. It will eat through your metal. 
Otherwise either of the options you mentioned will work.


----------



## Regtion

Great movie!  I spent a good time watching it. Where can I find more videos on how to make drugs? Do I get a link?


----------



## Xiaoyan

thatfella said:


> there is a seller on amazon that ships it from ukraine.



thatfellasorry, 
you know if these vendor have aby e mail adress?


----------



## Sabatier

Xiaoyan said:


> sorry,
> you know if these vendor have aby e mail adress?



Xiaoyan*[email protected]*


----------



## Montecristo

DocX said:


> I'm sorry, your "still"? Is it a metal still? You cant boil sulphuric acid in metal, its corrosive. It will eat through your metal.
> Otherwise either of the options you mentioned will work.



DocXSorry for the confusion, I am a home distiller so my vocabulary is that way. This is a glass lab distiller with heating mantle. What pH would be ideal to neutralize the fumes? 
thanks !


----------



## William Dampier

thatfella said:


> Sorry for the confusion, I am a home distiller so my vocabulary is that way. This is a glass lab distiller with heating mantle. What pH would be ideal to neutralize the fumes?
> thanks !



thatfellaIf we talk about the reaction itself, where alcohol and acetic acid evaporate, then, of course, an alkaline solution.


----------



## cyb3r0

I have all the required, but the alkaline solution, did I buy it ready-made or do something? I did not understand this point in particular


----------



## cyb3r0

Liquid sodium hydroxide solution was purchased at the store. Does it have the same effect as powdered sodium hydroxide?


----------



## cyb3r0

Does liquid sodium hydroxide in stores do the same synthesis as in the video


----------



## cyb3r0

What type of capacitor was used in the video?


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

cyb3r0 said:


> Liquid sodium hydroxide solution was purchased at the store. Does it have the same effect as powdered sodium hydroxide?



cyb3r0Yes, the solution does not deteriorate.


cyb3r0 said:


> Does liquid sodium hydroxide in stores do the same synthesis as in the video


Yes



cyb3r0 said:


> What type of capacitor was used in the video?


Alihn condensator


----------



## cyb3r0

في هذا الفيديو ، ضع 50 جرامًا من هيدروكسيد الصوديوم في 150 لترًا من الماء البارد ، وهذه المعادلة هي كم مليلتر من هيدروكسيد الصوديوم في السائل المخزن


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

cyb3r0 said:


> في هذا الفيديو ، ضع 50 جرامًا من هيدروكسيد الصوديوم في 150 لترًا من الماء البارد ، وهذه المعادلة هي كم مليلتر من هيدروكسيد الصوديوم في السائل المخزن



cyb3r0Please have questions in English


----------



## cyb3r0

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> *Description of amphetamine synthesis video.*
> Before the start of the synthesis, the laboratory assistant prepared a solution of 10 g of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene in 100 ml of isopropyl alcohol and 50 ml of acetic acid. Also, for the aluminium amalgam, 12 g of household aluminium foil was prepared, which was cut into small pieces with a paper shredder. It can be cut with scissors or torn by hand.



HIGGS BOSSONWhat is the method of preparation for p2np, isopropyl alcohol and acetic acid

And In this video, he put 50 grams of NaOH into 150 liters of cold water, the equation is how much liquid NaOH I put in stores


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

cyb3r0 said:


> What is the method of preparation for p2np, isopropyl alcohol and acetic acid
> 
> And In this video, he put 50 grams of NaOH into 150 liters of cold water, the equation is how much liquid NaOH I put in stores



cyb3r0It is necessary to mix the reagents in the right proportions and warm up a little to dissolve p2np

Usually, I make a solution of alkali on the eye, strictly ratio is not required. Approx. 50 g of alkali per 150 milliliters of water. But the process of alkali RM must be performed with the control of the pH level


----------



## cyb3r0

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> It is necessary to mix the reagents in the right proportions and warm up a little to dissolve p2np
> 
> Usually I make a solution of alkali on the eye, strictly ratio is not required. Approx. 50g of alkali per 150 milliliters of water. But the process of alkali RM must be performed with the control of the pH level



HIGGS BOSSONWhat is the method of preparation for p2np, isopropyl alcohol and acetic acid


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

cyb3r0 said:


> What is the method of preparation for p2np, isopropyl alcohol and acetic acid



cyb3r0replied in PM


----------



## cyb3r0

Can we make it with ordinary glass or are there mandatory conditions?


----------



## Grand Poobah

Is there a video for MDMA? Will there be one? Can I use this vid with slight changes?


----------



## Ruedi689

Wie wäre es mit einer Synthese mit p2np + Ephedrin + Koffein gelöst in ipa anschließend al/hg (hgcl2), bitte um Hilfe


----------



## Ruedi689

G.Patton said:


> Ich kann Ihnen bei der Synthese helfen, Sie können mir in privaten Nachrichten jede Frage stellen.



G.PattonKönnen sie mir helfen ich bin begeisterter Hobbie Chemiker mit geringer Erfahrung. 

In meinem Inventar habe ich al, hgcl2, Essigsäure 60% ipa , bittersalz (ich glaube nicht Wasserfrei) wäre es gut in der Pfanne zu entwässern) 
?
Mein p2np beziehe ich von Nitrochemis.Com 

was können sie mir sagen wie muss ich vorgehen? Ich habe die Idee gelöstes p2np + ephedrin hcl mit coffein zu einer al/hg zuzugeben was halten sie davon?


----------



## HEISENBERG

Ruedi689 said:


> Wie wäre es mit einer Synthese mit p2np + Ephedrin + Koffein gelöst in ipa anschließend al/hg (hgcl2), bitte um Hilfe



Ruedi689


Ruedi689 said:


> Können sie mir helfen ich bin begeisterter Hobbie Chemiker mit geringer Erfahrung.
> 
> In meinem Inventar habe ich al, hgcl2, Essigsäure 60% ipa , bittersalz (ich glaube nicht Wasserfrei) wäre es gut in der Pfanne zu entwässern)
> ?
> Mein p2np beziehe ich von Nitrochemis.Com
> 
> was können sie mir sagen wie muss ich vorgehen? Ich habe die Idee gelöstes p2np + ephedrin hcl mit coffein zu einer al/hg zuzugeben was halten sie davon?


Write in English. At least use Google Translate


----------



## Ruedi689

How about a synthesis with p2np + ephedrine + caffeine dissolved in ipa then al/hg (hgcl2), please help Can you help me I am an enthusiastic hobby chemist with little experience. In my inventory I have al, hgcl2, acetic acid 60% ipa , epsom salts (not anhydrous I think it would be good to drain in the pan) ? I get my p2np from Nitrochemis.Com what can you tell me how should i proceed? I have the idea of adding dissolved p2np + ephedrine hcl with caffeine to an al/hg what do you think?


----------



## Ruedi689

I received the following in a reaction of 5g p2np in Al/hg (hgcl2)... I had a yield of more than 100% I think it is sodium sulphate with the desired amine. How can it be edited?


----------



## G.Patton

Ruedi689 said:


> How about a synthesis with p2np + ephedrine + caffeine dissolved in ipa then al/hg (hgcl2), please help Can you help me I am an enthusiastic hobby chemist with little experience. In my inventory I have al, hgcl2, acetic acid 60% ipa , epsom salts (not anhydrous I think it would be good to drain in the pan) ? I get my p2np from Nitrochemis.Com what can you tell me how should i proceed? I have the idea of adding dissolved p2np + ephedrine hcl with caffeine to an al/hg what do you think?



Ruedi689Actually, I can't understand your question well. There is a video manual and comments to every step. You have to repeat to get amph. Why do you want to use ephedrine and caffeine?


----------



## Ruedi689

To what extent can I best stretch my amphetamine sulphate to make it roadworthy? We assume 50g of pure amphetamine sulphate. I have ephedrine and caffeine

.

The reason why I want to incorporate ephedrine into synthesis is the following: I have read there are reductions based on ephedrine hcl


----------



## G.Patton

Ruedi689 said:


> To what extent can I best stretch my amphetamine sulphate to make it roadworthy? We assume 50g of pure amphetamine sulphate. I have ephedrine and caffeine
> 
> .
> 
> The reason why I want to incorporate ephedrine into synthesis is the following: I have read there are reductions based on ephedrine hcl



Ruedi689Do you want to cut off your staff by caffeine and ephedrine? You can't make amph from ephedrine by this method.


----------



## Ruedi689

Maybe it would make the product even stronger. Would it make sense? It would be a 3-component effect. Some people don't think pure amphetamine is very good, they understand what I mean by that


----------



## G.Patton

Ruedi689 said:


> Maybe it would make the product even stronger. Would it make sense? It would be a 3-component effect. Some people don't think pure amphetamine is very good, they understand what I mean by that



Ruedi689Try it yourself first before you sell it to others.


----------



## Ruedi689

How would they make their amphetamine roads suitable? Is there a core temperature during amalgamation that must not be exceeded? 2000 ml flask with cooler 20g p2np as a reduction I use hgcl2. Do you rather refrain from cooling as long as it does not overflow? Or do I always have to cool down? Best regards


----------



## Ruedi689

10g p2np dissolved in 100ml ipa with 50ml Gaa 60%, do I need some more water? Why should I take aqueous alkali instead of a mixture of 50/50?


----------



## Ruedi689

P2np dissolved in 100ml ipa with 50ml Gaa 60%, do I need some water? Why should I take aqueous alkali instead of a mixture of 50/50?


----------



## cyb3r0

I have liquid sodium hydroxide like this picture how many ml do I put?


----------



## Ruedi689

Ohhh I'm uncomfortable I don't master Molare conversion, I would love to understand it so much.


----------



## Ruedi689

I attended primary and secondary school :/


----------



## G.Patton

cyb3r0 said:


> I have liquid sodium hydroxide like this picture how many ml do I put?
> 
> View attachment 3565



cyb3r0You need to reach pH 11-12. The necessary volume depends on your load.


----------



## Ruedi689

What happens to my product, if it is too alkaline, say 13/14. Is there then more sodium sulphate in my amine or can it even be destroyed?

?

What core temperature should I pay attention to during amalgamation?

?

Then I have another question... I neutralize with battery acid 37%, do I still have to add alcohol if so, how much? Hgcl2 or hgno3 what is the difference in the Final product


----------



## MilfMaker

Hey guys, does anyone have a contact for sulfuric acid here?


----------



## MilfMaker

Can I also use battery acid? How many % must the sulfuric acid have?


----------



## Ruedi689

MilfMaker said:


> Hey Leute, hat hier jemand einen Ansprechpartner für Schwefelsäure?



MilfMakerHttps://www.aurelio-online.com supplies 100% order even there


----------



## Ruedi689

MilfMaker said:


> Can I also use battery acid? How many % must the sulfuric acid have?



MilfMakerI believe alcoholic sulfuric acid 35%

Battery acid consists of 37% sulfuric acid and the rest could be water... unfortunately I don't know how it relates to the product myself.


----------



## anotherNovice

Hi all, relatively new here. I am a novice and learning. I was reviewing the Henry method for P2NP, but the chemicals needed seemed more difficult or risky to obtain in my area then going with a P2NP supplier. Do other have any thoughts or insights to help me determine the best path.


----------



## MilfMaker

Ruedi689 said:


> Https://www.aurelio-online.com supplies 100% order even there



Ruedi689he only delivers to commercial customers


----------



## William Dampier

anotherNovice said:


> Hi all, relatively new here. I am a novice and learning. I was reviewing the Henry method for P2NP, but the chemicals needed seemed more difficult or risky to obtain in my area then going with a P2NP supplier. Do other have any thoughts or insights to help me determine the best path.



anotherNoviceThe route from P2NP with amalgam (if there is mercury) the best way for a novice, although it seems difficult.


----------



## William Dampier

Ruedi689 said:


> What happens to my product, if it is too alkaline, say 13/14. Is there then more sodium sulphate in my amine or can it even be destroyed?



Ruedi689don't worry about it


Ruedi689 said:


> What core temperature should I pay attention to during amalgamation?


Before adding a solution of P2NP, you can chilled at 0*C. Add will be easier, but after needed forced heating, you need 60*C. Such control allows you to put large scale. 


Ruedi689 said:


> Then I have another question... I neutralize with battery acid 37%, do I still have to add alcohol if so, how much?


You need to evaporate the water as much as possible, before adding alcohol. Less water - less alcohol is necessary. A lot of alcohol is bad, because he does not give the whole product without evaporation.


Ruedi689 said:


> Hgcl2 or hgno3 what is the difference in the Final product


no difference


----------



## Ruedi689

MilfMaker said:


> he only delivers to commercial customers



MilfMakerHe has to say that. I can only give you the tip. Order the desired product and pay immediately. Then send transfer confirmation to his email. Nothing will stand in the way of your delivery. You can call your business xy. The dealer refrains from a ust-id.


----------



## anotherNovice

William Dampier said:


> The route from P2NP with amalgam (if there is mercury) the best way for a novice, although it seems difficult.



William DampierThank you. Apologies I think I was unclear. The mehtod is not what appears difficult to me, rather obtaining the chemicals, specifically nitroethane and to some degree benzaldehyde. Aside from attempting synthesis for nitroethane, any adive on trusted suppler? Apologies if not appropriate area to ask.


----------



## Ruedi689

anotherNovice said:


> Danke schön. Entschuldigung, ich glaube, ich war unklar. Die Methode ist nicht das, was mir schwierig erscheint, sondern die Beschaffung der Chemikalien, insbesondere Nitroethan und bis zu einem gewissen Grad Benzaldehyd. Abgesehen von dem Versuch, eine Synthese für Nitroethan zu versuchen, gibt es einen Hinweis auf einen vertrauenswürdigen Lieferanten? Entschuldigung, wenn nicht der richtige Bereich zum Fragen.



anotherNovicenitrochemis.com


----------



## Ruedi689

anotherNovice said:


> Danke schön. Entschuldigung, ich glaube, ich war unklar. Die Methode ist nicht das, was mir schwierig erscheint, sondern die Beschaffung der Chemikalien, insbesondere Nitroethan und bis zu einem bestimmten Grad Benzaldehyd. Abgesehen von dem Versuch, eine Synthese für Nitroethan zu versuchen, gibt es einen Hinweis auf einen zertifizierten Lieferanten? Entschuldigung, wenn nicht der richtige Bereich zum Fragen.



anotherNovice





nitrochemis.com







nitrochemis.com


----------



## Ruedi689

William Dampier said:


> Mach dir keine Sorgen
> 
> Bevor Sie eine Lösung von P2NP hinzufügen, können Sie bei 0 ° C kühlen. Das Hinzufügen ist einfacher, aber nach der erforderlichen Zwangserhitzung benötigen Sie 60 * C. Eine solche Steuerung ermöglicht es Ihnen, große Maßstäbe zu setzen.
> 
> Sie müssen das Wasser so weit wie möglich verdampfen, bevor Sie Alkohol hinzufügen. Weniger Wasser - weniger Alkohol ist notwendig. Viel Alkohol ist schlecht, weil er nicht das ganze Produkt ohne Verdunstung gibt.
> 
> kein Unterschied



William DampierThank you very much. If I understand correctly, the following applies: Piston armed with aluminum + h2o in an ice bath and loosen my hgcl2 separately before I add it to the piston? What temperature does my warm clear p2np + ipa solution need before I add it?

?

Should both suspensions of amalgam and caustic soda be cooled to 0c

?

I add acetone immediately after the separation

?

Have battery acid as well as concentrated sulfuric acid, do I have to produce alcoholic sulfuric acid myself?


----------



## cyb3r0

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> Before the start of the synthesis, the laboratory assistant prepared a solution of 10 g of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene in 100 ml of isopropyl alcohol and 50 ml of acetic acid. Also, for the aluminium amalgam, 12 g of household aluminium foil was prepared, which was cut into small pieces with a paper shredder. It can be cut with scissors or torn by hand.



HIGGS BOSSONWhat temperature should I put this preparation at?


----------



## anotherNovice

Ruedi689 said:


> nitrochemis.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nitrochemis.com



Ruedi689Thank you, unfortunately the EU does not work for me but I appreciate the advice.


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

cyb3r0 said:


> What temperature should I put this preparation at?



cyb3r0Make the solution at room temperature, but to dissolve the crystals, you can heat up a little


----------



## cyb3r0

I want to reduce the amount of water, can I apply 500 ml and do I have to reduce the proportions of the rest of the reagents?


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

cyb3r0 said:


> I want to reduce the amount of water, can I apply 500 ml and do I have to reduce the proportions of the rest of the reagents?



cyb3r0Where to reduce? In an alkali solution? Write to me in private messages, I will tell you everything in detail


----------



## cyb3r0

This yield is this amphetamine? How do I know it is amphetamine and does it have a smell?


----------



## pdwshopnl

I recommendet read this book for all People who starts in this sport:

*Vogel's* Practical Organic Chemistry


----------



## cyb3r0

Does amphetamine need to be removed after the synthesis process?


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

cyb3r0 said:


> Does amphetamine need to be removed after the synthesis process?



cyb3r0It is amphetamine if you obtained this powder by reducing phenylnitropropene. It should taste bitter. What do you mean by remove?


----------



## cyb3r0

Should amphetamine be purified after the synthesis process?

Is the amphetamine extracted from this formula ready for sale or does it need to be purified?

At the end of this clip, amphetamine was extracted. Is this ready or does it need a purification process?


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

cyb3r0 said:


> Should amphetamine be purified after the synthesis process?
> 
> Is the amphetamine extracted from this formula ready for sale or does it need to be purified?
> 
> At the end of this clip, amphetamine was extracted. Is this ready or does it need a purification process?



cyb3r0Amphetamine can be purified by washing with cold alcohol or acetone, this will be enough if the color of the substance is white.


----------



## pdwshopnl

Why on erowid People who do IT reaction uses diluted glacial acetic acid ~ about 70-75% for reduction?
And second thing they are uses more acid to reduce nitropropene for 1g p2np they use 10 ml GAA and dilute IT with water.

In synthesis from this topic, for 1g p2np they use 5ml GAA.

Its 50% different for reagent who give Hydrogen in reduction.

What reduction will be better? With water (from erowid) or without water (this topic)?






Reduction of Nitroalkenes with Aluminium Amalgam - [www.rhodium.ws]



Text from this link:
*#4. Reduction of unsubstituted P2NP by HyperLab Bee #2.*


Into a 3-L FBF there was placed 100 mls water, 250mls GAA and a solution of 1g mercury in 2-3 mls conc. HNO3.
52 g (2 packs 10 meters each) of Al foil were folded into 7-8 layers, cut in pieces 3x3 cm and loaded into the flask.
The flask was heated to 40 °C. When the start of amalgamation was clearly visible in several minutes, heating was discontinued and into the reaction there was added a suspension of 30 g *non-recrystallized* phenyl-2-nitropropene in a mixture of 50 mls GAA and 100mls IPA (nitropropene was obtained _*a la Barium’s MeAm condensation* - _ an important notion since this method gives the product of superior purity).


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

pdwshopnl said:


> Why on erowid People who do IT reaction uses diluted glacial acetic acid ~ about 70-75% for reduction?
> And second thing they are uses more acid to reduce nitropropene for 1g p2np they use 10 ml GAA and dilute IT with water.
> 
> In synthesis from this topic, for 1g p2np they use 5ml GAA.
> 
> Its 50% different for reagent who give Hydrogen in reduction.
> 
> What reduction will be better? With water (from erowid) or without water (this topic)?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Reduction of Nitroalkenes with Aluminium Amalgam - [www.rhodium.ws]
> 
> 
> 
> Text from this link:
> *#4. Reduction of unsubstituted P2NP by HyperLab Bee #2.*
> 
> 
> Into a 3-L FBF there was placed 100 mls water, 250mls GAA and a solution of 1g mercury in 2-3 mls conc. HNO3.
> 52 g (2 packs 10 meters each) of Al foil were folded into 7-8 layers, cut in pieces 3x3 cm and loaded into the flask.
> The flask was heated to 40 °C. When the start of amalgamation was clearly visible in several minutes, heating was discontinued and into the reaction there was added a suspension of 30 g *non-recrystallized* phenyl-2-nitropropene in a mixture of 50 mls GAA and 100mls IPA (nitropropene was obtained _*a la Barium’s MeAm condensation* - _ an important notion since this method gives the product of superior purity).



pdwshopnlYou can use diluted acetic acid. Excess acid does not interfere with reduce, but it will have to be extinguished with the appropriate amount of alkali, which will lead to an increased consumption of reagents and time, since more heat will be released when the acid interacts with the alkali. In the described technique, they simultaneously carry out amalgamation with a mercury salt and a reduction reaction. In my technique, the foil is first treated with an aqueous solution of mercury salt, which is then drained, which makes the product cleaner.


----------



## DEA:)

Hi,

I need to get back to the sulfuric acid, is there any alternative to crystallize the amphetamine? Would tartaric acid be an option, to receive amphetamine tartrate? 

Thx


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

DEA:) said:


> Hi,
> 
> I need to get back to the sulfuric acid, is there any alternative to crystallize the amphetamine? Would tartaric acid be an option, to receive amphetamine tartrate?
> 
> Thx



DEA:)Of the available acids, ortho phosphoric acids can be used to produce phosphate.


----------



## Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton

DEA:) said:


> Hi,
> 
> I need to get back to the sulfuric acid, is there any alternative to crystallize the amphetamine? Would tartaric acid be an option, to receive amphetamine tartrate?
> 
> Thx



DEA:)Do you want to get tartrate or isolate the d-isomer of amphetamine? Here is a description of how to make dextroamphetamine. If you want tartrate, you have to use racemic or meso tartaric acid.


----------



## DEA:)

Thanks HIGGS and Marvin!


----------



## DEA:)

Marvin Popcorn Sutton said:


> Do you want to get tartrate or isolate the d-isomer of amphetamine? Here is a description of how to make dextroamphetamine. If you want tartrate, you have to use racemic or meso tartaric acid.



Marvin Popcorn SuttonI want to get a salt without having sulphuric acid, is the tartrate primarily used with dextroamphetamine? I think I have racemic tartaric acid coming, that's good 

Oh and 2 other issues are on my mind. Since I'm inexperienced, I don't really know if toxic fumes are to expect and that worries me a bit.

The second is on how to get rid of the leftovers from synthesis. Anyone has good, environmental safe options on that? I don't want to poison any fish or something. Found the thread on it 

Thx, stay safe.

Edit: typo


----------



## cyb3r0

Does a helical capacitor perform the same as a helical capacitor?


----------



## William Dampier

cyb3r0 said:


> Does a helical capacitor perform the same as a helical capacitor?



cyb3r0You can use different reflux condensers


----------



## Montecristo

Can I wash p2np with acetone? 
I washed 500g with 1000ml iso but product came out brown still, with iso being black, do I repeat until all the brown is removed?


----------



## savantmic

Thanks a lot for the explanation and the video. I'm looking forward to start my first trial. Just need to know the cost off all items used in this example and the place where I can order . If anyone can help, thanks in advance.


----------



## DEA:)

to all fellow hobbyists curios about trying this, be warned, mercury compounds are pretty dangerous to handle and anyone should do some precautions before doing experiments with those. or you may end up with unsealed bottles full of toxic waste constantly fuming in your way too small apartment, wondering if you're already mad hattin'.

i felt that needed to be said.


----------



## DEA:)

Now to my experiences with very subpar conditions. I only had natrium hydroxid _based_ cleaner. This one also consisting of aluminium pellets and some silica stuff I already forgot about. Since I couldnt buy any, I did some research which concluded that it would maybe not hurt the reaction. With not much chemical knowledge. So I went ahead and the alkali solution looked very different, with leftover salt and Al. Since at the step the alkali sol. is used leftover Al from the reduction would be present anyway, it won't hurt, please correct me. I couldn't really find anything about the other compound other thant its not very reactive.

Also I didn't think well enough about disposal and even storage while synth. I got a bit excited and wanted to try. Additionally I didn't have a proper room, everything small and full of easily inflammable material. So I build an improvised extractor hood and tried to stay on a big glass plate on the floor with everything. Of course I fkin spilled some freaking toxic AlHg solution. Mostly on the plate, I think. I just planned to research disposal beforehand, so I was a bit panicking having no elemental sulphure to at least make it unsolvable, so I just soak most of it some towel and proceeded.

Ok, a bit confused, also I just had max. 1l round glass or erlenmeyer flasks and some even smaller. So I just halfed all the amounts with knowing I should have doing mol-based calculation.

So my AlHg amalgation was working good, with eye balled amount of mercury nitrate. (I didnt wanted to mess more than needed with this compound). Although it took pretty long and it still reacted when pouring water in it over and over, is this normal? So I waited and poured more water until it didn't (so much, dont remember in detail). Might that come of to sticky Al? I cutted it with scissor and it sticked together from pressure. But since it was pretty dark and small bubbles i proceeded.

Then I added the 1p2n, 5g in 50ml iso and 25ml ethyl acetate and was alert for the agressive reaction, but not much happened, after a while I gave heat with water bath, I happened something, but stayed very mildly active so I gave heat until there wasnt anymore reaction. It looked right, although I had no real condenser, i was just holding^^ a bottle over it. The amalgane looked same as before, for me, dunno. Filtered it off and poured the alkali sol in it. Then I collected the base layer with a syringe, way too small, took forever.

The salt preparation then...I forgot to solve the tararic acid I got and just threw some crystals in basically and then reminded it should have been an solution and poured aceton in it (probably not working). But immediately after pouring the acid crystals in, it started to build more crystal, the acetone didnt change a lot. I measured pH and got red, so i over acidized it, damn, i thought get some base in to neutralize again. But actually pouring ethyl acetate in it. Which I realized shortly later when I realized that I only got this stupid mixed natirum hydroxide. I measured the pH again and suprisingly it wasnt that red anymore so I hoped the best and went to filtration for which I used a tea filter and let it dry then.

Suprisingly it looked very white and like it should, so I went ahead to test a bit and it burns so much, that it's quite useless. I hope recristallation will help here. But the yield also is too good to be true, around 3,5g of 5g - is the tartrate heavier than other salts? Also its effect were not as expected, I was pretty tired and have tolerance from prescription, but yeah... dunno. have I just bunk that burns like hell? anyone ideas?

edit: yield is without extracting sludge, just the top layer.

edit2: about quick ideas how to dispose those ugly flasks toxicating my apartment i would be very happy. will a hdpe flask hold all the leftovers mixed together? Probably not mixing would be better, but at this point I need to get it out of my place first of all.


----------



## Ruedi689

My amphetamine just doesn't get power.

Al/hg reduction, who can help me?


----------



## Albul

Ruedi689 said:


> My amphetamine just doesn't get power.
> 
> Al/hg reduction, who can help me?



Ruedi689You mean it's not potent when all done?


----------



## William Dampier

Ruedi689 said:


> My amphetamine just doesn't get power.
> 
> Al/hg reduction, who can help me?



Ruedi689write in PM, maybe incomplete reduction, and you have a lot of oxime in the final


----------



## cyb3r0

I did the synthesis and the yield is 1 gram, why


----------



## cyb3r0

where is the problem ?


----------



## Albul

How much p2np did you start with?


----------



## DannyDani43

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> Video



HIGGS BOSSONHi, with what can i replace mercury nitrate and sulphuric acid?


----------



## Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton

DannyDani43 said:


> Hi, with what can i replace mercury nitrate and sulphuric acid?



DannyDani43Sulfuric acid can be replaced with phosphoric acid.
Mercury nitrate can't be substituted in this synthesis, but it can be easily made.
*
Send me private messages if you need help with this synthesis*


----------



## cyb3r0

Albul said:


> ما مقدار p2np الذي بدأت به؟



Albul10 gm


----------



## cyb3r0

p2np does not react well with mercury nitrate and aluminum. Can I put it on the flame


----------



## Ruedi689

Albul said:


> You mean it's not potent when all done?



AlbulYes


----------



## cyb3r0

Ruedi689 said:


> Yes



Ruedi689I put 10 grams and the yield is 1 gram


----------



## Albul

cyb3r0 said:


> I put 10 grams and the yield is 1 gram



cyb3r0Imo it can be many things like unreacted P2 from not letting the reaction run, overcooling, P2 of low quality, it can be many things.


----------



## Albul

savantmic said:


> Thanks a lot for the explanation and the video. I'm looking forward to start my first trial. Just need to know the cost off all items used in this example and the place where I can order . If anyone can help, thanks in advance.



savantmicNitroetan/p2np from poland, rest from DIFFERENT local suppliers, you might have trouble finding H2SO4 (EU) but I'm sure you can figure it out.Nobody is gonna spoonfeed you harder than this.


----------



## Ruedi689

Are you sure you are amalgamating properly? It requires a bit of experience and practice. Indications are al swims up, transition of small and large bubbles.


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

dk77 said:


> Can mercuric chloride replace mercuric nitrate?



dk77Yes


----------



## AMIODARONchugger

HI!
I am thinking about using a steam distiller in the following manner, i would be pleased if you all would review the method, after done, i will be posting the results.

I prepare the reaction the same way as described in the post,in a 1l rbf, but do not rinse the aluminum with water.

After the reduction is complete, i distill the ipa 85(degrees), and add water, then boil all the water out- im not sure wether it will get rid of the hgcl2-
i will be adding water and will get rid of about 2 liters.

Then basify the remaining solution, then distill the freebase -im not sure about the temperatures (any help)-

then add the acid and dry

SO basically two questions,

will i get rid of the unreacted hgcl2 by distilling the solution, and what temperature would be sutible for distilling the freebase.

thanks for the responses


----------



## Dimitry_Mendeleev

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> Video



HIGGS BOSSONCan Anyone suggest route from Phenethyle amine to Meth.


----------



## G.Patton

Dimitry_Mendeleev said:


> Can Anyone suggest route from Phenethyle amine to Meth.



Dimitry_MendeleevHi, do you want to figure out route from Benzeneethanamine (CAS 64-04-0)?


----------



## cyb3r0

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> 8:51-10:53 - Product acidification - obtaining amphetamine sulfate. To the upper yellow layer collected at the previous stage, a prepared solution of sulphuric acid is added dropwise. Flakes of salt will form with each drop. This stage is very important, it is necessary to carefully monitor the pH, avoiding over-acidification. Acidification is continued until pH 5.5-6 (neutral). The over-acidified product will be pinkish in colour. In case of global over-acidification, the product will be lost.



HIGGS BOSSONThe pH output for me after making the description is higher than 6 Can I modify the mixture and fix the errors or what can I do in this case
Thank you


----------



## MadHatter

cyb3r0 said:


> The pH output for me after making the description is higher than 6 Can I modify the mixture and fix the errors or what can I do in this case
> Thank you



cyb3r0
It is really unclear what you mean here. The description is to add acid until the pH is six. Which part of that is unclear to you?


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

cyb3r0 said:


> The pH output for me after making the description is higher than 6 Can I modify the mixture and fix the errors or what can I do in this case
> Thank you



cyb3r0Add acid to pH 5,5-6


----------



## btcboss2022

Hello,

After 2 attempts I finally get the expected result but I have some doubts, until now I always obtained amphetamine sulfate from "A-Oil"(amphetamine freebase) this oil is obtained "cleaning" P2P(BMK oil).
As you know the smell of that oil and the smell of the final product is very characteristic, in the case of the free base obtained from P2NP process this smell is totally different and the smell of the amphetamine sulfate too is that normal? Is about the route used or I did something wrong?
The PH of my freebase is 13.8(more than good) and the process to get the sulfate works good but I guess that many people could say that is not good quality because the smell is different than the other one.
Any idea to fix that "issue"? I will report the lab results of my amphetamine sulfate asap I will send it to lab next week.
Thanks.


----------



## cyb3r0

DocX said:


> It is really unclear what you mean here. The description is to add acid until the pH is six. Which part of that is unclear to you?



DocX


HIGGS BOSSON said:


> Add acid to pH 5,5-6



Thank you but
My question is that I increased the acetone and sulfuric acid
And I exceeded the required pH. Can I take advantage of what I did and modify the synthesis in order to reach the required number?


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

btcboss2022 said:


> Hello,
> 
> After 2 attempts I finally get the expected result but I have some doubts, until now I always obtained amphetamine sulfate from "A-Oil"(amphetamine freebase) this oil is obtained "cleaning" P2P(BMK oil).
> As you know the smell of that oil and the smell of the final product is very characteristic, in the case of the free base obtained from P2NP process this smell is totally different and the smell of the amphetamine sulfate too is that normal? Is about the route used or I did something wrong?
> The PH of my freebase is 13.8(more than good) and the process to get the sulfate works good but I guess that many people could say that is not good quality because the smell is different than the other one.
> Any idea to fix that "issue"? I will report the lab results of my amphetamine sulfate asap I will send it to lab next week.
> Thanks.



btcboss2022The smell of any amphetamine should be pharmaceutical. If the product specifically smells, it means that you have not completely purified the substance. The main criterion is the activity of the substance. Is your amphetamine good for its pharmacological properties? What color is it?


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> The smell of any amphetamine should be pharmaceutical. If the product specifically smells, it means that you have not completely purified the substance. The main criterion is the activity of the substance. Is your amphetamine good for its pharmacological properties? What color is it?



HIGGS BOSSONIf you have exceeded the amount of acid, then this can be corrected by adding a base or a small amount of alkali. But it only works if you do it right away. Exceed the amount of acid with a pH below 5 is not worth it, it spoils the product, excess acid burns amphetamine, it becomes red or pink.


----------



## btcboss2022

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> If you have exceeded the amount of acid, then this can be corrected by adding a base or a small amount of alkali. But it only works if you do it right away. Exceed the amount of acid with a pH below 5 is not worth it, it spoils the product, excess acid burns amphetamine, it becomes red or pink.



HIGGS BOSSONHello thanks a lot for your answer my final product is totally white and the smell is pharmaceutical that was my doubt because all the amphetamine that I did during years from freebase oil coming from BMK oil has a different smell. I will upload pics tonight.
In other hand can I replace the aluminum foil by aluminum shavings directly? Is a hard job to cut the foil in small pieces in a bigger scale process and buy aluminum shavings is easier.
Thanks again.


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

Most likely, you received a more pure amphetamine.
It is better to use foil. For slicing, I use a paper shredder, it greatly simplifies the process, and you can cut quickly any quantity. The chips do not have such a large surface area for amalgamation, so it will need to be used in much larger quantities, and then filter the unreacted residues before alkali.


----------



## cyb3r0

I have increased acidification can I lighten


----------



## btcboss2022

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> Most likely you received a more pure amphetamine.
> It is better to use foil. For slicing I use a paper shredder, it greatly simplifies the process and you can cut quickly any quantity. The chips do not have such a large surface area for amalgamation, so it will need to be used in much larger quantities, and then filter the unreacted residues before alkali.



HIGGS BOSSONOk thanks you for your tip, I will leave a good tip too about the process, after adding the NaOH solution for the freebase separation is better to wait at least 24 hours for full separation.
I did it like video shows but later I left the solution 1 more day and more freebase was separated and I obtained more yield ;-) I uploaded some pics.
Thanks.


----------



## Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton

cyb3r0 said:


> I have increased acidification can I lighten



cyb3r0Acid-base extraction will help to bring the acidity in order


----------



## Sasha89

Can the recipe be scaled, for example with 50g P2NP: 60g aluminum foil, 500ml IPA 250 GAA. Or do you have to calculate it specifically for the amount of 50g P2NP?

Can 70-80% AA also be used?


----------



## lazkalsai

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> Video



HIGGS BOSSONCan I use Mercury nitrate monohydrate or it must be anhydrous and could someone explain me why sometimes some reagents must be anhydrous and how this affects synthesis.


----------



## William Dampier

lazkalsai said:


> Can I use Mercury nitrate monohydrate or it must be anhydrous and could someone explain me why sometimes some reagents must be anhydrous and how this affects synthesis.



lazkalsaiReaction takes place in the presence of water, there is no problem in this


----------



## lazkalsai

William Dampier said:


> Reaction takes place in the presence of water, there is no problem in this



William DampierThanks for the answer


----------



## cyb3r0

Can I purify amphetamine with cold acetone? What is the correct way to wash it?


----------



## btcboss2022

cyb3r0 said:


> Can I purify amphetamine with cold acetone? What is the correct way to wash it?



cyb3r0You can but I think is better with IPA.


----------



## btcboss2022

btcboss2022 said:


> Ok thanks you for your tip, I will leave a good tip too about the process, after adding the NaOH solution for the freebase separation is better to wait at least 24 hours for full separation.
> I did it like video shows but later I left the solution 1 more day and more freebase was separated and I obtained more yield ;-) I uploaded some pics.
> Thanks.



btcboss2022Hello everybody,

I'm just in shock! 
I sent my final product, that you saw in the pics, to a drug lab and they told me now that has 0% of amphetamine!!!!!
HOW IS THAT POSSIBLE??WHAT OTHER PRODUCT COULD BE???
ANY IDEA OF WHAT COULD HAPPENED?
I hope that's a mistake or something like that, I will send the freebase and the final product to an analysis lab and update you but I'm totally in shock at this moment.
Thanks.


----------



## MadHatter

btcboss2022 said:


> Hello everybody,
> 
> I'm just in shock!
> I sent my final product, that you saw in the pics, to a drug lab and they told me now that has 0% of amphetamine!!!!!
> HOW IS THAT POSSIBLE??WHAT OTHER PRODUCT COULD BE???
> ANY IDEA OF WHAT COULD HAPPENED?
> I hope that's a mistake or something like that, I will send the freebase and the final product to an analysis lab and update you but I'm totally in shock at this moment.
> Thanks.



btcboss2022
If I were you, I would probably send the P2NP you started with for analysis too ...


----------



## Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton

btcboss2022 said:


> Hello everybody,
> 
> I'm just in shock!
> I sent my final product, that you saw in the pics, to a drug lab and they told me now that has 0% of amphetamine!!!!!
> HOW IS THAT POSSIBLE??WHAT OTHER PRODUCT COULD BE???
> ANY IDEA OF WHAT COULD HAPPENED?
> I hope that's a mistake or something like that, I will send the freebase and the final product to an analysis lab and update you but I'm totally in shock at this moment.
> Thanks.



btcboss2022Send us the results of your tests to find out what happened. What reagents were used and in what proportions? Where did you buy the reagents? It looks like amphetamine in the picture, but it could be one of its analogues.


----------



## Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton

cyb3r0 said:


> Can I purify amphetamine with cold acetone? What is the correct way to wash it?



cyb3r0Spill amphetamine with acetone or IPA in a Buechner or Schott funnel under vacuum.


----------



## Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton

dk77 said:


> AL/Hg is a long road that continues to this day Many people use it
> Will there be a problem with the synthesis process?



dk77This is a very simple and common synthesis. Problems may arise, but they are easy to solve. Write here and we will help.


----------



## cyb3r0

Now that the amphetamine has been dried and cleaned with acetone, what is the next step that I do, should I put it in the refrigerator or what should I do?


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

cyb3r0 said:


> Now that the amphetamine has been dried and cleaned with acetone, what is the next step that I do, should I put it in the refrigerator or what should I do?



cyb3r0After cleaning, the powder must be thoroughly dried from traces of solvents, and then packed in a vacuum bag and put away in a dark and dry place, you can in the refrigerator.


----------



## btcboss2022

Marvin Popcorn Sutton said:


> Send us the results of your tests to find out what happened. What reagents were used and in what proportions? Where did you buy the reagents? It looks like amphetamine in the picture, but it could be one of its analogues.



Marvin Popcorn SuttonHello the result is 0% amphetamine, I used all reagents as the process indicates these reagents are pharma grade from professional lab suppliers about proportion I did it with the half of all.
Yesterday I remake the process again with a doctor in chemist and he told me that the final free base is mixed with IPA for this reason is the smell today will be dried and send to lab again.
About the lab result he told me that could be 2 possible explanations:
1- P2NP likes to polymerize and maybe the molecule is "doubled" and for these reason in the lab test is not "detected"
2- The final product could be the reacted p2np itself.
I will update asap.
Thanks.


----------



## Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton

What substance did the analysis show?


----------



## Dimitry_Mendeleev

G.Patton said:


> Hi, do you want to figure out route from Benzeneethanamine (CAS 64-04-0)?



G.Pattonyes


----------



## btcboss2022

Hello,

This lab only say if positive or not in drugs and purity is not detailed report about all content. Thanks.


----------



## G.Patton

Dimitry_Mendeleev said:


> yes



Dimitry_MendeleevI haven't seen this way. I recommend you to read this topic.


----------



## cyb3r0

The acid in the video is 6 degrees of pH. The synthesis I have exceeded this number by a lot, about 9 or 10 degrees. What is the correct way to reduce the acid to return to the required degree of 6 degrees of pH, knowing that I am a beginner in this field. Please explain the steps in an easier way, thank you


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

cyb3r0 said:


> The acid in the video is 6 degrees of pH. The synthesis I have exceeded this number by a lot, about 9 or 10 degrees. What is the correct way to reduce the acid to return to the required degree of 6 degrees of pH, knowing that I am a beginner in this field. Please explain the steps in an easier way, thank you



cyb3r0Replied in a private message


----------



## cyb3r0

Thank you for your reply, my friend. I have another question. Do I put amphetamine in a dry and dark place for how many hours? or day? And what after that? Thank you


----------



## Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton

Storing amphetamine is similar to storing medications: a dark, cool, dry place, in a container with no access to oxygen. In such stable conditions amphetamine is stored for a long time.


----------



## cyb3r0

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> After cleaning, the powder must be thoroughly dried from traces of solvents, and then packed in a vacuum bag and put away in a dark and dry place, you can in the refrigerator.



HIGGS BOSSONIs there another plan after drying the amphetamine in the fridge or is the job done?


----------



## Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton

After cleaning and drying, amphetamine is fully ready for use. And how to store it I wrote above.


----------



## cyb3r0

Marvin Popcorn Sutton said:


> After cleaning and drying, amphetamine is fully ready for use. And how to store it I wrote above.



Marvin Popcorn SuttonThank you so much


----------



## a_king

hello every one i want to synthesis Crystal methamphetamin is there any method or video on how to do it.


----------



## Honolulu98

I have a question, how much purity should sodium hydroxide have? I am finding on the Internet 25% or 50%. I don't know if this would work


----------



## ACAB

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> *In the video synthesis of amphetamine, reagents are used:*
> 10 g 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene;
> 100 ml isopropyl alcohol;
> 50 ml glacial acetic acid;
> 50 g sodium hydroxide;
> 12 g aluminium (in the form of sliced household foil);
> 0.1g mercury nitrate;
> 2 ml sulphuric acid;
> 50 ml acetone.
> 
> *Description of amphetamine synthesis video.*
> Before the start of the synthesis, the laboratory assistant prepared a solution of 10 g of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene in 100 ml of isopropyl alcohol and 50 ml of acetic acid. Also, for the aluminium amalgam, 12 g of household aluminium foil was prepared, which was cut into small pieces with a paper shredder. It can be cut with scissors or torn by hand.
> 
> 0:04-0:40 - Preparation of an aqueous solution of alkali. In this video, it was made in advance so that the solution cools down by the time the main reaction mixture alkalizes. Alkalinization proceeds with the release of heat, and if a fresh hot alkali solution is used, then the exothermic will be more pronounced and forced cooling of the reaction mass will be required.
> 
> 0:46-2:36 - Amalgam of mercury nitrate. Amalgamated aluminium will reduce 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene to amphetamine. During the amalgamation reaction: little gas evolves, a grey precipitate is formed. It is important not to miss the moment when the aluminium is ready: this can be determined by the formation of a grey precipitate and by the increased gas evolution; this happens in 10-15 minutes after the load.
> The water is drained without removing the gauze, the amalgamated aluminium is washed with two portions of cold water. It is worth paying attention to the release of gas bubbles: it is noticed that with the "correct" amalgam, these bubbles are small, and the colour of the liquid is darker; if the bubbles are large and the colour is light, and the reaction looks violent, the amalgam is bad. This is almost certainly due to a lack of mercury salt. Please note that mercury salts are poisonous.
> 
> 2:37-4:28 - The most important part of the process is the reduction of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene on aluminium amalgam. The reaction is exothermic, proceeds with abundant heat release. During the process, it is necessary to carefully monitor the temperature, in case of excessive overheating, to cool in an ice bath, it is allowed to add cold water to the flask. There are cases when the reaction does not start, in which case it is necessary to warm the reaction mass thoroughly, and with a properly prepared amalgam, the reaction begins. The reaction proceeds with the release of the smell of a boiling alcohol and acetic acid mixture. To capture vapours, a spherical irrigation condenser is used, the efficiency of which can be increased by connecting running cold water to it or simply pouring cold water into.
> 
> 5:04 - You can rinse the flask with a little alcohol and rinse the unreacted aluminium with it to collect residues and increase the yield.
> 
> 5:13 - There should be little unreacted aluminium left. By the residues, you can determine the amount of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene reacted.
> 
> 5:16-6:13 - Alkalinization. The reaction proceeds with the release of heat. The remains of unreacted aluminium will additionally enter into reaction with alkali and heat the mixture, as well as create by-products.
> In the process of allowing the mixture to rest after alkalinization, separation into visible layers occurs within 30 minutes. The pH of the top layer should be 11-12.
> 
> 6:18-7:23 - Decantation: collect the top layer containing amphetamine base in alcohol. It can be dried a little with anhydrous magnesium sulfate, and the slag can be additionally extracted with a non-polar solvent (ether, benzene, toluene), the solvent is then evaporated.
> 
> 7:24-8:50 - Preparing a solution of sulphuric acid in acetone. It is made softer acidification of the product to be smoother. If concentrated sulphuric acid is used, there may be local over-acidification of the product.
> 
> 8:51-10:53 - Product acidification - obtaining amphetamine sulfate. To the upper yellow layer collected at the previous stage, a prepared solution of sulphuric acid is added dropwise. Flakes of salt will form with each drop. This stage is very important, it is necessary to carefully monitor the pH, avoiding over-acidification. Acidification is continued until pH 5.5-6 (neutral). The over-acidified product will be pinkish in colour. In case of global over-acidification, the product will be lost.
> 
> 10:55-11:38 - Filtration of amphetamine sulfate from solvents in a Buchner funnel under vacuum. At this stage, the product can be additionally rinsed with cold acetone by pouring it through the funnel with the substance.
> 
> 11:41-12:28 Filtration using improvised means. Any thick fabric can be used as a filter.
> The resulting product is dried in a warm dry place for several hours to remove residual solvents. It is recommended to store it in a vacuum package.
> 
> The yield is 60-70%.



HIGGS BOSSONWhy is no water added before the alkanization and the remaining alcohol and a large part of the water distilled off again? Then alkali is added and the amphetamine is collected with a steam distillation and extracted with ether. Wouldn't this result in a cleaner product? Or rather, what is the objection to adding this step?


----------



## Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton

Honolulu98 said:


> I have a question, how much purity should sodium hydroxide have? I am finding on the Internet 25% or 50%. I don't know if this would work



Honolulu98Are these aqueous solutions of sodium hydroxide? Show me the composition here.


----------



## Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton

Pennywise said:


> Why is no water added before the alkanization and the remaining alcohol and a large part of the water distilled off again? Then alkali is added and the amphetamine is collected with a steam distillation and extracted with ether. Wouldn't this result in a cleaner product? Or rather, what is the objection to adding this step?



PennywiseThere is no such stage in this video. The video was taken from an open source and edited for our forum. But additional steps are not excluded and do not contradict this video. You can make a video of the step you care about and send it to us for posting with comments, or post it yourself.


----------



## ACAB

Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton said:


> There is no such stage in this video. The video was taken from an open source and edited for our forum. But additional steps are not excluded and do not contradict this video. You can make a video of the step you care about and send it to us for posting with comments or post it yourself.



Marvin &quot;Popcorn&quot; SuttonYes, that is correct, but my question was rather meant to ask whether this step is unnecessary and thus does not result in any purification success, the yield drops very sharply or other disadvantages arise, or whether this additional step really improves the purity of the product. I did not want to criticize the video in its content. 
Only to highlight this difference and test its sense.


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

Pennywise said:


> Yes, that is correct, but my question was rather meant to ask whether this step is unnecessary and thus does not result in any purification success, the yield drops very sharply or other disadvantages arise, or whether this additional step really improves the purity of the product. I did not want to criticize the video in its content.
> Only to highlight this difference and test its sense.



PennywiseThe video presents a simplified version of the synthesis, excluding all procedures for additional cleaning and increasing yields. If desired, you can wash the amalgamma with water several times, additionally extract the base of the amphetamine with solvents, distill with the base vapor, do acid-base extraction and separation into isomers.


----------



## ACAB

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> The video presents a simplified version of the synthesis, excluding all procedures for additional cleaning and increasing yelds. If desired, you can wash the amalgamma with water several times, additionally extract the base of the amphetamine with solvents, distill with the base vapor, do acid-base extraction and separation into isomers.



HIGGS BOSSONYes of course there are many other steps that could be taken, just what all really makes sense? Is washing out the mercury salts with water really so good? Where to put the contaminated water? Then rather dispose of it later as a separated solid. The salts dissolve in water, not in ether, so the product will be completely without mercury, also a steam distillation separates the salts. I wonder if AB extraction is still needed after steam distillation and an acetone wash?
That is why I ask the questions. 
Somewhere it was said that steam distillation makes the oil "long", that is, diluted and has less yield. I can not imagine that is correct, but maybe really 10% oil remains, because it is not completely carried along with the steam.
I am just trying to find information to become better.


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

Pennywise said:


> Yes of course there are many other steps that could be taken, just what all really makes sense? Is washing out the mercury salts with water really so good? Where to put the contaminated water? Then rather dispose of it later as a separated solid. The salts dissolve in water, not in ether, so the product will be completely without mercury, also a steam distillation separates the salts. I wonder if AB extraction is still needed after steam distillation and an acetone wash?
> That is why I ask the questions.
> Somewhere it was said that steam distillation makes the oil "long", that is, diluted and has less yield. I can not imagine that is correct, but maybe really 10% oil remains, because it is not completely carried along with the steam.
> I am just trying to find information to become better.



PennywiseWhen I make amphetamine for myself, I thoroughly wash the amalgam from mercury salts with water, and carry out acid-base extraction, and then thoroughly wash the final product with acetone. I think this is enough and distillation with steam for those who like to bother with chemical processes.


----------



## ACAB

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> When I make amphetamine for myself, I thoroughly wash the amalgam from mercury salts with water, and carry out acid-base extraction, and then thoroughly wash the final product with acetone. I think this is enough and distillation with steam for those who like to bother with chemical processes.



HIGGS BOSSONThe first acid-base extraction is always necessary to get the amphetamine base (oil), I actually thought that after salting out there could also be a second AB extraction to purify the product. 
So long thanks for the attention.


----------



## Honolulu98

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> Replied in a private message



HIGGS BOSSONCan you put the answer here? The materials are starting to arrive and I need all the information possible.


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

Honolulu98 said:


> Can you put the answer here? The materials are starting to arrive and I need all the information possible.



Honolulu98Remind me of your questions, I will answer here


----------



## Honolulu98

What is the Büchner measure of the video?


----------



## KHaafii

Nice, So this is for Speed with purity 70%?


----------



## KHaafii

Do you got video of how to create MDMA/XTC?


----------



## Mclssmxxl

KHaafii said:


> Nice, So this is for Speed with purity 70%?



KHaafiiNo, that 70% refers to the yield, meaning 70%(of theory) of your raw material is reduced to your final product.I would wager the unwashed final product is relatively pure, you can test this by weighing your dry, finished product then performing an acetone wash and comparing results.


----------



## KHaafii

Mclssmxxl said:


> No, that 70% refers to the yield, meaning 70%(of theory) of your raw material is reduced to your final product.I would wager the unwashed final product is relatively pure, you can test this by weighing your dry, finished product then performing an acetone wash and comparing results.



MclssmxxlAh okay, by washing the finished product with acetone and then letting it boil or dry? Then what remains is 99% speed, so to speak?


----------



## Mclssmxxl

KHaafii said:


> Ah okay, by washing the finished product with acetone and then letting it boil or dry? Then what remains is 99% speed, so to speak?



KHaafiiSimply dry your finished product, then put it in some filter paper and pour acetone over it.Make sure the whole mass comes into contact with the acetone.Air dry after. This will cause all acetone soluble impurities to dissolve in your acetone, leaving you with somewhat pure amphetamine sulphate.


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

Honolulu98 said:


> What is the Büchner measure of the video?



Honolulu98Funnel diameter 200 mm


----------



## KHaafii

Mclssmxxl said:


> Simply dry your finished product, then put it in some filter paper and pour acetone over it.Make sure the whole mass comes into contact with the acetone.Air dry after. This will cause all acetone soluble impurities to dissolve in your acetone, leaving you with somewhat pure amphetamine sulphate.



MclssmxxlSo how much of your endproduct will you lose because of this? percentage wise?


----------



## MadHatter

KHaafii said:


> So how much of your endproduct will you lose because of this? percentage wise?



KHaafii
None, of course. You wash away the IMPURITIES, so you only loose that which is not amphetamine in the first place. What's left is a more pure product. 
If you wish you can always cut it afterwards, with non-harmful fillers. But it is important to clean your product from potentially harmful side-products and impurities so that the starting material is as pure as possible. So if you loose some weight in the purification process, its not the product that disappears. Its the junk you dont want.


----------



## Honolulu98

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> Funnel diameter 200 mm



HIGGS BOSSON







Which of these measures would it be?


----------



## Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton

The Buchner funnel is selected according to its size. It depends on how much of the suspension needs to be filtered at one time.


----------



## Honolulu98

A couple of questions from an inexperienced chemist.

What is the function of the cooling tube (the reflux condenser)? Why is it put?

Is it covered at the top? I don't know how to appreciate it in the video.

What size of these is the right one?


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

Honolulu98 said:


> A couple of questions from an inexperienced chemist.
> 
> What is the function of the cooling tube (the reflux condenser)? Why is it put?
> 
> Is it covered at the top? I don't know how to appreciate it in the video.
> 
> What size of these is the right one?



Honolulu98The evaporating gases pass through the condenser are cooled, condensed and returned back to the reaction mixture. It is impossible to close the duct, some gases must come out, so as not to pump pressure. To increase the efficiency of the condenser, you can connect cold running water to it, for this it has two outlets. The larger the size of the condenser, the more efficiently it will work. You can take 4-6-8 balls. It is important that the plume of the condenser fits the flask with which it will connect.


----------



## ACAB

I have a question about the alkalinization, 
I have read that one could carry out the neutralization with conventional washing soda, i.e. sodium carbonate Na2CO3, and only then change to NaOH to get to Ph14. This would be cheaper, you can get soda everywhere and it would be more gentle for the product.
Another source, however, says that you should only use NaOH because otherwise the product would be too weak.

Can someone bring clarity into it?


----------



## G.Patton

Pennywise said:


> Another source, however, says that you should only use NaOH because otherwise the product would be too weak.



PennywiseYou can use both ways whatever you want to achieve 14 pH.


----------



## megaduck123

thatfella said:


> Awesome video! I just got some p2np and almost ready to go, I just need to get some sulfuric acid and some Hg. I am chatting to supplier about some Hg and I have a question for you guys , I can get mercury nitrate and chloride, which should i get ? The chloride is cheaper than the nitrate so i am assumming that would be better but Itll last a lifetime so i really dont mind investing in something better ($45 for chloride and $70 for nitrate).
> Also , pure sulfuric acid is not available to public where I am , i think I can get 60% cleaning stuff do you think i could boil/distill this upto a good percentage or should I try harder to buy the 95% stuff?
> Also, I have a 5000ml and 2000ml flat bottom conical flask, how much is the max i could run ?
> also could i use a glass demijohn (21L or 11.5L) and a ice bath and do 100g runs safely? or would this be hard to work with/not able to handle the exothermic reaction?
> Thanks for your time, Happy New Year!



thatfellaHey where did you get P2NP? Do you mind sharing your source, thanks!


----------



## HCL

KHaafii said:


> Do you got video of how to create MDMA/XTC?



KHaafiiThis would be nice.. and very helpful


----------



## cyb3r0

I own these reagents, are they correct and suitable for cooking


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

I own these reagents, are they correct and suitable for cooking
\\\\These are suitable reagents for synthesis.


----------



## diogenes

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> The evaporating gases pass through the condenser are cooled, condensed and returned back to the reaction mixture. It is impossible to close the duct, some gases must come out, so as not to pump pressure. To increase the efficiency of the condenser, you can connect cold running water to it, for this it has two outlets. The larger the size of the condenser, the more efficiently it will work. You can take 4-6-8 balls. It is important that the plume of the condenser fits the flask with which it will connect.



HIGGS BOSSONHi, I haven`t got Allihn condenser right now, is it possible to use another type? Or perhaps a fractionating coloumn (this one does not have cooling though). Does it leave to a lot of decrease in effectiveness?


----------



## Honolulu98

cyb3r0 said:


> Tengo estos reactivos, son correctos y adecuados para cocinar
> 
> View attachment 4322



cyb3r0How or where did you buy the sulfuric acid? It would be very interesting. Thank you!


----------



## Honolulu98

Magnesium sulfate at what time is it used?


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

diogenes said:


> Hi, I haven`t got Allihn condenser right now, is it possible to use another type? Or perhaps a fractionating coloumn (this one does not have cooling though). Does it leave to a lot of decrease in effectiveness?



diogenesOther types of condensers can be used, but are best suited for this reaction Allihn condenser


----------



## Honolulu98

First time and this came out. What do you think?


----------



## brianvene1

Honolulu98 said:


> First time and this came out. What do you think?



Honolulu98Woww congratz man
Please tell me hows goes everything, amounts used, reaction time, lab/house gears used


----------



## Honolulu98

brianvene1 said:


> Woww congratz man
> Please tell me hows goes everything, amounts used, reaction time, lab/house gears used



brianvene1
You have everything in the main post, just follow the steps. I had several failures, when I made the mixture in the flask with the aluminum and the 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene and others. The reaction was quite violent, it was my first experience with chemistry and the truth is that it scared me a bit. The substance remains very solid when I try to pass it through the strainer. I have weighed it and got a 55% yield on the main substance.

But I will leave it tonight to air and tomorrow I will weigh it again to see if the performance has been maintained before.


----------



## Honolulu98

How much could production be scaled with this method without hurting performance by 60%-70%?

What equipment would be needed? I would like to increase production to a minimum of 50g per cooking.

Do all components scale the same?


----------



## Honolulu98

What do you think of my first product? It is the first time that I work with chemistry and the truth is that in smell/appearance I am happy


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

Honolulu98 said:


> What do you think of my first product? It is the first time that I work with chemistry and the truth is that in smell/appearance I am happy



Honolulu98The product looks pretty clean, accept my congratulations. What challenges have you experienced? Maybe there are any questions?


----------



## HEISENBERG

Honolulu98 said:


> I have weighed it and got a 55% yield on the main substance.



Honolulu9870% is a good yield


----------



## Honolulu98

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> The product looks pretty clean, accept my congratulations. What challenges have you experienced? Maybe there are any questions?



HIGGS BOSSON
Challenge as such was to take the first step. Then everything goes fine. Although the reaction when you pour the contents into the aluminum amalgram I have to admit it scares me a bit.

I will continue doing a couple more syntheses with these proportions and quantities to practice.

I asked a couple of questions a little above my post.

How much could production be scaled with this method without hurting performance by 60%-70%?

What equipment would be needed? I would like to increase production to a minimum of 50g per cooking.

Do all components scale the same?


----------



## G.Patton

Honolulu98 said:


> Do all components scale the same?



Honolulu98Yes, congrats with synthesis!


Honolulu98 said:


> What equipment would be needed? I would like to increase production to a minimum of 50g per cooking.


enlarge reaction flask and control temperature properly


Honolulu98 said:


> How much could production be scaled with this method without hurting performance by 60%-70%?


as @William Dampier said before


William Dampier said:


> Max quantity what I know was 2,5 kg P2NP per this reaction, but need good control for temperature. Gradual scaling of the reaction - the best choice. With any problems with scaling, it is better to solve them on smaller quantities. We can help on this path, with feedback.





HIGGS BOSSON said:


> Unfortunately, this reaction scales with a loss in yields. Optimally, I was able to load 100 g of phenyl nitro propene in a 20 L flask, with cooling in a basin with ice water, the solution of p2np in amalgam was added in 3 portions.


----------



## Honolulu98

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> Unfortunately, this reaction scales with a loss in yields. Optimally, I was able to load 100 g of phenyl nitro propene in a 20 L flask, with cooling in a basin with ice water, the solution of p2np in amalgam was added in 3 portions.



HIGGS BOSSON
I don't have much experience but a 20L flask and the amounts to use x10. Won't it be a bit tricky to handle manually?

What would it take? A rotary evaporator in an ice water bath?


----------



## G.Patton

Honolulu98 said:


> What would it take? A rotary evaporator in an ice water bath?



Honolulu98Ice water bath and top stirrer. I showed the example, you can carry out 100g at first and enlarge your synthesis step-by-step to avoid spoiling reagents.


----------



## cyb3r0

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> 0:04-0:40 - Preparation of an aqueous solution of alkali. In this video, it was made in advance so that the solution cools down by the time the main reaction mixture alkalizes. Alkalinization proceeds with the release of heat, and if a fresh hot alkali solution is used, then the exothermic will be more pronounced and forced cooling of the reaction mass will be required.



HIGGS BOSSONCan I use distilled water instead of alkaline water?


----------



## HIGGS BOSSON

cyb3r0 said:


> Can I use distilled water instead of alkaline water?



cyb3r0No, because you need to alkalize the reaction mass


----------



## cyb3r0

This is a mixture of acetic acid, p2np and IPA, but a color appeared from this, why?
Knowing that the p2np was saved in the freezer? What do you think of the mixture?


----------



## William Dampier

cyb3r0 said:


> This is a mixture of acetic acid, p2np and IPA, but a color appeared from this, why?
> Knowing that the p2np was saved in the freezer? What do you think of the mixture?



cyb3r0p2np low quality or mistaken with other reagents


----------



## diogenes

I have been thinking what the right amount of Mercury nitrate is for amalgamation. I haven`t got Mercury nitrate or chloride so I have to use the nitric acid method, however the amount given in the video for Mercury nitrate synthesis is 5ml, which is about 25% of the Thermometer`s mercury content. 

In the video which uses already made dry Mercury nitrate 0.1g Mercury Nitrate is given. This corresponds to roughly 62mg mercury. In the Mercury Nitrate/Thermometer video it is suggested that we use 1/4 of the total amount (5ml out of 20ml), which is at least 250mg Mercury if the thermometer contains 1gr. (normally mercury content is given between 0.6 and 3g). This is quite a substantial difference (X4).


----------



## diogenes

Another question. Can you `overdo` amalgamation e.g. by using too much Mercury nitrate? I have tried to make amalgam, but it somehow disintegrated, the whole thing happened very fast well under 15minutes and most of my foil became `sludge`. Any tips on how to spot the right time and how to make the reaction slower? Sorry if this is something very obvious, but I still managed to get it wrong, even if I was watching for signs like bubbles etc.


----------



## G.Patton

diogenes said:


> I have been thinking what the right amount of Mercury nitrate is for amalgamation. I haven`t got Mercury nitrate or chloride so I have to use the nitric acid method, however the amount given in the video for Mercury nitrate synthesis is 5ml, which is about 25% of the Thermometer`s mercury content.
> 
> In the video which uses already made dry Mercury nitrate 0.1g Mercury Nitrate is given. This corresponds to roughly 62mg mercury. In the Mercury Nitrate/Thermometer video it is suggested that we use 1/4 of the total amount (5ml out of 20ml), which is at least 250mg Mercury if the thermometer contains 1gr. (normally mercury content is given between 0.6 and 3g). This is quite a substantial difference (X4).



diogenesHave you found answers for your questions there Aluminium amalgam (Al/Hg) summary ?


----------



## diogenes

G.Patton said:


> Have you found answers for your questions there Aluminium amalgam (Al/Hg) summary ?



G.PattonHi Patton, in a way yes, as you actually gave a proportion 1300:1 for Al:Hg, which roughly corresponds to the 0.1g of pure Hg(NO3)2 given in the video. On the other hand I still don`t know why fresh Mercury nitrate is given in a different proportion, or (another possibility) where my calculation goes wrong. That thread is very useful thank you for thinking of it.


----------



## G.Patton

diogenes said:


> On the other hand I still don`t know why fresh Mercury nitrate is given in a different proportion, or (another possibility) where my calculation goes wrong.



diogeneswhich one?


----------



## cyb3r0

It was put in the freezer and it became like this, is it useful or is it damaged?


----------



## Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton

cyb3r0 said:


> It was put in the freezer and it became like this, is it useful or is it damaged?



cyb3r0looks terrible
What is it?
It's probably a tainted product.


----------



## cyb3r0

I have a condenser and a flask like this, is it suitable for this synthesis process?


----------



## diogenes

You cannot really reflux with this. I used to have a similar flask/condenser and it was quite tiny as well, so if this is the same size, then you would have to scale down quite a lot. Do you have any other flasks?


----------



## diogenes

cyb3r0 said:


> It was put in the freezer and it became like this, is it useful or is it damaged?



cyb3r0Have you tried recrystallisation? You dissolve it in almost boiling IPA (using just enough hot IPA to dissolve it - this is very important), then let it slowly cool down and when the crystals come out, filter it. Patton has got a topic with detailed instructions.


----------



## diogenes

G.Patton said:


> which one?



G.PattonMy point was that in the HgNO3 amount is different in the video (where the powdered form is used) and the HgNO3 video where it is freshly prepared from Hg and Nitric acid. In the latter 5ml is used, which is about a quarter of the Hg from the thermometer, so way more than the 0.1g pure mercury nitrate (which contains 0.062g of elemental mercury). I don`t know why this difference.


----------



## Louis Pasteur

Hello.

I have a problem with this reaction. I tried performing it twice. I am using lab grade reagents and lab glassware. I scaled down the reagents proportionally, because I use a 1l flask. The issue appears when i try to reduce the P2NP using aluminium amalgam.
I prepare the solution of P2NP, heating it just enought to dissolve the crystals.

I use a coffee grinder to grind the aluminium into little globs - as written in the Aluminium amalgam (Al/Hg) summary.
After adding HgCl2, I pour in 0,5l of cold distilled water. 10 minutes later the reaction begins.

The first time I waited until no more small bubbles were forming and all of the aluminium was floating, the water - cloudy gray. I rinsed it twice with little cold distilled water, drained thoroughly. I added the P2NP solution, no reaction took place. I noticed the P2NP partly crystallized. I tried starting the reaction with heat, but to no avail.

The second time I drained the water from the amalgam when lots of small bubbles appeared and most of the aluminium had surfaced, the water was cloudy gray. Once again - I rinsed it twice with little cold distilled water, drained thoroughly. After the addition of P2NP the result was identical as the first attempt. Heating the mixture did not help.
What am I doing wrong? What should I change? Do you have any suggestions?
Any help will be greatly appreciated


----------



## G.Patton

Louis Pasteur said:


> drained thoroughly.



Louis PasteurMaybe the reason that you dried it. Learn this method.


> Pour 30 ml of water into the flask, insert a thermometer into the left throat of the flask, insert a reflux condenser into the central throat, and insert a dropping funnel with 110 ml of 14% P2NP (it is phenylnitropropene; 1-phenyl-2-methyl-2-nitroethylene) solution into the right throat.


----------



## habacha

KHaafii said:


> Do you got video of how to create MDM



KHaafii


----------



## habacha

Yes its helpful


----------



## diogenes

Louis Pasteur said:


> Hello.
> 
> I have a problem with this reaction. I tried performing it twice. I am using lab grade reagents and lab glassware. I scaled down the reagents proportionally, because I use a 1l flask. The issue appears when i try to reduce the P2NP using aluminium amalgam.
> I prepare the solution of P2NP, heating it just enought to dissolve the crystals.
> 
> I use a coffee grinder to grind the aluminium into little globs - as written in the Aluminium amalgam (Al/Hg) summary.
> After adding HgCl2, I pour in 0,5l of cold distilled water. 10 minutes later the reaction begins.
> 
> The first time I waited until no more small bubbles were forming and all of the aluminium was floating, the water - cloudy gray. I rinsed it twice with little cold distilled water, drained thoroughly. I added the P2NP solution, no reaction took place. I noticed the P2NP partly crystallized. I tried starting the reaction with heat, but to no avail.
> 
> The second time I drained the water from the amalgam when lots of small bubbles appeared and most of the aluminium had surfaced, the water was cloudy gray. Once again - I rinsed it twice with little cold distilled water, drained thoroughly. After the addition of P2NP the result was identical as the first attempt. Heating the mixture did not help.
> What am I doing wrong? What should I change? Do you have any suggestions?
> Any help will be greatly appreciated



Louis PasteurHi,

I`ve got the same problem, except that I have tried at least 6 times. No reaction. If I let it run as long as there is any activity then the Al turns blackish colour and it is greatly reduced in volume, after adding the P2NP/GAC/IPA it `freezes` with some yellow-white precipitate. Warming, even near boiling does not help. If I run the Amalgam until everything floats and most of the bubbling subsides, I get no reaction at all. Now I have a lot of P2NP to recrystallize. Perhaps we are using the wrong foil?


----------



## Louis Pasteur

G.Patton said:


> Maybe the reason that you dried it. Learn this method.



G.PattonThank you for the response, I will try.



diogenes said:


> Hi,
> 
> I`ve got the same problem, except that I have tried at least 6 times. No reaction. If I let it run as long as there is any activity then the Al turns blackish colour and it is greatly reduced in volume, after adding the P2NP/GAC/IPA it `freezes` with some yellow-white precipitate. Warming, even near boiling does not help. If I run the Amalgam until everything floats and most of the bubbling subsides, I get no reaction at all. Now I have a lot of P2NP to recrystallize. Perhaps we are using the wrong foil?


I will change the method and try again. If I manage to find the reason for our problem, I will let you know.


----------



## cyb3r0

5gm P2nP Can mode


----------



## ACAB

If you take too much time to rinse the amalgam and it has completely reacted out, the impetus for the reaction may simply be missing. The change should be made relatively quickly. In the beginning, I omitted rinsing with water and managed to get a reaction every time. Theoretically, you can add the P2NP solution to the aluminum foil and then the mercury salt, completely without using water first. This reaction always succeeds, but should be used very carefully with larger quantities, because the reaction can no longer be cooled to control it. Also, the yields are purely a matter of luck. Here no proper amalgam is formed for reduction, actually one builds so a toxic, corrosive and hot volcano. But rather one warns the people before they themselves go completely clueless to the matter.


----------



## Louis Pasteur

Hello.

I performed the reaction on a smaller scale - 1g of P2NP.

When the aluminium started to break down into smaller pieces(due to stirring), I drained it, then proceeded to add 2ml of cold distilled water. The solution of P2NP was added. Reaction began instantly. No further problems were encountered. The final product came out looking great.


----------



## ACAB

Louis Pasteur said:


> Hello.
> 
> I performed the reaction on a smaller scale - 1g of P2NP.
> 
> When the aluminium started to break down into smaller pieces(due to stirring), I drained it, then proceeded to add 2ml of cold distilled water. The solution of P2NP was added. Reaction began instantly. No further problems were encountered. The final product came out looking great.



Louis PasteurThats sounds good, its just a matter of timing, you will never get the perfect amalgam or achieve the perfect implementation of P2NP. You can also heat the P2NP solution to 50°C so that the crystals do not precipitate so quickly (this prevents reduction with the amalgam), also a small amount of mercury salt should be able to indirectly restart the reaction if there is still aluminum left in the solution. 

Otherwise, practice and practice again, until you know how to do it, it is not really difficult.


----------



## ACAB

cyb3r0 said:


> It was put in the freezer and it became like this, is it useful or is it damaged?



cyb3r0P2NP tends to decompose under the influence of light, heat and oxygen. It becomes brown/reddish. The best storage is at approx. 5°C dark and well closed in a container. Here there is only the possibility of recrystallization with considerable loss of P2NP. 


cyb3r0 said:


> I have a condenser and a flask like this, is it suitable for this synthesis process?


In a very small scale it would be possible yes.


cyb3r0 said:


> 5gm P2nP Can mode


I think 5g P2NP and 6g Alu foil, 50ml IPA and 25 ml glacial acetic acid are to much for a 250ml Flask, try 500-1000ml, or with a smaller 1g P2NP scale.


----------



## Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton

Louis Pasteur said:


> Hello.
> 
> I have a problem with this reaction. I tried performing it twice. I am using lab grade reagents and lab glassware. I scaled down the reagents proportionally, because I use a 1l flask. The issue appears when i try to reduce the P2NP using aluminium amalgam.
> I prepare the solution of P2NP, heating it just enought to dissolve the crystals.
> 
> I use a coffee grinder to grind the aluminium into little globs - as written in the Aluminium amalgam (Al/Hg) summary.
> After adding HgCl2, I pour in 0,5l of cold distilled water. 10 minutes later the reaction begins.
> 
> The first time I waited until no more small bubbles were forming and all of the aluminium was floating, the water - cloudy gray. I rinsed it twice with little cold distilled water, drained thoroughly. I added the P2NP solution, no reaction took place. I noticed the P2NP partly crystallized. I tried starting the reaction with heat, but to no avail.
> 
> The second time I drained the water from the amalgam when lots of small bubbles appeared and most of the aluminium had surfaced, the water was cloudy gray. Once again - I rinsed it twice with little cold distilled water, drained thoroughly. After the addition of P2NP the result was identical as the first attempt. Heating the mixture did not help.
> What am I doing wrong? What should I change? Do you have any suggestions?
> Any help will be greatly appreciated



Louis Pasteur


diogenes said:


> Hi,
> 
> I`ve got the same problem, except that I have tried at least 6 times. No reaction. If I let it run as long as there is any activity then the Al turns blackish colour and it is greatly reduced in volume, after adding the P2NP/GAC/IPA it `freezes` with some yellow-white precipitate. Warming, even near boiling does not help. If I run the Amalgam until everything floats and most of the bubbling subsides, I get no reaction at all. Now I have a lot of P2NP to recrystallize. Perhaps we are using the wrong foil?


1) Make sure that you use aluminum foil with no other elements in it.
2) Test how your foil reacts with the mercury until it completely disappears. Visually evaluate the steps of the amalgamation reaction and remember at which point to wash with water.
3) Perform one reduction reaction without washing the foil and record the results for comparison.
4) Too small pieces of foil promote very violent reaction of Al+H2O and you may not have time to carry out the P2PN reduction reaction. So try to increase the size of the foil pieces.
5) If you have washed the foil for too long, the aluminum may have deactivated and become covered by the oxide film again. In this case, you need to add a portion of mercury nitrate and perform the amalgamation again. Some chemists, seeing that the reduction reaction has stopped and most of the foil remains unreacted, add a pinch of mercury nitrate to the flask with all the reagents loaded, including the P2NP solution, and thus the amalgamation reaction goes directly with the reduction reaction.


----------



## cyb3r0

What is the correct way to recrystallize the p2np ?


----------



## cyb3r0

diogenes said:


> Have you tried recrystallisation? You dissolve it in almost boiling IPA (using just enough hot IPA to dissolve it - this is very important), then let it slowly cool down and when the crystals come out, filter it. Patton has got a topic with detailed instructions.



diogenesWhat temperature do I boil the IPA in it


----------



## ASheSChem

60-65°C


----------



## cyb3r0

How much do I put in IPA 
THANK YOU


----------



## cyb3r0

When sodium hydroxide is poured over the reaction mixture, what is the required pH?


----------



## ASheSChem

cyb3r0 said:


> How much do I put in IPA



cyb3r0just the necessary to dissolve it



cyb3r0 said:


> When sodium hydroxide is poured over the reaction mixture, what is the required pH?


 neutral, PH 6


----------



## cyb3r0

I know this, my friend, but I mean how much pH is required before applying sulfuric acid


----------



## Honolulu98

cyb3r0 said:


> I know this, my friend, but I mean how much pH is required before applying sulfuric acid



cyb3r0I do not understand the question. You have to apply the sulfuric acid with the acetone and with that mixture lower the pH of the amphetamine dissolved in alcohol until reaching a pH of 6.


----------



## cyb3r0

If we reach pH 6, does that mean that the synthesis is correct and the product is amphetamine? How do I know that the product is amphetamine?


----------



## cyb3r0

I use tap water and its alkalinity is weak.. What is the appropriate way to increase the alkalinity of the reaction mixture


----------



## Honolulu98

cyb3r0 said:


> I use tap water and its alkalinity is weak.. What is the appropriate way to increase the alkalinity of the reaction mixture



cyb3r0Are you using tap water to perform the synthesis? You have to use sodium hydroxide and distilled/demineralized water. Normal or tap water will be contaminated and I don't know if it will work for synthesis.

The product looks like Amphetamine to the naked eye and with the smell. If you have another color that is not white, it will also be amphetamine but contaminated. But really with the smell if you've ever had amphetamine it will be very familiar to you.

I already have 4 synthetic amphetamines and the truth is that I have to say that because I have not had experience with chemistry. I am very satisfied with the results and yields. I already have 4 synthetic amphetamines and the truth is that I have never had experience with chemistry. I am very satisfied with the results and yields.


----------



## Honolulu98

I have a question. In the last step of dissolving amphetamine in alcohol and mixing it with acetone/sulfuric acid I have a little problem.

I measure the pH until I try to get a pH of 6. But it ends up with a too dense "paste" that prevents me from measuring the pH correctly. Do you know why it could happen or what I should do?

I obtained the sulfuric acid by evaporating it with a battery electrolyte water bath and perhaps the purity of the acid is about 90%-95%. Could this be the reason?

Thank you very much. This forum is wonderful.


----------



## ACAB

Honolulu98 said:


> I have a question. In the last step of dissolving amphetamine in alcohol and mixing it with acetone/sulfuric acid I have a little problem.
> 
> I measure the pH until I try to get a pH of 6. But it ends up with a too dense "paste" that prevents me from measuring the pH correctly. Do you know why it could happen or what I should do?
> 
> I obtained the sulfuric acid by evaporating it with a battery electrolyte water bath and perhaps the purity of the acid is about 90%-95%. Could this be the reason?
> 
> Thank you very much. This forum is wonderful.



Honolulu98If the solution becomes too thick during the titration, this is due to the amount of salt that precipitates, simply add more solvent to dilute it, this does not really affect the pH value.

If your sulfuric acid is contaminated, it is most likely by water. Amphetamine sulfate dissolves in water, which means you will have a loss in yield, but it should be minimal.


----------



## ACAB

cyb3r0 said:


> When sodium hydroxide is poured over the reaction mixture, what is the required pH?



cyb3r0


cyb3r0 said:


> I know this, my friend, but I mean how much pH is required before applying sulfuric acid


>pH13 in best case, but read the instructions.


cyb3r0 said:


> If we reach pH 6, does that mean that the synthesis is correct and the product is amphetamine? How do I know that the product is amphetamine?


If you have followed this synthesis and drop sulfuric acid into your solution at the end, then amphetamine sulfate will precipitate there until you reach pH6, anything below that means loss in yield and further impurities.
In general, the product should still be purified after synthesis.


cyb3r0 said:


> I use tap water and its alkalinity is weak.. What is the appropriate way to increase the alkalinity of the reaction mixture


Yes, tap water is also for drinking, why should that also be alkaline? How about going to a drugstore, getting distilled water and sodium hydroxide to make a lye and get your solution alkaline? But that is also in the instructions.


----------



## lazkalsai

I was wondering about aluminium sheet instead of foil, BHBlueberry used them in his version of this synthesis suggesting that (I think 5 mm thick) sheet will be better, do you know something about this option?

Link to His synthesis where he uses sheet:





Amphetamine sulphate by P2NP reduction - Polish Method (VIDEO)


Hey ya all :) I've created this method myself - the source was this pdf anyone can find when typing "amphetamine from p2np" in google. Using my technique - you are reducing 100% of P2NP and you prevent Hg for getting into the final product. I'm not selling my product (and it is strong)...




bbgate.com


----------



## Gale

I want to make a sulfuric acid solution for MDMA sulphate. How can I make a solution that I can use for salting the base? Make sulphuric acid solution with IPA then dry the IPA with mgs04? will this be ok.


----------



## cyb3r0

Thank you for your interaction and assistance. The important question now is how do I know the method of recoil, and when the recoil occurs


----------



## Honolulu98

Hi guys. What do you think of this vacuum pump to filter amphetamine?

It could work?










VEVOR VEVOR Bomba de Vacío, 2,5 CFM Bomba de Vacío para Aire Acondicionado, 1.440 RPM Bomba de Vacío de Etapa Única, Juego de Bomba de Vacío con Capacidad de Aceite 220 ml para Doméstico e Industria, etc. | VEVOR ES


Descubra VEVOR Bomba de Vacío, 2,5 CFM Bomba de Vacío para Aire Acondicionado, 1.440 RPM Bomba de Vacío de Etapa Única, Juego de Bomba de Vacío con Capacidad de Aceite 220 ml para Doméstico e Industria, etc., Base a Prueba de Golpes y Resistente al Desgaste y Diseño Trasero Anti-flujo de Aceite...




www.vevor.es


----------



## Gale

lazkalsai said:


> I was wondering about aluminium sheet instead of foil, BHBlueberry used them in his version of this synthesis suggesting that (I think 5 mm thick) sheet will be better, do you know something about this option?
> 
> Link to His synthesis where he uses sheet:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Amphetamine sulphate by P2NP reduction - Polish Method (VIDEO)
> 
> 
> Hey ya all :) I've created this method myself - the source was this pdf anyone can find when typing "amphetamine from p2np" in google. Using my technique - you are reducing 100% of P2NP and you prevent Hg for getting into the final product. I'm not selling my product (and it is strong)...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bbgate.com



lazkalsaiIf you want to do bigger reactions idk if you can use foil, you will need thicker aluminium like aluminium sheet. The reason for is the foil being so thin it reacts quickly and while its good for smaller scale, its not good big scale, you need it all to be reacting over a longer period of time


----------



## ACAB

Honolulu98 said:


> Hi guys. What do you think of this vacuum pump to filter amphetamine?
> 
> It could work?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> VEVOR VEVOR Bomba de Vacío, 2,5 CFM Bomba de Vacío para Aire Acondicionado, 1.440 RPM Bomba de Vacío de Etapa Única, Juego de Bomba de Vacío con Capacidad de Aceite 220 ml para Doméstico e Industria, etc. | VEVOR ES
> 
> 
> Descubra VEVOR Bomba de Vacío, 2,5 CFM Bomba de Vacío para Aire Acondicionado, 1.440 RPM Bomba de Vacío de Etapa Única, Juego de Bomba de Vacío con Capacidad de Aceite 220 ml para Doméstico e Industria, etc., Base a Prueba de Golpes y Resistente al Desgaste y Diseño Trasero Anti-flujo de Aceite...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.vevor.es



Honolulu98A vacuum pump always helps in the lab, especially when you have to do a lot of filtering and drying.
The cheapest purchase will probably be a water jet pump, but it consumes a lot of water.

With a vacuum pump, you should pay attention to the resistance and think about the purchase of a cold trap, which additionally protects the pump from chemicals gases. 


cyb3r0 said:


> Thank you for your interaction and assistance. The important question now is how do I know the method of recoil, and when the recoil occurs


What is meant by method recoil?


Gale said:


> I want to make a sulfuric acid solution for MDMA sulphate. How can I make a solution that I can use for salting the base? Make sulphuric acid solution with IPA then dry the IPA with mgs04? will this be ok.


It is always better to use as anhydrous solvent as possible if the obtained salt dissolves well in water, it increases the yield.


----------



## cyb3r0

When the mixture reacts, there is no reflux process, why?


----------



## Gale

Pennywise said:


> It is always better to use as anhydrous solvent as possible if the obtained salt dissolves well in water, it increases the yield.



PennywiseOk to dry the ipa/H₂SO₄ with MgSO₄? I think the what I can get is 92-96% h2s04


----------



## cyb3r0

. When reducing the amount of p2np to 5g. What are the correct proportions of other reagents.


----------



## Mclssmxxl

cyb3r0 said:


> . When reducing the amount of p2np to 5g. What are the correct proportions of other reagents.



cyb3r0They scale linearly, so half of everything.Reflux is not obligatory to happen for reaction to take place, if you control the reaction properly in an appropriate flask with a beefy condenser it won’t reach reflux even, especially aith 5g.If you reaction is not starting at all however with the addition of your propene, I would maybe check : if amalagam was done correctly, the purity of my raw materials (especially the propene).And ffs use distilled.


----------



## ACAB

Gale said:


> Ok to dry the ipa/H₂SO₄ with MgSO₄? I think the what I can get is 92-96% h2s04



GaleNormally, one does not dry concentrated sulfuric acid at all, but uses it to dry itself.

If I mix 1ml H2SO4 96% and 5ml dry IPA for titration, I have approx. 0.04ml water in the solution. In such a constillation I think there is no reason to use desiccant.
It will certainly not do any harm, but it is questionable whether it will work.


----------



## Gale

cyb3r0 said:


> When the mixture reacts, there is no reflux process, why?



cyb3r0
If it doesn't start bulbbing and heating up with foil then sum-ting-wong


----------



## Gale

I've been having issues with PMK all/hg reduction, I have a large amount of unreacted aluminium leftover after a 240g ketone rxn. The vessel heated on its own with reflux to around 65c and dropped to 40c over the course of 90mins. Then heat was applied to bring it up to 50-60c for 3-4 hours.

Pie pans were used and cut into 1 cm small strips and 10% excess was added to osmium writeup. After basifying the ai was reduced. Then goods extracted with toluene and washed with naoh solution. I'm hoping for atleast 100g yeild. If not then I'm fucked and will have to save some more money for another rxn and just used foil so it gets eaten.

I recall there being maybe 50% ai leftover. This was 100% aluminium disposable baking pans. I waited about 45-60mins for amalgamation to start and only a few pieces were floating, I assumed its because its thicker ai..but there was bubbling going on the the solution had a silvery appearance.. It seemed ready. And the rxn heated to 65c on its own so I'm sure it was ready...maybe I just have to gas and see the yeild...I have a feeling it going to be bad lol. D
oes osmium already add extra aluminium? Maybe I added excess on excess lol. Anyways I think thick foil would be OK for 200-300g reduction. I wish I realized this and stuck with foil on these larger rxns...but this is how I learn. If the reaction went to 65c with Al pans then with foil it might be too exothermic right? So my Al thickness might be on point and maybe I have to let amalgamate longer until all pieces are floating? it seemed to me like it was going and exothermic reaction kicked in.

If been wasting quite a bit of material and time on trying to scale up and each time I'm playing around with thicker Al, when I think I should stick to maybe a thicker foil, that way it all gets consumed and the temps may go up to like 75c but can cool it to keep under 70 no problem. If I knew about the NMF route before preparing for osmium route then I would being using NMF and I think I'd have less problems.
I will report back with yeild on the pie pan run.


----------



## cyb3r0

The product came out with me like this as hair!


----------



## cyb3r0

Gale said:


> If it doesn't start bulbbing and heating up with foil then sum-ting-wong



GaleSorry what do you mean by sum-ting-wong


----------



## cyb3r0

What is the thickness of aluminum foil suitable?


----------



## Gale

cyb3r0 said:


> What is the thickness of aluminum foil suitable?



cyb3r0IMO any Al thick foil is good depending on your scale. Store bought heavy duty foil for doing small scale and even bigger reactions but the All granules or Al fine CNC shavings looks nice.

I'm.not familiar with amphetamine but that could be your drying agent possibly. If its your yeild than it looks OK to me.


----------



## cyb3r0

Did I use any capacitors in this synthesis, or are there specific capacitors? Thank you


----------



## AstekPL

the synthesis was carried out as in the movie, the product has no power. What to do?


----------



## William Dampier

AstekPL said:


> the synthesis was carried out as in the movie, the product has no power. What to do?



AstekPLDoes the product have a salty taste or is it bitter?


----------



## cyb3r0

When you taste the product at first, it will taste very salty, and in the end, amphetamine taste appears


----------



## Catweazle

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> *In the video synthesis of amphetamine, reagents are used:*
> 10 g 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene;
> 100 ml isopropyl alcohol;
> 50 ml glacial acetic acid;
> 50 g sodium hydroxide;
> 12 g aluminium (in the form of sliced household foil);
> 0.1g mercury nitrate;
> 2 ml sulphuric acid;
> 50 ml acetone.
> 
> *Description of amphetamine synthesis video.*
> Before the start of the synthesis, the laboratory assistant prepared a solution of 10 g of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene in 100 ml of isopropyl alcohol and 50 ml of acetic acid. Also, for the aluminium amalgam, 12 g of household aluminium foil was prepared, which was cut into small pieces with a paper shredder. It can be cut with scissors or torn by hand.
> 
> 0:04-0:40 - Preparation of an aqueous solution of alkali. In this video, it was made in advance so that the solution cools down by the time the main reaction mixture alkalizes. Alkalinization proceeds with the release of heat, and if a fresh hot alkali solution is used, then the exothermic will be more pronounced and forced cooling of the reaction mass will be required.
> 
> 0:46-2:36 - Amalgam of mercury nitrate. Amalgamated aluminium will reduce 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene to amphetamine. During the amalgamation reaction: little gas evolves, a grey precipitate is formed. It is important not to miss the moment when the aluminium is ready: this can be determined by the formation of a grey precipitate and by the increased gas evolution; this happens in 10-15 minutes after the load.
> The water is drained without removing the gauze, the amalgamated aluminium is washed with two portions of cold water. It is worth paying attention to the release of gas bubbles: it is noticed that with the "correct" amalgam, these bubbles are small, and the colour of the liquid is darker; if the bubbles are large and the colour is light, and the reaction looks violent, the amalgam is bad. This is almost certainly due to a lack of mercury salt. Please note that mercury salts are poisonous.
> 
> 2:37-4:28 - The most important part of the process is the reduction of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene on aluminium amalgam. The reaction is exothermic, proceeds with abundant heat release. During the process, it is necessary to carefully monitor the temperature, in case of excessive overheating, to cool in an ice bath, it is allowed to add cold water to the flask. There are cases when the reaction does not start, in which case it is necessary to warm the reaction mass thoroughly, and with a properly prepared amalgam, the reaction begins. The reaction proceeds with the release of the smell of a boiling alcohol and acetic acid mixture. To capture vapours, a spherical irrigation condenser is used, the efficiency of which can be increased by connecting running cold water to it or simply pouring cold water into.
> 
> 5:04 - You can rinse the flask with a little alcohol and rinse the unreacted aluminium with it to collect residues and increase the yield.
> 
> 5:13 - There should be little unreacted aluminium left. By the residues, you can determine the amount of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene reacted.
> 
> 5:16-6:13 - Alkalinization. The reaction proceeds with the release of heat. The remains of unreacted aluminium will additionally enter into reaction with alkali and heat the mixture, as well as create by-products.
> In the process of allowing the mixture to rest after alkalinization, separation into visible layers occurs within 30 minutes. The pH of the top layer should be 11-12.
> 
> 6:18-7:23 - Decantation: collect the top layer containing amphetamine base in alcohol. It can be dried a little with anhydrous magnesium sulfate, and the slag can be additionally extracted with a non-polar solvent (ether, benzene, toluene), the solvent is then evaporated.
> 
> 7:24-8:50 - Preparing a solution of sulphuric acid in acetone. It is made softer acidification of the product to be smoother. If concentrated sulphuric acid is used, there may be local over-acidification of the product.
> 
> 8:51-10:53 - Product acidification - obtaining amphetamine sulfate. To the upper yellow layer collected at the previous stage, a prepared solution of sulphuric acid is added dropwise. Flakes of salt will form with each drop. This stage is very important, it is necessary to carefully monitor the pH, avoiding over-acidification. Acidification is continued until pH 5.5-6 (neutral). The over-acidified product will be pinkish in colour. In case of global over-acidification, the product will be lost.
> 
> 10:55-11:38 - Filtration of amphetamine sulfate from solvents in a Buchner funnel under vacuum. At this stage, the product can be additionally rinsed with cold acetone by pouring it through the funnel with the substance.
> 
> 11:41-12:28 Filtration using improvised means. Any thick fabric can be used as a filter.
> The resulting product is dried in a warm dry place for several hours to remove residual solvents. It is recommended to store it in a vacuum package.
> 
> The yield is 60-70%.



HIGGS BOSSONHi
Would dcm or chloroform be a suitable solvent.


----------



## ASheSChem

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> 5:04 - You can rinse the flask with a little alcohol and rinse the unreacted aluminium with it to collect residues and increase the yield.



HIGGS BOSSONIsopropanol is ok i presume ? 
we rinse the ballon, and put the the result on the fine sieve for going with the rest before alkalinization ?
no need to evaporate isopropanol or something like that ?  (any idea of max isopropanol quantity we can use for the rinse?)


----------



## diogenes

cyb3r0 said:


> When you taste the product at first, it will taste very salty, and in the end, amphetamine taste appears



cyb3r0It can be Sodium Sulphate... Your reaction might not have gone all the way through. I had the same issue in the beginning, had Na2SO4 as well and others. The solution was not to rinse the amalgam (just draining the water) and also my rule for the readiness is when all the Al comes up to the surface and you can also hear a sizzling sound. There are also small bubbles appearing. This is when I consider ithe amalgam ready, and this solved the lack of reaction problem. My yield varies usually only around 50%, but never had a non-reactive amalgam since then.


----------



## cyb3r0

diogenes said:


> It can be Sodium Sulphate... Your reaction might not have gone all the way through. I had the same issue in the beginning, had Na2SO4 as well and others. The solution was not to rinse the amalgam (just draining the water) and also my rule for the readiness is when all the Al comes up to the surface and you can also hear a sizzling sound. There are also small bubbles appearing. This is when I consider ithe amalgam ready, and this solved the lack of reaction problem. My yield varies usually only around 50%, but never had a non-reactive amalgam since then.



diogenesExcuse me . But we did not use sodium sulfate in this synthesis. What is its relationship to the topic? If you would allow, please explain to me more. I did not understand the idea. Thank you


----------



## diogenes

cyb3r0 said:


> Excuse me . But we did not use sodium sulfate in this synthesis. What is its relationship to the topic? If you would allow, please explain to me more. I did not understand the idea. Thank you



cyb3r0Hi, I`m not an expert by any means, so others might confirm or correct this, but when you add sulphuric acid (H2SO4) to the mixture if there is no amphetamine base present (i.e. the reduction did not happen) then the SO4 might form a salt with the Sodium (Na). The Sodium is present in the solution from the NaOH added earlier.


----------



## diogenes

To the experts: What happens if we use more Al foil in the reaction? Could it increase the yield?


----------



## ACAB

diogenes said:


> It can be Sodium Sulphate... Your reaction might not have gone all the way through. I had the same issue in the beginning, had Na2SO4 as well and others. The solution was not to rinse the amalgam (just draining the water) and also my rule for the readiness is when all the Al comes up to the surface and you can also hear a sizzling sound. There are also small bubbles appearing. This is when I consider ithe amalgam ready, and this solved the lack of reaction problem. My yield varies usually only around 50%, but never had a non-reactive amalgam since then.



diogenesYes, that will always works right, but you will never get the same yield on a regular basis because it is a gamble unless you have a decent amalgam. After all, I have the same problem. An optimal reaction would be to convert the aluminum completely into amalgam, i.e. add exactly the right amount of mercury salt and then after the reduction, have no solid aluminum/amalgam left in the flask, because thus everything has been converted with P2NP.
It simply makes more sense to wait the first time after adding mercury salt until it has reacted completely, i.e. no more bubbles are formed, and then to start the reduction of P2NP with new mercury salt and residual aluminum that is certainly still in the flask. If the reduction stops and there is still aluminum in the flask, a further addition of mercury salt would be necessary to convert these residues with P2NP. 
I think this is the way we should go, after all I have learned here.


----------



## diogenes

Pennywise said:


> Yes, that will always works right, but you will never get the same yield on a regular basis because it is a gamble unless you have a decent amalgam. After all, I have the same problem. An optimal reaction would be to convert the aluminum completely into amalgam, i.e. add exactly the right amount of mercury salt and then after the reduction, have no solid aluminum/amalgam left in the flask, because thus everything has been converted with P2NP.
> It simply makes more sense to wait the first time after adding mercury salt until it has reacted completely, i.e. no more bubbles are formed, and then to start the reduction of P2NP with new mercury salt and residual aluminum that is certainly still in the flask. If the reduction stops and there is still aluminum in the flask, a further addition of mercury salt would be necessary to convert these residues with P2NP.
> I think this is the way we should go, after all I have learned here.



PennywiseCorrect me if I`m wrong, but we cannot wait until the reaction is complete, because then all the Aluminium will be used up and convertec in to Al:














There must be an `ideal moment` when most of the Al is in HgAl form which is the form capable of reducing P2NP to amphetamine base. It is the generation of H2 which causes the bubbles and it will be present until all the Al is converted into 2Al(OH)3 rendering the Al unreactive. 

Perhaps the initial amount of HgNO3 (or HgCl2) needs to be carefully chosen so that the Hg will be enough to have the maximum amount of HgAl at one point. If there is no foil left at all at the end of the reduction of the P2NP then there is a risk of leaving unreacted P2NP.


----------



## ACAB

diogenes said:


> There must be an `ideal moment` when most of the Al is in HgAl form which is the form capable of reducing P2NP to amphetamine base. It is the generation of H2 which causes the bubbles and it will be present until all the Al is converted into 2Al(OH)3 rendering the Al unreactive.



diogenesI think that no more bubbles will form as soon as the part of the aluminum has reacted that was accessible, there are no molecules floating in the water, aluminum is a metal that must be removed in layers, figuratively speaking. This means that there is still enough convertible aluminum under the layer to react to HgAl and then to reduce the P2NP, i.e. the chain reaction comes to an end as soon as the surface of the foil has been scratched. Then the water is drained off and the amalgam forms an oxide layer in conjunction with the atmospheric oxygen, which makes the amalgam non-reactive again. Our P2NP solution is added and we do not have a reactive amalgam available, so we again add a lot of mercury salt which starts the reaction and reduction, visible by the many small bubbles that appear until the P2NP is reacted.
We usually have an excess of foil in there to convert all the P2NP, but if there is a lot more aluminum left at the end, the reduction is not complete and not all the P2NP has been converted which means less yield and that means we have not formed enough amalgam to convert it all. What we do if we don't wait until no more bubbles rise during amalgamation.
My opinion, I don't know it.


diogenes said:


> Perhaps the initial amount of HgNO3 (or HgCl2) needs to be carefully chosen so that the Hg will be enough to have the maximum amount of HgAl at one point. If there is no foil left at all at the end of the reduction of the P2NP then there is a risk of leaving unreacted P2NP.


No aluminum and no feasible P2NP would be the theoretical optimum, which will never be achieved.


----------



## alper1925

Thanks


----------



## BlueSolomon

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> *In the video synthesis of amphetamine, reagents are used:*
> 10 g 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene;
> 100 ml isopropyl alcohol;
> 50 ml glacial acetic acid;
> 50 g sodium hydroxide;
> 12 g aluminium (in the form of sliced household foil);
> 0.1g mercury nitrate;
> 2 ml sulphuric acid;
> 50 ml acetone.
> 
> *Description of amphetamine synthesis video.*
> Before the start of the synthesis, the laboratory assistant prepared a solution of 10 g of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene in 100 ml of isopropyl alcohol and 50 ml of acetic acid. Also, for the aluminium amalgam, 12 g of household aluminium foil was prepared, which was cut into small pieces with a paper shredder. It can be cut with scissors or torn by hand.
> 
> 0:04-0:40 - Preparation of an aqueous solution of alkali. In this video, it was made in advance so that the solution cools down by the time the main reaction mixture alkalizes. Alkalinization proceeds with the release of heat, and if a fresh hot alkali solution is used, then the exothermic will be more pronounced and forced cooling of the reaction mass will be required.
> 
> 0:46-2:36 - Amalgam of mercury nitrate. Amalgamated aluminium will reduce 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene to amphetamine. During the amalgamation reaction: little gas evolves, a grey precipitate is formed. It is important not to miss the moment when the aluminium is ready: this can be determined by the formation of a grey precipitate and by the increased gas evolution; this happens in 10-15 minutes after the load.
> The water is drained without removing the gauze, the amalgamated aluminium is washed with two portions of cold water. It is worth paying attention to the release of gas bubbles: it is noticed that with the "correct" amalgam, these bubbles are small, and the colour of the liquid is darker; if the bubbles are large and the colour is light, and the reaction looks violent, the amalgam is bad. This is almost certainly due to a lack of mercury salt. Please note that mercury salts are poisonous.
> 
> 2:37-4:28 - The most important part of the process is the reduction of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene on aluminium amalgam. The reaction is exothermic, proceeds with abundant heat release. During the process, it is necessary to carefully monitor the temperature, in case of excessive overheating, to cool in an ice bath, it is allowed to add cold water to the flask. There are cases when the reaction does not start, in which case it is necessary to warm the reaction mass thoroughly, and with a properly prepared amalgam, the reaction begins. The reaction proceeds with the release of the smell of a boiling alcohol and acetic acid mixture. To capture vapours, a spherical irrigation condenser is used, the efficiency of which can be increased by connecting running cold water to it or simply pouring cold water into.
> 
> 5:04 - You can rinse the flask with a little alcohol and rinse the unreacted aluminium with it to collect residues and increase the yield.
> 
> 5:13 - There should be little unreacted aluminium left. By the residues, you can determine the amount of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene reacted.
> 
> 5:16-6:13 - Alkalinization. The reaction proceeds with the release of heat. The remains of unreacted aluminium will additionally enter into reaction with alkali and heat the mixture, as well as create by-products.
> In the process of allowing the mixture to rest after alkalinization, separation into visible layers occurs within 30 minutes. The pH of the top layer should be 11-12.
> 
> 6:18-7:23 - Decantation: collect the top layer containing amphetamine base in alcohol. It can be dried a little with anhydrous magnesium sulfate, and the slag can be additionally extracted with a non-polar solvent (ether, benzene, toluene), the solvent is then evaporated.
> 
> 7:24-8:50 - Preparing a solution of sulphuric acid in acetone. It is made softer acidification of the product to be smoother. If concentrated sulphuric acid is used, there may be local over-acidification of the product.
> 
> 8:51-10:53 - Product acidification - obtaining amphetamine sulfate. To the upper yellow layer collected at the previous stage, a prepared solution of sulphuric acid is added dropwise. Flakes of salt will form with each drop. This stage is very important, it is necessary to carefully monitor the pH, avoiding over-acidification. Acidification is continued until pH 5.5-6 (neutral). The over-acidified product will be pinkish in colour. In case of global over-acidification, the product will be lost.
> 
> 10:55-11:38 - Filtration of amphetamine sulfate from solvents in a Buchner funnel under vacuum. At this stage, the product can be additionally rinsed with cold acetone by pouring it through the funnel with the substance.
> 
> 11:41-12:28 Filtration using improvised means. Any thick fabric can be used as a filter.
> The resulting product is dried in a warm dry place for several hours to remove residual solvents. It is recommended to store it in a vacuum package.
> 
> The yield is 60-70%.



HIGGS BOSSONHey, buddy thank you very much for this vid, really amazing, I am not a chemist so I have a ton the doubts the most important being: I don't want to fuck with aluminum on the final product and less with any mercury salts, so my question: if the point of this is making the reduction using free hydrogen, why not use a hydrogen cylinder and sparge hydrogen on the isopropanol + p2np solution. I know this question must be super silly, but as I told you I am not a chemist and I would like to avoid doing the amalgam thing, infinite thanks to all you on this forum and specially the guy whom upload the vid + instructions.


----------



## MadHatter

Hydrogen gas is BAAD, mmkey? Goes boom very easily. And the point is not the hydrogen gas, it's the reduction that is the point. The hydrogen gas is produced as a side product of that reaction.
There is another route using Sodium Borohydride and Copper Chloride. Suitable for smaller batches.
HERE IT IS
No mercury, no aluminum. 

But this is the easiest way. What's your problem with aluminum? It's not toxic. 
Mercury nitrate is nasty, sure, but if you rinse and recrystallize your final product well, you shouldn't have any residue enough to poison anyone even by i.v use.


----------



## diogenes

Mercury nitrate is soluble in Acetone, so an acetone wash at the end should eliminate the rest. It is also insoluble in alcohols so there should not be much in the final product anyway.


----------



## aladdin_2

i also want some information on what step(s) of this procedure prevent mercury contamination in the final product, and what further steps can be done to prevent possible contamination? all writeups of similar al/hg reductions always stress the danger of handling water soluble mercury salts but almost NEVER discuss possible contamination... why?




diogenes said:


> Mercury nitrate is soluble in Acetone, so an acetone wash at the end should eliminate the rest. It is also insoluble in alcohols so there should not be much in the final product anyway.



diogenessure, but am i incorrect and thinking that mercury nitrate is not regenerated at the end of the reduction? it should be mercury metal that remains after all of the aluminum has been consumed and converted to Al(OH)3. assuming the prepared amalgam in the beginning was washed well to remove the mercury salt, the possible sources of mercury contamination would be (1) mercury metal present at reaction end and (2) unreacted amalgamated mercury.

given the ubiquity of this procedure and a lack of mercury poisoning cases in the news related to use of substances prepared in this method, it seems the procedure is fairly airtight with respect to mercury contamination in final product, but can someone explain why? i can understand any elemental mercury being fairly easy to remove given its density as a liquid, but what about the possibility of unreacted amalgamated mercury?


----------



## diogenes

aladdin_2 said:


> all writeups of similar al/hg reductions always stress the danger of handling water soluble mercury salts but almost NEVER discuss possible contamination... why?



aladdin_2Because the risk of poisoning is way higher during the synthesis when handling toxic mercury salts than when consuming the final product. Aluminium amalgam is very reactive and is already changed into mercury at the end of the synthesis. Elemental mercury is not too toxic when ingested orally, it is much worse to inhale its fumes.

Whenever I tried to wash the amalgam (even once let alone X3) the reaction stopped, perhaps I am still not choosing the right moment and there could be a point when the amalgam would even survive washing (it would be extremely helpful and much appreciated if someone more experienced posted pictures or a short video showing sings of this ideal moment).

On the other hand I see very little chance of the Mercury salt getting into the final product. It is not soluble in IPA and then there is Acetone. I usually wash two times during the filtering process. There is very little chance of contamination.

Two related questions to the experts/anyone who knows the answer:

1. Is there an accesible analytical method to quantifty contamination from either the sample or from plasma?
2. Does anyone know a way to `disarm` the filtered fluid? I don`t feel comfortable contacting any organisation, because this way we would end up on some list and under surveillance. Does anyone do some Mercury elimination at home?


----------



## diogenes

Mr Patton, if you hear this, please tell us whether a Raman could identify Mercury nitrate from the end product?


----------



## cyb3r0

I have expired mercury nitrate, does this affect the quality of the synthesis?


----------



## G.Patton

diogenes said:


> Mr Patton, if you hear this, please tell us whether a Raman could identify Mercury nitrate from the end product?



diogenesHi, depends on power of the laser. In my opinion, better to solve your product in water and pay for water analysis for Hg metal. It's the simplest and the chicest way. Nobody would check your water for organic substances if you pay for metal only.

P.S. Answer me in comments or call me via @, i'll see it faster.


----------



## cyb3r0

The amalgam reaction with nitropropene works for the first 5 minutes, and then there is no reaction, so what is the reason?


----------



## T0R

hello I use sulphuric acid 96% pure 
is this the same as this guy use ?


----------



## Mclssmxxl

Saul said:


> hello I use sulphuric acid 96% pure
> is this the same as this guy use ?



SaulI don’t know what he uses but 96% is fine, just be careful when adding it to solvent, it splashes on contact.


----------



## ACAB

cyb3r0 said:


> I have expired mercury nitrate, does this affect the quality of the synthesis?



cyb3r0Ever heard that salt lies 7 million years in the earth, then it is mined and it is only 2 years shelf life?


cyb3r0 said:


> The amalgam reaction with nitropropene works for the first 5 minutes, and then there is no reaction, so what is the reason?


Normally this is a chain reaction that only stops when one of the substances is no longer available, I would say that amalgam is missing because it is too poorly prepared, or because an oxide layer is covering the amalgam again, that could be a possibility for example. Have you ever tried to start the reduction again with some mercury salt?


----------



## William Dampier

cyb3r0 said:


> The amalgam reaction with nitropropene works for the first 5 minutes, and then there is no reaction, so what is the reason?



cyb3r0Add more mercury and time until propene is added. Make sure there is enough water or acid in the mixture to produce hydrogen


----------



## Mclssmxxl

William Dampier said:


> Add more mercury and time until propene is added. Make sure there is enough water or acid in the mixture to produce hydrogen



William DampierReaction is more violent with just water? Or no difference?


----------



## T0R

Mclssmxxl said:


> I don’t know what he uses but 96% is fine, just be careful when adding it to solvent, it splashes on contact.



Mclssmxxl
I use it also with A-oil but never pure I did for 100ml oil 10 gr 96% and 17gr water it is still much better than the 37% you find everyware 
reaction is much better if you mix it just before you use it .


----------



## Mclssmxxl

Saul said:


> I use it also with A-oil but never pure I did for 100ml oil 10 gr 96% and 17gr water it is still much better than the 37% you find everyware
> reaction is much better if you mix it just before you use it .



SaulAre you precipitating with water? The sulphate form is water soluble.From what I understand an anhydrous or nearly anhydrous solvent should be used.
How are your yields?


----------



## nitochronic1

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> Video



HIGGS BOSSONHello I watch your video and thought it was excellent, but does anyone know where I can order mercury nitrate from and get delivered to the UK ? Thanks


----------



## ASheSChem

nitochronic1 said:


> where I can order mercury nitrate from and get delivered to the UK ? Thanks



nitochronic1you can try to mail reagent-inc (it is not on actual catalogue... but he have a mail..)
or the thermometer tek


----------



## nitochronic1

How can I get hold of them ? Thanks


----------



## Mclssmxxl

nitochronic1 said:


> How can I get hold of them ? Thanks



nitochronic1Look for a supplier from poland, least restrictive in the EU


----------



## cyb3r0

What is the easy, fast and guaranteed way to get rid of the odor of P2np after synthesis After completion, my washing method is to put the product from Amphetamine in a cup and acetone poured over it until it covered the amphetamine and stirred for about 15 times twice and put in a vacuum bag Is that right?


----------



## William Dampier

Mclssmxxl said:


> Reaction is more violent with just water? Or no difference?



MclssmxxlAdd no more than 20% of water from the total number of solvents at the beginning of the reaction


----------



## William Dampier

cyb3r0 said:


> What is the easy, fast and guaranteed way to get rid of the odor of P2np after synthesis After completion, my washing method is to put the product from Amphetamine in a cup and acetone poured over it until it covered the amphetamine and stirred for about 15 times twice and put in a vacuum bag Is that right?



cyb3r0The reaction does not pass to the end, there should not be such a smell. What is the color of the product before washing?


----------



## cyb3r0

William Dampier said:


> The reaction does not pass to the end, there should not be such a smell. What is the color of the product before washing?



William DampierYellow


----------



## T0R

Mclssmxxl said:


> Are you precipitating with water? The sulphate form is water soluble.From what I understand an anhydrous or nearly anhydrous solvent should be used.
> How are your yields?



Mclssmxxl
I don't think you understand. in sulfuric acid 37% pure there is 63% water in it . 
I use the 96 % pure and there is only 4% water in it . 
but you can use it this strong becouse it burnt when you add it this pure


----------



## ACAB

Saul said:


> I use it also with A-oil but never pure I did for 100ml oil 10 gr 96% and 17gr water it is still much better than the 37% you find everyware



Saul


Saul said:


> I don't think you understand. in sulfuric acid 37% pure there is 63% water in it .
> I use the 96 % pure and there is only 4% water in it .
> but you can use it this strong becouse it burnt when you add it this pure


And you are using 17gr water to dilute the sulfuric acid to provide burning?
That would be quite strange, normally you salt out in a solvent and dilute the acid with the solvent.


----------



## T0R

Pennywise said:


> And you are using 17gr water to dilute the sulfuric acid to provide burning?
> That would be quite strange, normally you salt out in a solvent and dilute the acid with the solvent.



Pennywisejust before I need it I mix 17 gr water with 10 gr sulfuric acid 96% and add it verry slowly to my mix off 135ml methanol with 100ml A-oil
I use ice water for cooling .


----------



## Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton

Saul said:


> just before I need it I mix 17 gr water with 10 gr sulfuric acid 96% and add it verry slowly to my mix off 135ml methanol with 100ml A-oil
> I use ice water for cooling .



SaulAnd what's the point of adding water?


----------



## T0R

Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton said:


> And what's the point of adding water?



Marvin &quot;Popcorn&quot; SuttonI have explane it in post #349

greetings


----------



## ACAB

Saul said:


> I have explane it in post #349



Sauland that is nonesense in my opinion, dillute your acid with methanol if you use it for the oil too. You loose over 17g sulfat with the water. And also i would use a higher amount of solvent for the acid because it is easier to hit the pH 6 point then.


----------



## Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton

Then why add methanol? It will bind your water, and you will not get a water layer. You will get something like a gel that is difficult to separate or filter out. Usually, when acidifying the free base of amphetamine, the dryest ingredients are used to avoid problems with precipitation.
Or you need to do without alcohol so that the salt goes into the aqueous phase and then evaporate the water to obtain salt. By the way, in the case of hydrochloride, this option will not work, only with sulfate.


----------



## Saymynamehsb

Can I use 85% phosphorus acid instead of sulfuric acid?


----------



## ASheSChem

Saymynamehsb said:


> Can I use 85% phosphorus acid instead of sulfuric acid?



Saymynamehsb
yes if you want phosphate amphetamine, and not sulfate amphetamine


----------



## Saymynamehsb

ASheSChem said:


> yes if you want phosphate amphetamine, and not sulfate amphetamine



ASheSChemWhat’s the difference?


----------



## ASheSChem

Saymynamehsb said:


> What’s the difference?



Saymynamehsb
that's the question 
(i have never try phosphate)
information i have read.. officially it's the same... 
i have ear phosphate better for IV ? i can't confirm... and best yielding with sulfate ... (but what about purity ?) 
and for effect... officially the same but some prefer one, an others no


----------



## MadHatter

Phosphate is somewhat more soluble in water. That's about it. No other interesting differences.


----------



## danil1398

Hello, I have some question:

1. Can Red Bull aluminum be used? 
2. Can aluminum be used from aluminum meat trays? 
3. When we tried to make Mercury Nitrate, we had a reaction that the mercury melted and became an increasingly clear yellow liquid with an intense smell - where did we make a mistake? We added about 1g of Mercury to the pot and then added about 3.5 ml of 65% nitric acid. A yellow foam appeared in the reaction, there was no rise in temperature. We currently have such a product and have no idea how to get crystals. Should we heat it, boil it and then cool it? 

Thank you for your answers


----------



## ASheSChem

3. you don't need crystal; put 10ml acid nitric with your 1gr of mercury; and use 5ml of the yellow liquid for your aluminum


----------



## ACAB

danil1398 said:


> A yellow foam appeared in the reaction, there was no rise in temperature.



danil1398You must heat the solution to 60 degrees otherwise no mercury (II) nitrate will be formed, and provide an air vent the brown gas that is produced is very toxic.



danil1398 said:


> 1. Can Red Bull aluminum be used?
> 2. Can aluminum be used from aluminum meat trays?


Since many cans in the food industry are made of tinplate you must be sure that it is aluminum, then it might work.


----------



## Gale

Reporting back on the salting MDMA base with sulphuric acid. 

MDMA sulphate = poo

Based it and hit it with HCl. Don't try to go sulphate with MDMA its a waste of time. Maybe phosphate but just stick with HCl. Lol


----------



## cyb3r0

Is acetone or isobol a substitute for dichloromethane?


----------



## ACAB

cyb3r0 said:


> Is acetone or isobol a substitute for dichloromethane?



cyb3r0For what purpose? 
When it is a case of shaking amphetamine out of an aqueous phase, acetone and IPA are rather poorly qualified. You can use petroleum ether instead.


----------



## cyb3r0

For washing amphetamine


----------



## wannabeechemist

two questions

1. Can i mix 65% NNO3 and Hg from thermometer to get mercury (II) nitrate. How much acid do I need to mix?

2. Preparing a solution of sulphuric acid in acetone- is this water sensitive? my h2so4 is about 50% PH 1 and my acetone isn't anhydrous, can i use that without sacrificing the yield? or do i need to dry out acetone and concentrate my H2SO4 to its azeotrope of 98%


----------



## ASheSChem

1. There are several manufacturing standards for clinical thermometers: In the Russian thermometer, usually between 1 and 1.5 g of mercury occurs. In Europe - 2 g. Now there are models of Russian thermometers made according to European standards, so that they can also contain 2 g. 
---> For one thermometer 20ml of nitric acid gives 3 to 4x 5ml of liquid mercury nitrate. What is useful for 3 to 4x12gr of aluminum

2. you need 96%+


----------



## ACAB

cyb3r0 said:


> For washing amphetamine



cyb3r0I would use dry and icecold acetone for washing the amphetamine and not dichloromethane, which is for extracting of an aqueous phase.


----------



## TerminusEst

I would like to know something about recovering solvents in this particular reaction, really just to lower cost and reduce my footprint.
As far as i understand it the final layer consists of (in terms of solvents) IPA and then sulfuric acid in acetone is added wich means that after the solution is made neutral and the amphetamine is collected i should be left with a mixture of acetone, IPA and whatever sodium hydroxide and sulfuric acid neutralize themself into.
Acetone has a Boiling point of 56 C and IPA of 82 C so is it possible and advisable to recover the solvents by distillation ?
I don't have a fractionating column so I guess it would mean that the recovered acetone is contaminated with IPA and the IPA would contain some acetone, what would be the implications for reuse of them ? what purity do i need to achieve for them to be reusable as solvents ?


----------



## ACAB

TerminusEst said:


> I would like to know something about recovering solvents in this particular reaction, really just to lower cost and reduce my footprint.



TerminusEstI also recover as much solvent as possible, but always separate acetone and isopropanol. I also do not use acetone with sulfuric acid, but also isopropanol. It is not possible to completely prevent mixing. I perform a distillation and use a column filled with small glass tubes to get the surface as large as possible. I find it important to dry the solvents, because water in the solvents reduces the yield. There are several possibilities, in the meantime I have even assembled a solvent recovery apparatus myself, because I use it again and again, mostly after a few syntheses.

There is also a topic where I have commented on this several times.


http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhni37ybtt7mkbjyxn2pgllzxf2qgyd.onion/threads/solvents-recovery.937/


----------



## TerminusEst

Pennywise said:


> I also recover as much solvent as possible, but always separate acetone and isopropanol. I also do not use acetone with sulfuric acid, but also isopropanol. It is not possible to completely prevent mixing. I perform a distillation and use a column filled with small glass tubes to get the surface as large as possible. I find it important to dry the solvents, because water in the solvents reduces the yield. There are several possibilities, in the meantime I have even assembled a solvent recovery apparatus myself, because I use it again and again, mostly after a few syntheses.
> 
> There is also a topic where I have commented on this several times.



PennywiseSo i could substitute the acetone with more IPA distill it after use and use the procedure described under 1) in the solvents recovery Thread ? 
That would be great becuase it would make recovering the solvents so much easier since you only have to think about the IPA.


----------



## ACAB

TerminusEst said:


> So i could substitute the acetone with more IPA distill it after use and use the procedure described under 1) in the solvents recovery Thread ?
> That would be great becuase it would make recovering the solvents so much easier since you only have to think about the IPA.



TerminusEstYes, you can. But acetone is also used to wash the sulfate later, but you can recover it just the same way. Distill and dry. Also remember that isopropanol forms an azeotropic mixture with water.


----------



## danil1398

Thanks for the answers so far, they helped. We succeeded from the third attempt, yield 70%. The look, structure, color and work are perfect, only the smell of acetone bothers me terribly I have a few more questions: 

1. What if I put more mercury nitrate instead of 5ml say 7ml, what will happen? 
2. Can I finally use 50ml ISO (isopropyl alcohol) + 2ml sulfuric acid instead of 50ml acetone + 2ml sulfuric acid? I ask this because acetone is aggressive and leaves a pungent odor and in some recipes, ie syntheses I have seen that they use ISO instead of Acetone


----------



## William Dampier

danil1398 said:


> 1. What if I put more mercury nitrate instead of 5ml say 7ml, what will happen?



danil1398The reaction can begin faster and more exothermic.


danil1398 said:


> 2. Can I finally use 50ml ISO (isopropyl alcohol) + 2ml sulfuric acid instead of 50ml acetone + 2ml sulfuric acid? I ask this because acetone is aggressive and leaves a pungent odor and in some recipes, ie syntheses I have seen that they use ISO instead of Acetone


Then you will have to evaporate alcohol, as it does not crystallize amphetamine even in the freezer. Acetone is needed, and after complete drying, acetone has no smell. Perhaps your acetone is not pure.


----------



## ACAB

William Dampier said:


> as it does not crystallize amphetamine even in the freezer



William DampierSry, first time i heard about that, i used IPA for all my Syntheses and it works. You can also use methanol or ethanol to precipitate the sulfate.
Why would this not work, I ask for explanation!?
It may be possible that acetone is the best solvent for precipitation, but that it does not work with IPA, etc., is not true.


----------



## William Dampier

When there is a large amount of alcohol, the powder is poorly crystallized. Amphetamine is almost not dissolved in cold acetone (unlike alcohol), and even the usual adding acetone to alcohol crystallizes powder in seconds. No need to misinform people.


----------



## William Dampier

But for the amalgam reaction, alcohol is certainly the best choice. But not for crystallization, if its volume is large on the amount of the base of amphetamine.


----------



## ACAB

William Dampier said:


> unlike alcohol



William DampierThe safety data sheet from amphetamine sulfate says poorly soluble in ethanol 96%, then this should also apply to isopropanol and methanol, shouldn't it?
The info confuses me right now, because in practice plenty of sulfate precipitates also in IPA.


----------



## ACAB

--Sorry, but edit time was over--



William Dampier said:


> But for the amalgam reaction, alcohol is certainly the best choice. But not for crystallization, if its volume is large on the amount of the base of amphetamine.



William DampierAnd a second thing that makes a question mark shine over my head. In the synthesis we use IPA and after the addition of NAOH an upper layer is formed consisting of IPA/amphetamine, to this layer we add the acid. Why don't we remove the IPA first and then switch to acetone?


----------



## ACAB

William Dampier said:


> When there is a large amount of alcohol, the powder is poorly crystallized. Amphetamine is almost not dissolved in cold acetone (unlike alcohol), and even the usual adding acetone to alcohol crystallizes powder in seconds. No need to misinform people.



William Dampier


William Dampier said:


> But for the amalgam reaction, alcohol is certainly the best choice. But not for crystallization, if its volume is large on the amount of the base of amphetamine.





Pennywise said:


> The safety data sheet from amphetamine sulfate says poorly soluble in ethanol 96%, then this should also apply to isopropanol and methanol, shouldn't it?
> The info confuses me right now, because in practice plenty of sulfate precipitates also in IPA.





Pennywise said:


> And a second thing that makes a question mark shine over my head. In the synthesis we use IPA and after the addition of NAOH an upper layer is formed consisting of IPA/amphetamine, to this layer we add the acid. Why don't we remove the IPA first and then switch to acetone?


@William Dampier can you please explain, i want to know it exactly. Until now I always assumed that isopropanol, acetone or methanol and ethanol are almost equally suitable, because the sulfate is poorly soluble or not soluble at all in all of them, which is why I am now surprised. You can also answer me by conversation if this would get out of hand, but please give me an explanation.


----------



## William Dampier

In a large amount of isopropyl alcohol, a small amount of amphetamine of salt will not crystallize until it is diluted with acetone or evaporate alcohol. If the amount of alcohol is small, then there are no problems. This is a remark, not an axiom. It all depends on concentrations, but if you need to get the maximum, I said above.


----------



## ASheSChem

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> 0:46-2:36 - Amalgam of mercury nitrate. Amalgamated aluminium will reduce 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene to amphetamine. During the amalgamation reaction: little gas evolves, a grey precipitate is formed. It is important not to miss the moment when the aluminium is ready: this can be determined by the formation of a grey precipitate and by the increased gas evolution; this happens in 10-15 minutes after the load.
> The water is drained without removing the gauze, *the amalgamated aluminium is washed with two portions of cold water*



HIGGS BOSSONwhen you wash aluminium with water, we need to wash it until to have a clear water ? 
every wash water are more clear, but after 2 or 3 wash it always little grey


----------



## ACAB

William Dampier said:


> In a large amount of isopropyl alcohol, a small amount of amphetamine of salt will not crystallize until it is diluted with acetone or evaporate alcohol.



William DampierThat's good to know, that will be my advice in the future. I will also rinse the extracted amphetamine with acetone so as not to increase the amount of IPA. It is hard to reduce the amount of IPA in the separated phase. Rinsing the filter only with water or also with acetone can be done. The two solvents cannot be separated optimally, but the IPA in the acetone can be converted to acetone after recovery, for which I have instructions.


----------



## Honolulu98

nitochronic1 said:


> Hello I watch your video and thought it was excellent, but does anyone know where I can order mercury nitrate from and get delivered to the UK ? Thanks



nitochronic1
The mercuric chloride was just as valid for me. It may be easier for you to get. Getting nitrate cost me a lot in Spain, but chloride worked just as well.

Although I also bought some mercuric nitrate in Russia


----------



## ASheSChem

After some synthesis, I still have somes questions...

1)



ASheSChem said:


> when you wash aluminium with water, we need to wash it until to have a clear water ?
> every wash water are more clear, but after 2 or 3 wash it always little grey



ASheSChem
2) when you have put the P2NP solution, the video says we need to wait stop bubbling... 
but after loong time he continue to doing very little bubble... and I have the impression that when I wait too long, my yielding is worse in the end
so can we stop when it do little bubbles ?


----------



## danil1398

Can ethanol 96% be used in the process instead of isopropyl 99.8% alcohol


----------



## ASheSChem

nobody ? 
@Pennywise @G.Patton @DocX @HIGGS BOSSON @HEISENBERG 




ASheSChem said:


> After some synthesis, I still have somes questions...
> 
> 1) when you wash aluminium with water, we need to wash it until to have a clear water ?
> every wash water are more clear, but after 2 or 3 wash it always little grey
> 
> 2) when you have put the P2NP solution, the video says we need to wait stop bubbling...
> but after loong time he continue to doing very little bubble... and I have the impression that when I wait too long, my yielding is worse in the end
> so can we stop when it do little bubbles ?



ASheSChem


----------



## G.Patton

ASheSChem said:


> but after 2 or 3 wash it always little gre



ASheSChemIt's okay


ASheSChem said:


> 2) when you have put the P2NP solution, the video says we need to wait stop bubbling...
> but after loong time he continue to doing very little bubble... and I have the impression that when I wait too long, my yielding is worse in the end
> so can we stop when it do little bubbles ?


You have to wait end of this reaction and stop bubbling. Also, you can heat reaction mass ~30-60 min at 50 deg to improve yield.


----------



## T0R

danil1398 said:


> Can ethanol 96% be used in the process instead of isopropyl 99.8% alcohol



danil1398
yes 

the reason they use isopropyl is becouse it is legal worldwide


----------



## cyb3r0

Is room temperature a reason for the success of the synthesis? What is the appropriate degree for that?


----------



## danil1398

Tnx for answers. I have a few more questions.

After amalgamation and washing with the addition of P2NP, a rapid violent reaction occurred. After that it became a rare gray liquid in which mercury began to appear.
Is it due to poor preparation of mercury nitrate. Whether there may have been too much mercury.

Please clarify the preparation of mercury nitrate.
Mercuric and nitric acid. How long should be heated to 60 degrees.


----------



## danil1398

We made poultry nitrate according to video instructions here on the forum, but somewhere we read here on the forum that nitrogen acid and mercury must be warmed at 60 C because only then a live nitrate is created. 

1. Can I save the rest of the living nitrate I do not use for synthesis? If yes, what should be stored in? What shelf life does a live nitrate have so prepared? 
2. If aluminum shampoos, Laboratorska aluminum granules were used for synthesis, would it be better or worse than foil? Can be tiring to cut pieces of 1.5cmx1,5cm 
3. Time of completion of amalgam aluminum; When 1l of distilled water is placed in the flask, live nitrate and aluminum foil in pieces - the synthesis says for 10-15 min while dark is color and small bubbles, I think of that part. The question is what if it stays for too long, say 30 minutes, what are the postures of it? 
4. There is someone a concrete, accurate and reliable link to buy live nitrate in the EU but send private customers and not companies? Or do you have any of you here for the sale of living nitrate?


----------



## MadHatter

If you use dilute nitric acid, the wrong kind of mercury salt can be synthesised (mercury(I)nitrate instead of mercury(III)nitrate). use concentrated nitric acid.


----------



## MadHatter

Also, when you rinse the amalgam, don't pour the rinsing water down the drain. it's poison. Also, if toxic substances are detected in the water treatment plant, they can trace the area where it's from. Potentially problematic. Convert the mercury salt to harmless mercury sulfide first: http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhn...nion/threads/neutralizing-mercury-salts.2482/


----------



## malayboy

DocX said:


> If you use dilute nitric acid, the wrong kind of mercury salt can be synthesised (mercury(I)nitrate instead of mercury(III)nitrate). use concentrated nitric acid.



DocXbut if we use the correct mol in the mercury nitrate equation, even 50% nitric acid can treated as concentrated with correct mol synthesis, yes?

Hg + 4HNO3 ----> Hg(NO3)2 + 2NO2 + 2H2O,


----------



## malayboy

@ASheSChem 

hi i face the same problem with you, but I wash with cold tap water, are you washing it with cold distilled water?


----------



## Mclssmxxl

danil1398 said:


> We made poultry nitrate according to video instructions here on the forum, but somewhere we read here on the forum that nitrogen acid and mercury must be warmed at 60 C because only then a live nitrate is created.
> 
> 1. Can I save the rest of the living nitrate I do not use for synthesis? If yes, what should be stored in? What shelf life does a live nitrate have so prepared?
> 2. If aluminum shampoos, Laboratorska aluminum granules were used for synthesis, would it be better or worse than foil? Can be tiring to cut pieces of 1.5cmx1,5cm
> 3. Time of completion of amalgam aluminum; When 1l of distilled water is placed in the flask, live nitrate and aluminum foil in pieces - the synthesis says for 10-15 min while dark is color and small bubbles, I think of that part. The question is what if it stays for too long, say 30 minutes, what are the postures of it?
> 4. There is someone a concrete, accurate and reliable link to buy live nitrate in the EU but send private customers and not companies? Or do you have any of you here for the sale of living nitrate?



danil13982.Use foil, granules is too reactive.With foil put in coffee grinder or form by hand loose balls.Thin squares are too reactive, it will foam and potentially escape the flask or release vapors.
3.You can leave it too long aswell as too short.The better case is too long but ideally you wanna use as it’s just ready: most aluminium to the top, not too intense bubbling, gray precipitate, drain and use.
4.onyxmet used to have, not in stock now but worth checking.You can also look on olx.pl, allegro.pl.Google translate to polish the chemical name.


----------



## G.Patton

danil1398 said:


> 1. Can I save the rest of the living nitrate I do not use for synthesis? If yes, what should be stored in? What shelf life does a live nitrate have so prepared?



danil1398You can store it in a tightly closed dark flask in fridge undetermined long time


----------



## ASheSChem

malayboy said:


> @ASheSChem
> 
> hi i face the same problem with you, but I wash with cold tap water, are you washing it with cold distilled water?



malayboyyes i use distilled water


----------



## MadHatter

malayboy said:


> but if we use the correct mol in the mercury nitrate equation, even 50% nitric acid can treated as concentrated with correct mol synthesis, yes?
> 
> Hg + 4HNO3 ----> Hg(NO3)2 + 2NO2 + 2H2O,



malayboyNo, concentrated means concentrated. It's >60%. But I'm not exactly sure at what dilution the conversion to mercury(I)nitrate can occur. Maybe 50% is ok.


----------



## Montecristo

ch3wbacca said:


> Adding metallic mercury to some 50% nitric acid and not inhaling the fumes, then using this to amalgamate Al in water or alcohol.
> Works always, relieable and fast.
> If this is now the (I) or (II) nitrate I confess I never spent a thought on.
> 
> But all mercury salts work, solubility is secondary. Mercury alone is not really the hit, but some nitric acid or some HCl and a pinch of nitrate help it to get on the way.
> 
> The amalgamation is cake from the mercury side of the fence, the problems blamed on the mercury are IMHO virtually always to blame on the aluminium in special the stupid foil which still is believed to be suitable.
> Get some good 99,9% Al granules and amalgamation will be the least of your troubles, the whole reaction will then be troublefree most probably.



ch3wbaccacould you explain further the hcl and nitrate method for dissolving mercury? 
what weight of mercury metal for this size? i have small thermometers


----------



## MadHatter

You'll know if you produced mercury(I)nitrate: it will be a yellow salt instead of a white salt.


----------



## ACAB

malayboy said:


> but if we use the correct mol in the mercury nitrate equation, even 50% nitric acid can treated as concentrated with correct mol synthesis, yes?
> 
> Hg + 4HNO3 ----> Hg(NO3)2 + 2NO2 + 2H2O,



malayboyThe temperature also plays an important role here, it must be hot concentrated acid >60°C



thatfellon said:


> could you explain further the hcl and nitrate method for dissolving mercury?
> what weight of mercury metal for this size? i have small thermometers


I think he meant that he destroys the oxide layer of the aluminum foil with acid so that the mercury reacts with the aluminum to form amalgam.


----------



## danil1398

Thanks for the answers so far, they helped us a lot even though we had a lot of failures. Let's say four rounds in a row failed, the part where P2NP and aluminum amalgam merge did not react, neither the temperature rose nor anything, we tried to warm up but failed. The second time there was a violent reaction and everything evaporated in a matter of seconds. What could be the problem? Aluminum? We cut 1x1cm squares from kitchen foil, we tried several types of foils, thicker and normal. After the fourth putanam, did the reaction succeed? What could be the problem? In the form of aluminum foil or something else? We worked the nitrate according to the instructions from the thermometer with nitric acid of 60% and we mixed it once with mercury and once we heated it to 60C because someone here on the forum wrote that nitrate is released only after 60C, dark yellow and brown the vapors we blew away and a clear yellow liquid remained and we thought it was the mercury nitrate we needed. Thank you


----------



## danil1398

Is there anyone to sell mercury nitrate here on the forum?

It’s exhausting to completely look for thermometers and make it yourself. And we think that we create a problem here, so we always lose the same strength, and when we store the prepared mercury nitrate in the refrigerator, we believe that it loses its properties after a few days. We are looking for Europe and it is nowhere to be found, nor is it on Amazon.

So if someone has to sell mercury nitrate they would really buy it, at least a little bit until something concrete comes up in Europe that we can buy ourselves.

Or does Mercury have anyone to sell?


----------



## danil1398

And yes, one more question about synthesis. I will definitely have more, but I think it's good because others learn something from my questions, hehe

Can the quantities be increased? I am thinking that since some syntheses fail, instead of the recommended amounts from this synthesis (10g of P2NP, 100ml of IPA, 50g of sodium hydroxide, 150ml of water...and the rest), I should increase the mentioned amounts by 5 times (50g of P2NP, 500ml of IPA, 250g of sodium hydroxide , 750 ml of water...and others)

Or to increase them by 2, 3 or 10 times?

Would that work?


----------



## ACAB

danil1398 said:


> Thanks for the answers so far, they helped us a lot even though we had a lot of failures. Let's say four rounds in a row failed, the part where P2NP and aluminum amalgam merge did not react, neither the temperature rose nor anything, we tried to warm up but failed. The second time there was a violent reaction and everything evaporated in a matter of seconds. What could be the problem? Aluminum? We cut 1x1cm squares from kitchen foil, we tried several types of foils, thicker and normal. After the fourth putanam, did the reaction succeed? What could be the problem? In the form of aluminum foil or something else? We worked the nitrate according to the instructions from the thermometer with nitric acid of 60% and we mixed it once with mercury and once we heated it to 60C because someone here on the forum wrote that nitrate is released only after 60C, dark yellow and brown the vapors we blew away and a clear yellow liquid remained and we thought it was the mercury nitrate we needed. Thank you



danil1398It is probably more the production of the amalgam than the nitrate itself. It has less to do with the aluminium foil itself, as long as the right amount is present. You can tell if your nitrate is effective if the aluminum slowly dissolves and the water turns dark gray and bubbles rise.
You have to wait for the right moment when you add P2NP, when enough amalgam has formed, but before this reaction reaches its peak, I would say 10-15 minutes after the addition, but it always depends on how much nitrate you have added, how much you stir or shake and how your aluminum looks like.
You said everything would have evaporated, the reaction is strongly exothermic you have to cool the flask to get that under control, so there you were on the right path.


danil1398 said:


> It’s exhausting to completely look for thermometers and make it yourself. And we think that we create a problem here, so we always lose the same strength, and when we store the prepared mercury nitrate in the refrigerator, we believe that it loses its properties after a few days.


The nitrate liquid is an acidic solution and if you have prepared it according to the instructions, it can be stored in the refrigerator for several weeks/month. And yes, the nitric acid must be hot, at least 60°C so that the correct nitrate is formed with the formation of brown toxic nitrogen dioxide.


danil1398 said:


> Is there anyone to sell mercury nitrate here on the forum?





danil1398 said:


> Or does Mercury have anyone to sell?


If you are from Europe, take a closer look in the eastern part, there you can get mercury and sometimes the right nitrates.


danil1398 said:


> Can the quantities be increased? I am thinking that since some syntheses fail, instead of the recommended amounts from this synthesis (10g of P2NP, 100ml of IPA, 50g of sodium hydroxide, 150ml of water...and the rest), I should increase the mentioned amounts by 5 times (50g of P2NP, 500ml of IPA, 250g of sodium hydroxide , 750 ml of water...and others)
> 
> Or to increase them by 2, 3 or 10 times?
> 
> Would that work?


You can scale the quantities as you like, but keep in mind that if you don't succeed in synthesis with the small quantities, you won't succeed with the larger quantities either, and then there is the danger that the reaction, which increases expotentially with the quantity, will blow up in your face, and we all don't want that, do we?


----------



## ImOut

Question about the Mercury (II) Nitrate - Hg(NO3)2 - 324.7 g/mol

Instead of Mercury (II) Nitrate, can it be substituted for another Mercury compound?

For example:

Mercury (I) Nitrate - Hg2(NO3)2 - 525.19 g/mol
Mercury (I) Chloride - Hg₂Cl₂ - 472.09 g/mol
Mercury (II) Chloride - HgCl2 - 271.52 g/mol

If, yes it can be substituted by any of the above. 

Follow-up question.

The molar mass are higher on two compounds and lower on one compound. Does the dosage need to change in the "recipe" or is it 0,1g still?

Best Regards


----------



## ACAB

Eyelow said:


> Mercury (II) Chloride - HgCl2 - 271.52 g/mol



EyelowThis one works also very well. The other two do not work.

The amount of mercury salt has a very wide ratio to aluminum, ranging from 1:1300 to 1:650 (mercury(II) nitrate to Al in moles) Thus, the amount cannot really be given in a specific size. However, feel free to adjust the ratios to chloride to have an idea of the range.


----------



## G.Patton

Eyelow said:


> Mercury (I) Nitrate - Hg2(NO3)2 - 525.19 g/mol
> Mercury (I) Chloride - Hg₂Cl₂ - 472.09 g/mol



EyelowNo and no


Eyelow said:


> Mercury (II) Chloride - HgCl2 - 271.52 g/mol


Yes.
You can read my topic Aluminium amalgam (Al/Hg) summary. There are answers.


----------



## Honolulu98

Eyelow said:


> Question about the Mercury (II) Nitrate - Hg(NO3)2 - 324.7 g/mol
> 
> Instead of Mercury (II) Nitrate, can it be substituted for another Mercury compound?
> 
> For example:
> 
> Mercury (I) Nitrate - Hg2(NO3)2 - 525.19 g/mol
> Mercury (I) Chloride - Hg₂Cl₂ - 472.09 g/mol
> Mercury (II) Chloride - HgCl2 - 271.52 g/mol
> 
> If, yes it can be substituted by any of the above.
> 
> Follow-up question.
> 
> The molar mass are higher on two compounds and lower on one compound. Does the dosage need to change in the "recipe" or is it 0,1g still?
> 
> Best Regards



Eyelow

The only chloride that works for you is the third one:

"Mercury (II) Chloride - HgCl2 - 271.52 g/mol"

I suffered a lot looking for mercuric nitrate but someone in this forum told me that mercuric chloride would work for me. I managed to obtain it in my country for about €120 per 100gr. And since the quantities to be used are tiny... it is eternal.


----------



## ImOut

Honolulu98 said:


> The only chloride that works for you is the third one:
> 
> "Mercury (II) Chloride - HgCl2 - 271.52 g/mol"
> 
> I suffered a lot looking for mercuric nitrate but someone in this forum told me that mercuric chloride would work for me. I managed to obtain it in my country for about €120 per 100gr. And since the quantities to be used are tiny... it is eternal.



Honolulu98
Hi,

Would you please share your contact for Mercury(II)Chloride, since this is the only compound missing for my synthesis, everything else I've managed to get.


----------



## ImOut

Question about the synthesis.

Let us say that I want to make a P2nP 500g synthesis in an open stainlessteel-barrel. 

The exothermic process can be handled with a stainlessteel cooling spiral connected to the cold water supply in your home and it can be lowered and removed by hand easily to reach the correct temperature. The mixture can easily be mixed by hand with a stainlessteel "spoon". The problem with this process as I understood it would be the evaporation of the Isopropyl Alcohol & Acetic Acid during this process because of the reaction needs to maintain 55-60Celcius.

To the question: Isn't it possible to have a preheated mixture of Isopropyl Alcohol & Acetic Acid already at 60Celcius next to the main batch and just add it to the mixture as the reaction is going when it get low, or does this disturbe with the reaction?

Best Regards


----------



## Botsauto-Dutchland

guys can i use Formic acid 85% intead of Gaa not in the mood for trying so shoul i do a reduction in formic tonight or i wait for Gaa


----------



## Botsauto-Dutchland

btw i found a way with mercury metal in gaa and 50% h202 , boil it gently: you get lots of foamy i gues mercuryacetate.. filter the foam and safe it. amalgams work great reaction kicks in cold.


----------



## William Dampier

Eyelow said:


> Let us say that I want to make a P2nP 500g synthesis in an open stainlessteel-barrel.



EyelowUse a plastic barrel


Eyelow said:


> The exothermic process can be handled with a stainlessteel cooling spiral


Use polypropylene pipes for underfloor heating


Eyelow said:


> needs to maintain 55-60Celcius.


Yes


Eyelow said:


> To the question: Isn't it possible to have a preheated mixture of Isopropyl Alcohol & Acetic Acid already at 60Celcius next to the main batch and just add it to the mixture as the reaction is going when it get low, or does this disturbe with the reaction?


Then the temperature rises rapidly, the reaction will be uncontrollable.


----------



## William Dampier

Dutch046 said:


> guys can i use Formic acid 85% intead of Gaa not in the mood for trying so shoul i do a reduction in formic tonight or i wait for Gaa



Dutch046Yes you can use formic acid


----------



## Botsauto-Dutchland

yes i can 15gr p2np 1Liter flask was a bit scary @ some moments i needed 1 hour for amalgam did not rinse it wit aced or bace before just the (i gues Hg acetate) 15 gr p2np 16 gr al and about 100ml formic acid and solved the p2n2 in Meoh just enough to solve and it was heated but cooled after then addes the formic acid 85 % to the meoh p2np solution.. finaly when the amalgam was ready(also in meoh) it turned deep orange.. i added it in i gues 8 times.the second time drop via cooler it came almost at the last ball from the cooler... so yes it works well thnx william for the advice


----------



## Botsauto-Dutchland

Dutch046 said:


> yes i can 15gr p2np 1Liter flask was a bit scary @ some moments i needed 1 hour for amalgam did not rinse it wit aced or bace before just the (i gues Hg acetate) 15 gr p2np 16 gr al and about 100ml formic acid and solved the p2n2 in Meoh just enough to solve and it was heated but cooled after then addes the formic acid 85 % to the meoh p2np solution.. finaly when the amalgam was ready(also in meoh) it turned deep orange.. i added it in i gues 8 times.the second time drop via cooler it came almost at the last ball from the cooler... so yes it works well thnx william for the advice



Dutch046again dont know yield i think i use phosforic acid to get the salt but in the 9 ml you see in pc is a litle water it was in cooler and adapters


----------



## Botsauto-Dutchland

Dutch046 said:


> again dont know yield i think i use phosforic acid to get the salt but in the 9 ml you see in pc is a litle water it was in cooler and adapters



Dutch046still dripping i desided to distill 130 ml o 15% sulfuric so, but i think i need some sleep


----------



## wannabeechemist

I cant distill sulfuric acid. I can heat it until it starts fuming and get to ~95%. Should that be okay for freebase salt formation? that extra water will dissolve formed salt so I ll lose a bit. Anything else?


----------



## ACAB

wannabeechemist said:


> I cant distill sulfuric acid. I can heat it until it starts fuming and get to ~95%. Should that be okay for freebase salt formation? that extra water will dissolve formed salt so I ll lose a bit. Anything else?



wannabeechemistQuite sufficient, always close the sulfuric acid well, because it has the property to absorb water from the air.


----------



## aaronstevens

If I get mercury II nitrate monohydrate, how do I seperate H2O best as the boiling point of mercury is below the one from H20? OR Will it simply not work at all


----------



## William Dampier

aaronstevens said:


> If I get mercury II nitrate monohydrate, how do I seperate H2O best as the boiling point of mercury is below the one from H20? OR Will it simply not work at all



aaronstevensUse monohydrate


----------



## TerminusEst

This reaction is working quit well for me, managed to do a few test runs of 20grams in a thick 7 liter HDPE barrel with efficiency reaching about 60 %ish after drying on low temperature in a dehumidifyer. got a little overacidification in some batches but overall its a very nice white substance that once properly dried forms grains that turn into powder with ligth-medium pressure.
i got two questions though.

My mercury nitrate turns yellow when it touches the water, the mercury is pure white before adding it into the aluminium/water mixture but as soon as it is added to the water it turns yellow and after sitting in the water/alluminium it even turns almost red-orange ish. these lumps seem to only poorly disolve in water bc i need to rinse at least 3-4 times to get rid of every little trace amount. my mercury metal comes from tilt switches which makes me think it might be contaminated with trace amounts of other metals maybe ? 

my second concern is my p2np does not disolve in my IPA/acetic acid mixture given the 10g P2NP in 100 ml isopropyl and 50 ml glacial acetic acid. my aceticc acid is only 80%. i need aprox 120-130 ml of IPA and propably 70 ml acetic acid to disolve th ep2np, otherwise i have yellow crytsals swirling around in my solution.
migth this be a consequence of the 80% acetic acid ?


----------



## ACAB

TerminusEst said:


> otherwise i have yellow crytsals swirling around in my solution.



TerminusEstHeat the solution a bit to 50°C, but not to hot, because then the yellow will turn red.


----------



## TerminusEst

i will try that thank you, by the way, is it possible to substitute the IPA with for example bioethanol ? would be much easier to source than IPA in larger quanteties.


----------



## ImOut

TerminusEst said:


> i will try that thank you, by the way, is it possible to substitute the IPA with for example bioethanol ? would be much easier to source than IPA in larger quanteties.



TerminusEstIPA is legal in Poland for consumers and costs around 20$ for 5L 99% >

Best regards


----------



## TerminusEst

Yes its legal but bioethanol is cheaper, less suspicious and can be easily be sourced in large qunateties offline which i think makes it preferable if it is possible to use it.


----------



## ACAB

TerminusEst said:


> is it possible to substitute the IPA with for example bioethanol ?



TerminusEstI know or better i read that one has used Methanol for synthesis, so it should be also possible to use Ethanol. You must seperate all solvents before add the acid to get almost water free, so what matter, try it and report back.


----------



## cyb3r0

When I increase p2np how many other reagents do I put?


----------



## ImOut

cyb3r0 said:


> When I increase p2np how many other reagents do I put?



cyb3r0Depends on how much of the P2nP you want to increase.

The same amount of % increase of P2nP should be added to the other ingredients as well.

For example the recipe is for 10g of P2nP, if you want to cook a batch consistent of 20g P2nP that is a 100% increase, then add 100% to the other ingredients aswell. Easy as that.


----------



## wannabeechemist

Chemist use molar ratios. That is the best way to have accurate conversion.


----------



## Botsauto-Dutchland

wannabeechemist said:


> Chemist use molar ratios. That is the best way to have accurate conversion.



wannabeechemisti tryd but cant find molar ratios on a site like wikipedia or something just like the question what the molar ration for p2p iron and fecl


----------



## Heartburn

Done exactly like in the video, except adding 62.5ml of 80% acetic acid. At the beginning I was worried about acid concentration s obas of the age and quality of P2NP (about 10 months in jar, got little oily wet). l've failed Al/Hg recipe from "scribd" site three times, si i was hopeless. But reaction was so vigorous that I had to rinse condenser with additional 20ml IPA. I've dried 99% acetone over molecular sieve baked 300°C, but somehow after adding 96% sulphuric acid it turned into brown thick goo. So I had to acidify it phosphorous way. Final product is very potent, yield is 7.2g dry from 10.3g P2NP. In the next week I'd take a sample to my workplace and take a quality shot on GC-MS/MS. 
Also, I'm curious if I can replace GAA with different acid eg. formic? The smell of spilled 80% vinegar is horrible


----------



## G.Patton

Heartburn said:


> In the next week I'd take a sample to my workplace and take a quality shot on GC-MS/MS.



HeartburnCongratulation! It would be nice. Share us your result please.


Heartburn said:


> Also, I'm curious if I can replace GAA with different acid eg. formic? The smell of spilled 80% vinegar is horrible


I can imagine and well understand you. You can try *this* recipe without acetic acid.


Heartburn said:


> after adding 96% sulphuric acid it turned into brown thick


Did you add acid directly? You have to use sulphuric acid solution (~10%) in acetone.


----------



## Heartburn

G.Patton said:


> Did you add acid directly? You have to use sulphuric acid solution (~10%) in acetone.



G.PattonI added 2ml of 96% acid to 10ml acetone, you say that i have to use diluted sulphuric acid to mix with acetone? I thought that neutralisation agent should be as anhydrous as possible. Next time I'll try this recipe on 1g scale with molar equivalent of 85% formic acid.


----------



## G.Patton

Heartburn said:


> I added 2ml of 96% acid to 10ml acetone,



HeartburnIt's okay. No, I mean that you have to prepare 10% solution from 96% acid with acetone, sorry for unclear explanation.


----------



## kamusheto

how many grams do you make from this recipe


----------



## Madeinkorea

has anyone tried the Al/Hg amalgam method in small quantities?
i have tried it with the same ratio but 10 times less from everything and got greenish/grey precipitate instantly after pouring p2np solution onto the amalgam
any idea what might happened?


----------



## KokosDreams

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> Your browser is not able to display this video.
> 
> 
> Download Video
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Amphetamine synthesis from P2NP via Al/Hg (video)
> 
> 
> 
> __ HEISENBERG
> __ May 27, 2022
> __ 5
> __
> adderall
> amphetamine
> amphetamine synthesis
> amphetamine video
> amphetamines
> amphetamines salts
> cas 300-62-9
> cas 705-60-2
> p2np
> video synthesis
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://bbgate.com/threads/synthesis-of-amphetamine-from-p2np-via-al-hg-video.196/



HIGGS BOSSON
Your guide has helped me so much! 
Once I have managed to find a reliable Mercury (II) Nitrate supplier I am ready to go!

Thanks so much for your work!!


----------



## G.Patton

Madeinkorea said:


> has anyone tried the Al/Hg amalgam method in small quantities?
> i have tried it with the same ratio but 10 times less from everything and got greenish/grey precipitate instantly after pouring p2np solution onto the amalgam
> any idea what might happened?



MadeinkoreaAre you sure in your P2NP quality? Have you recrystallized this precursor and check melting point?


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

G.Patton said:


> Are you sure in your P2NP quality? Have you recrystallized this precursor and check melting point?



G.Pattonmy money is on not good amalgamation


----------



## G.Patton

UWe9o12jkied91d said:


> my money is on not good amalgamation



UWe9o12jkied91dwhat?


----------



## Madeinkorea

G.Patton said:


> Are you sure in your P2NP quality? Have you recrystallized this precursor and check melting point?



G.Patton
I got the P2NP from a vendor advertised here on the forum with good reviews, so I would say quality is good, will recrystallize and check melting point in near future.


----------



## Madeinkorea

G.Patton said:


> what?



G.Pattoni think he meant the amalgamation was not good enough for the reaction.
Which might be the case, I could not nail it the yet, complications happened in the past with amalgamation. Last time I tried it the foil started crackling and smoking after being rinsed, but this time it wasnt reacting as aggressively, maybe that was the problem.


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Madeinkorea said:


> i think he meant the amalgamation was not good enough for the reaction.
> Which might be the case, I could not nail it the yet, complications happened in the past with amalgamation. Last time I tried it the foil started crackling and smoking after being rinsed, but this time it wasnt reacting as aggressively, maybe that was the problem.



Madeinkoreayes, that is what i meant, thank you.
another tricky thing that some people have trouble with is adding too little salts for mlgm, counterintuitively the less you add the more it's gonna foam and bubble when you wash it(making you THINK it's well mlgmated).You want somewhat alert bubbling(no foam) with general greying of the sol. and your shiny bois floating to the top.When 80-90% percent have floated up proceed as usual.respect procedure, weigh out your salts, 1:1 (with reason).
and don't forget to have fun


----------



## G.Patton

Madeinkorea said:


> I got the P2NP from a vendor advertised here on the forum with good reviews, so I would say quality is good, will recrystallize and check melting point in near future.



MadeinkoreaI recommend to do it in any case (measure each new supplier batch), if you want to be sure in your synthesis.


----------



## obwiju

Hello, does anyone know of any European supplier of mercuric nitrate, mercuric chloride or nitric acid? A week ago I bought nitric acid from a supplier mentioned in this thread http://www.aurelio-online.com/
but I don't know if they will send it to me.
Thanks!


----------



## KokosDreams

obwiju said:


> Hello, does anyone know of any European supplier of mercuric nitrate, mercuric chloride or nitric acid? A week ago I bought nitric acid from a supplier mentioned in this thread http://www.aurelio-online.com/
> but I don't know if they will send it to me.
> Thanks!



obwiju
Check out Constantylious from the EU Supplier List on Breaking Bad

He has Mercury compunds and works with escrow.

You might want to stay away from the clearweb when it comes to those kind of chemicals

You can find all recommended suppliers here:



http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhni37ybtt7mkbjyxn2pgllzxf2qgyd.onion/b/europe.10/


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

obwiju said:


> Hello, does anyone know of any European supplier of mercuric nitrate, mercuric chloride or nitric acid? A week ago I bought nitric acid from a supplier mentioned in this thread http://www.aurelio-online.com/
> but I don't know if they will send it to me.
> Thanks!



obwijuOnyxmet 10/10 from price to service to everything, pick up some sulphur while your're at it, it's cheap.


----------



## G.Patton

obwiju said:


> Hello, does anyone know of any European supplier of mercuric nitrate, mercuric chloride or nitric acid? A week ago I bought nitric acid from a supplier mentioned in this thread http://www.aurelio-online.com/
> but I don't know if they will send it to me.
> Thanks!



obwijuHello. We would like to get feedback from you about this supplier. Please, share us result of your deal.


----------



## danil1398

Greetings to everyone again, we have a few questions about synthesis 

1. Is it possible for P2NP to spoil or lose its property? 
2. How to recognize the corrupt P2NP? 
3. How and in what conditions do you keep P2NP? Should he be in the cold? 
4. During synthesis, in the first step Al Amalgam. We worked on the instruction and 4 times the amalgation failed. When we added "Our Made Living Nitrate" reaction was too fast, in just ten minutes bubbles were created, dark liquid and all aluminum rose to the surface and we decided to assess amalgation and there were very few other aluminums, we have the impression that it has melted during amalgation. And when we added a solution of the prepared P2NP, the reaction was missing and there was no. What went wrong?
5. Before the unsuccessful synthesis above, we had one that had a great course, but at the end, when adding a caustic soda solution, we got too much of an amphetamine base, about 100ml, while in earlier procedures we got similar to the video synthesis. We realized that something was wrong and we added sulfuric acid as well, but it didn't respond. 
6. Can it be used in the last step, instead of acetone, isopropile alcohol with sulfuric acid? Or was it exclusively acetone? 
7. On one occasion we had an unusual large yield where we had approximately 3x more paste obtained. We mean a wet paste, once squeezed through the fabric. What could have been the cause? 

P2np stood for a long time because we couldn't get to the mercury, so we doubt that our P2NP broke down, so we asked those few questions. 

Otherwise we had a dozen successful synthesis until then. 

Thanks for the answers in advance


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

danil1398 said:


> Greetings to everyone again, we have a few questions about synthesis
> 
> 1. Is it possible for P2NP to spoil or lose its property?
> 2. How to recognize the corrupt P2NP?
> 3. How and in what conditions do you keep P2NP? Should he be in the cold?
> 4. During synthesis, in the first step Al Amalgam. We worked on the instruction and 4 times the amalgation failed. When we added "Our Made Living Nitrate" reaction was too fast, in just ten minutes bubbles were created, dark liquid and all aluminum rose to the surface and we decided to assess amalgation and there were very few other aluminums, we have the impression that it has melted during amalgation. And when we added a solution of the prepared P2NP, the reaction was missing and there was no. What went wrong?
> 5. Before the unsuccessful synthesis above, we had one that had a great course, but at the end, when adding a caustic soda solution, we got too much of an amphetamine base, about 100ml, while in earlier procedures we got similar to the video synthesis. We realized that something was wrong and we added sulfuric acid as well, but it didn't respond.
> 6. Can it be used in the last step, instead of acetone, isopropile alcohol with sulfuric acid? Or was it exclusively acetone?
> 7. On one occasion we had an unusual large yield where we had approximately 3x more paste obtained. We mean a wet paste, once squeezed through the fabric. What could have been the cause?
> 
> P2np stood for a long time because we couldn't get to the mercury, so we doubt that our P2NP broke down, so we asked those few questions.
> 
> Otherwise we had a dozen successful synthesis until then.
> 
> Thanks for the answers in advance



danil13981.Yes, by air and temp. above 8C
2.Darkened color, I would recrystalize even if it got just a bit more orange.You want it canary yellow.
3.Freezer, airtight, will keep for a good long while if its pure.
4.Read my post just above, you want alert-ish bubbling, no foam, no very evident reaction.If your mercury amalagam is amalgamating violently it's either too little or too much.Did you weigh it?Read patton's thread on isomer separation, it's good resource for synthesis too.
5.idk
6.Yes, it works no problem.
7.It can precipitate differently depending on solvent, conc. of precipitation sol., temp. of mother sol. and of precipitation sol., conc. of freebase in the ipa.It makes no difference.Don't use fabric, double bag coffee filters if qualitative paper is not on the menu,

like and subscribe


----------



## Heartburn

G.Patton said:


> Congratulation! It would be nice. Share us your result please.



G.PattonSo, I took 5mg sample in 1ml methanol, but not all of the sample wanted to dissolve. After 10min. of shaking, solution was filtered trough 7micron syringe filter. Conducted GCMS analysis has shown that main peak was our desired one. Other compounds dissolved in sample was: P2NP, 2-phenyl-methylaziridine, 2-methyl-3-phenyl-aziridine, and the least abundant was benzylmethylketoxime, sum of byproducts less than 0.2% peak area (solvent not taken in equation). Other 100mg sample was incinerated in lab furnace leaving 16mg of dust insoluble in methanol. Next, the dust was tested with MgCl2 in ammonium buffer, with slide precipitation, so I'm assured, it is some phosphate inorganic salt. Thus, my yield in #437 post should be 6.05g instead of 7.2.


----------



## G.Patton

danil1398 said:


> How to recognize the corrupt P2NP?



danil1398In addition to @UWe9o12jkied91d post, you can check melting point. This test clearly answers you about purity of your p2np.


----------



## Diva

Xiaoyan said:


> yes, i willi try.
> my english is very poor, soit might take a while to answer
> first i want to ask about P2PN
> where can i find a trusted seller?
> (dont know if can i do this question here, if i cant, tell me to erase it please)



XiaoyanIf you have known tell me please


----------



## Diva

Thanks for this video
I want to know if P2NP is available and he didn't mention use of it in the video
Thanks


----------



## Diva

Thanks for this video
I want to know if P2NP is available and he didn't mention use of it in the video
Thanks


----------



## KokosDreams

Diva said:


> Thanks for this video
> I want to know if P2NP is available and he didn't mention use of it in the video
> Thanks



Diva
There is a list of P2NP Vendors in the listing section of this Forum

Stay safe


----------



## Diva

KokosDreams said:


> There is a list of P2NP Vendors in the listing section of this Forum
> 
> Stay safe



KokosDreamsThanks alot 
Pls send me a link or tell how can find it 
and in the previous video he didn't mention how he use it in the preparation


----------



## KokosDreams

Diva said:


> Thanks alot
> Pls send me a link or tell how can find it
> and in the previous video he didn't mention how he use it in the preparation



Diva
What do you mean exactly, how it was used in the preperation?

You can see the supplier list here: http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhni37ybtt7mkbjyxn2pgllzxf2qgyd.onion/resources/


----------



## Diva

Yes exactly that's what I want


----------



## KokosDreams

Diva said:


> Yes exactly that's what I want



Diva
You'll create a solution of P2NP, Isopropyl Alcohol and Acetic Acid (10 g of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene in 100 ml of isopropyl alcohol and 50 ml of acetic acid).

It is a basic mixture of the 3 above described precursors, simply mix them together!

Do you got any more questions?

Some please correct me if I'm wrong!

Cincerly,

Koko


----------



## KokosDreams

William Dampier said:


> Max quantity what I know was 2,5 kg P2NP per this reaction, but need good control for temperature. Gradual scaling of the reaction - the best choice. With any problems with scaling, it is better to solve them on smaller quantities. We can help on this path, with feedback.



William Dampier
Hey there, can you remember how much amphetamine freebase was yielded from this reaction?


----------



## Diva

KokosDreams said:


> You'll create a solution of P2NP, Isopropyl Alcohol and Acetic Acid (10 g of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene in 100 ml of isopropyl alcohol and 50 ml of acetic acid).
> 
> It is a basic mixture of the 3 above described precursors, simply mix them together!
> 
> Do you got any more questions?
> 
> Some please correct me if I'm wrong!
> 
> Cincerly,
> 
> Koko



KokosDreamsReally thanks


----------



## KokosDreams

Diva said:


> Really thanks



Diva
You are welcome!

Stay safe


----------



## obwiju

G.Patton said:


> Hello. We would like to get feedback from you about this supplier. Please, share us result of your deal.



G.PattonAfter some research I have ordered 100 gr of mercuric chloride. When I receive it I will share impressions


----------



## KokosDreams

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> Your browser is not able to display this video.
> 
> 
> Download Video
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Amphetamine synthesis from P2NP via Al/Hg (video)
> 
> 
> 
> __ HEISENBERG
> __ May 27, 2022
> __ 5
> __
> adderall
> amphetamine
> amphetamine synthesis
> amphetamine video
> amphetamines
> amphetamines salts
> cas 300-62-9
> cas 705-60-2
> p2np
> video synthesis
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://bbgate.com/threads/synthesis-of-amphetamine-from-p2np-via-al-hg-video.196/



HIGGS BOSSON
I got some questions:

1. How can I clean the base solution from Isopropyl and other unwated byproducts so that I receive a pure amphetamine freebase?
I am looking into this synthesis to produce amphetamine freebase, not sulphate and am wondering if it is necessary to clean the spereated top layer to make it ready as pure amphetamine freebase.

2. What type of exhaust system is recommended for this reaction in a home lab?
I was reading in the thread that describes exhaust systems but am looking to find less space consuming options

3. What is the estimated yield of pure amphetamine freebase from this reaction (10g P2NP)?
I'd estimate it to be somewhat around 50ml, if the Isopropyl is fully removed from the base that's seperated

@HIGGS BOSSON
@G.Patton
@William Dampier


----------



## G.Patton

KokosDreams said:


> 1. How can I clean the base solution from Isopropyl and other unwated byproducts so that I receive a pure amphetamine freebase?
> I am looking into this synthesis to produce amphetamine freebase, not sulphate and am wondering if it is necessary to clean the spereated top layer to make it ready as pure amphetamine freebase.



KokosDreamsEvaporate solvent and you can carry out steam distillation to purify free base.


KokosDreams said:


> 2. What type of exhaust system is recommended for this reaction in a home lab?
> I was reading in the thread that describes exhaust systems but am looking to find less space consuming options


There are nice guides.


http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhni37ybtt7mkbjyxn2pgllzxf2qgyd.onion/threads/home-laboratory-diy-exhausting-fan-models-and-filters.471/




http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhni37ybtt7mkbjyxn2pgllzxf2qgyd.onion/threads/setting-up-a-laboratory-in-the-house.586/




KokosDreams said:


> 3. What is the estimated yield of pure amphetamine freebase from this reaction (10g P2NP)?
> I'd estimate it to be somewhat around 50ml, if the Isopropyl is fully removed from the base that's seperated


Depends on your skill, 70-90%. From 6.19 to 8 mL of amph free base. I don't know how did you calculated 50 mL


----------



## KokosDreams

G.Patton said:


> Evaporate solvent and you can carry out steam distillation to purify free base.



G.Patton
Thanks! 



G.Patton said:


> There are nice guides.
> 
> 
> http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhni37ybtt7mkbjyxn2pgllzxf2qgyd.onion/threads/home-laboratory-diy-exhausting-fan-models-and-filters.471/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://bbzzzsvqcrqtki6umym6itiixfhni37ybtt7mkbjyxn2pgllzxf2qgyd.onion/threads/setting-up-a-laboratory-in-the-house.586/



Thanks!


G.Patton said:


> Depends on your skill, 70-90%. From 6.19 to 8 mL of amph free base. I don't know how did you calculated 50 mL



Okay, that's a surprise!
According to my sourcing costs the cost for 1.000ml of freebase should then be between 379,36€ and 546,64€, according to my research that seems a little high.
Is there a method than can reduce the production costs?

I am wondering as I am looking into the manufacturing of freebase for commercial use of freebase, so I am having the trouble to scale this reaction towards something like 2.5kg P2NP or even higher otherwise it wouldn't make much sense
What other reactions could you recommend for commercial use? I can't do this reaction 140 times to get 1L haha


----------



## G.Patton

KokosDreams said:


> According to my sourcing costs the cost for 1.000ml of freebase should then be between 379,36€ and 546,64€, according to my research that seems a little high.
> Is there a method than can reduce the production costs?



KokosDreamsI know that 1g of pure amph sulfate has aproximately cost from 20 to 30 eur. You can get ~1450g of sulphate salt from 1L of base. 546 eur looks not so bad. You have to carry out synthesis. If you have no experience, it is hard to calculate and build global plans.


KokosDreams said:


> I am wondering as I am looking into the manufacturing of freebase for commercial use of freebase, so I am having the trouble to scale this reaction towards something like 2.5kg P2NP otherwise it wouldn't make much sense
> What other reactions could you recommend for commercial use? I can't do this reaction 140 times to get 1L haha


One-pot synthesis of amphetamine from P2NP with NaBH4/CuCl2 (1kg scale)


----------



## studentt

what is the color from amphetamine oil before steam destillation (red/brown)?


----------



## KokosDreams

G.Patton said:


> I know that 1g of pure amph sulfate has aproximately cost from 20 to 30 eur. You can get ~1450g of sulphate salt from 1L of base. 546 eur looks not so bad. You have to carry out synthesis. If you have no experience, it is hard to calculate and build global plans.



G.Patton
I just want to find the most efficient (time and money) method to be able to know what to focus on.

20 - 30 EUR sounds like a dream haha, where I'm from we sell a kilo of Speed for 800€ - 1.000€



G.Patton said:


> One-pot synthesis of amphetamine from P2NP with NaBH4/CuCl2 (1kg scale)



Thanks, I've read into that already but it seems very costy, as far as I understood this method has around 2.5x the price of the Synthesis via Al/Hg & P2NP


----------



## G.Patton

KokosDreams said:


> 20 - 30 EUR sounds like a dream haha, where I'm from we sell a kilo of Speed for 800€ - 1.000€



KokosDreamsIs this speed pure? Or is it cut garbage?


----------



## KokosDreams

G.Patton said:


> Is this speed pure? Or is it cut garbage?



G.Patton
Basically for both..the people don't really care if there's coffeine cut into it or not..which is sad


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

studentt said:


> what is the color from amphetamine oil before steam destillation (red/brown)?



studenttDeff. not red/brown.Red brown organic layer means overheating if the coloration appeared before basification, if it's after it's your p2np and other side products moving with the ipa to the organic layer because of uncomplete reaction (in this case it should be yellowish brown, not so intense redish brown)


----------



## KokosDreams

Is there anyone that has experience with scaling this reaction to 2.5kg+ P2NP who would be willing to answer some questions?


----------



## KokosDreams

G.Patton said:


> Evaporate solvent and you can carry out steam distillation to purify free base.



G.Patton
What temperature is best used to evaporate the Isopropyl from the solution to not affect the freebase?
To carry out a steam distillation after the evaporation is understood



G.Patton said:


> Depends on your skill, 70-90%. From 6.19 to 8 mL of amph free base. I don't know how did you calculated 50 mL



I thought after 'getting rid' of the Isopropyl the freebase would be ready to go. I am looking to create 'A-Oil'/Amphetamine Freebase to create paste from it, not sulphate.
So I'd need to evaporate the Isopropyl to make it ready for use as the Isopropyl would be added by the people that would transfer the 'A-Oil' to speed paste (with Isopropyl and H2SO4).

@G.Patton thanks a lot for everything, you've been a great help so far!


----------



## G.Patton

KokosDreams said:


> What temperature is best used to evaporate the Isopropyl from the solution to not affect the freebase?



KokosDreamsThe best option is use vacuum (rotovap machine). Temperature not bigger than 55-60 deg C.


----------



## KokosDreams

G.Patton said:


> The best option is use vacuum (rotovap machine). Temperature not bigger than 55-60 deg C.



G.Patton
Thanks, I'll include that into my lab equipment list


----------



## Panzerschokolade

First try with phosphorus acid: full success.
Second try, all the same but doubled reagents and additional cleansing of a-freebase/IPA mixture with NaOH solution (same conc as in recipe) in separatory funnel ended badly. It was taken to pH 6, indicator papers remained yellow, but there was no precipitate. Then i added some 99% acetone to this yellowish after-aciding-mixture, and some white precipitate was observed. After few minutes of gentle mixing it started to create one big sticky chunk of goo. It filtered well, and after rinsing with acetone it remained sticky and slimy. It doesn't want to dry, even in 105°C oven. First batch was odourless and super dry/bulky. Second one's smell is strong and is characteristic to amp. What did i do wrong? In my country I can't buy sulfuric acid stronger than ~36% so i don't use it.


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Panzerschokolade said:


> First try with phosphorus acid: full success.
> Second try, all the same but doubled reagents and additional cleansing of a-freebase/IPA mixture with NaOH solution (same conc as in recipe) in separatory funnel ended badly. It was taken to pH 6, indicator papers remained yellow, but there was no precipitate. Then i added some 99% acetone to this yellowish after-aciding-mixture, and some white precipitate was observed. After few minutes of gentle mixing it started to create one big sticky chunk of goo. It filtered well, and after rinsing with acetone it remained sticky and slimy. It doesn't want to dry, even in 105°C oven. First batch was odourless and super dry/bulky. Second one's smell is strong and is characteristic to amp. What did i do wrong? In my country I can't buy sulfuric acid stronger than ~36% so i don't use it.



PanzerschokoladeToss it and start over, that sticky mess is never gonna dry.I suggest you add alkali to ph 13 like in the procedure, regardless of quantity you need full separation and a ph of at least 13.Try slightly heating your acid (applies for phosphoric only) before use, if that dosen't do it it sounds to me like too dillute organic phase layer or too wet organic phase.I would advise the use of a solid drying agent and/or steam distillation and/or solvent evaporation under vaccum.


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

UWe9o12jkied91d said:


> Toss it and start over, that sticky mess is never gonna dry.I suggest you add alkali to ph 13 like in the procedure, regardless of quantity you need full separation and a ph of at least 13.Try slightly heating your acid (applies for phosphoric only) before use, if that dosen't do it it sounds to me like too dillute organic phase layer or too wet organic phase.I would advise the use of a solid drying agent and/or steam distillation and/or solvent evaporation under vaccum.



UWe9o12jkied91dbe aware chloride drying agents are incompatible with ipoh


----------



## Heartburn

KokosDreams said:


> Is there anyone that has experience with scaling this reaction to 2.5kg+ P2NP who would be willing to answer some questions?



KokosDreams At the very beginning of topic HIGGS BOSSON said:


HIGGS BOSSON said:


> Unfortunately, this reaction scales with a loss in yields. Optimally, I was able to load 100 g of phenyl nitro propene in a 20 L flask, with cooling in a basin with ice water, the solution of p2np in amalgam was added in 3 portions.


If we extrapolate his proportions for 2.5kg batch you'll need to use 500L reactor. I wonder how the reaction speed and yield will look if the nitropropene/ipa/acid mixture was supercooled at the beginning? Maybe if we use aluminium grain beads 0.6mm instead of foil, we can slow the reaction that much to prevent foam over boiling and use smaller reactor than 500L? 
Cons of this solution could be very long reaction time, and small amalgaming area of Al grains may force us to add additional mercury portions in situ to keep reduction going. Eventually, if freebase is distilled, there's no way to carry mercuric ions to final product.


----------



## KokosDreams

Heartburn said:


> At the very beginning of topic HIGGS BOSSON said:
> 
> If we extrapolate his proportions for 2.5kg batch you'll need to use 500L reactor. I wonder how the reaction speed and yield will look if the nitropropene/ipa/acid mixture was supercooled at the beginning? Maybe if we use aluminium grain beads 0.6mm instead of foil, we can slow the reaction that much to prevent foam over boiling and use smaller reactor than 500L?
> Cons of this solution could be very long reaction time, and small amalgaming area of Al grains may force us to add additional mercury portions in situ to keep reduction going. Eventually, if freebase is distilled, there's no way to carry mercuric ions to final product.



Heartburn
I heared that with scaling this reaction, it would be recommended to use even larger aluminium pieces to not spoil the reactor or cause a too heavy reaction once the P2NP is added. Anyway, the Al/Hg route seems to be causing too many issues when scaling.

In the meanwhile I found the NaBH4/CuCL2 route to be more suitable for a production on a larger scale with 1kg+ of P2NP.


----------



## Curiousonion

How do you scale this reaction??
This is one of the first reactions that I made when I first started and i did a small batch.
If you want to make a 1 kilogram batch you would need around 1 kilogram of foil, that stuff is huge in volume so how do you work with such a large amount?


----------



## KokosDreams

Curiousonion said:


> How do you scale this reaction??
> This is one of the first reactions that I made when I first started and i did a small batch.
> If you want to make a 1 kilogram batch you would need around 1 kilogram of foil, that stuff is huge in volume so how do you work with such a large amount?



Curiousonion
I was told that this reaction should only be scaled to 100g P2NP, otherwise the loss in yield would be too large/the reaction to heavy with regular equipment

If scaled, then scale ingredients linear


----------



## Curiousonion

KokosDreams said:


> I was told that this reaction should only be scaled to 100g P2NP, otherwise the loss in yield would be too large/the reaction to heavy with regular equipment
> 
> If scaled, then scale ingredients linear



KokosDreamsYeah, it doesn't seem possible to scale it up for more than that. 
The sodium borohydride reaction is good but the cost of the sodium makes it illogical from a financial perspective.


----------



## obwiju

G.Patton said:


> Hello. We would like to get feedback from you about this supplier. Please, share us result of your deal.



G.PattonGood provider. Excellent pre-sale service. The order arrived very soon


----------



## Curiousonion

Mo0odi said:


> هل يستطيع أحد أن يعلمني كيف أجففها



Mo0odiOk, now English please.


----------



## Mo0odi

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> *In the video synthesis of amphetamine, reagents are used:*
> 10 g 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene (P2NP);
> 100 ml isopropyl alcohol (IPA);
> 50 ml glacial acetic acid (AcOH);
> 50 g sodium hydroxide (NaOH);
> 12 g aluminium (in the form of sliced household foil);
> 0.1g mercury (II) nitrate (Hg(NO3)2);
> 2 ml sulphuric acid (H2SO4);
> 50 ml acetone.
> View attachment 6233​
> *Description of amphetamine synthesis video.*
> Before the start of the synthesis, the laboratory assistant prepared a solution of 10 g of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene in 100 ml of isopropyl alcohol and 50 ml of acetic acid. Also, for the aluminium amalgam, 12 g of household aluminium foil was prepared, which was cut into small pieces with a paper shredder. It can be cut with scissors or torn by hand.
> 
> 0:04-0:40 - Preparation of an aqueous solution of alkali. In this video, it was made in advance so that the solution cools down by the time the main reaction mixture alkalizes. Alkalinization proceeds with the release of heat, and if a fresh hot alkali solution is used, then the exothermic will be more pronounced and forced cooling of the reaction mass will be required.
> 
> 0:46-2:36 - Amalgam of mercury nitrate. Amalgamated aluminium will reduce 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene to amphetamine. During the amalgamation reaction: little gas evolves, a grey precipitate is formed. It is important not to miss the moment when the aluminium is ready: this can be determined by the formation of a grey precipitate and by the increased gas evolution; this happens in 10-15 minutes after the load.
> The water is drained without removing the gauze, the amalgamated aluminium is washed with two portions of cold water. It is worth paying attention to the release of gas bubbles: it is noticed that with the "correct" amalgam, these bubbles are small, and the colour of the liquid is darker; if the bubbles are large and the colour is light, and the reaction looks violent, the amalgam is bad. This is almost certainly due to a lack of mercury salt. Please note that mercury salts are poisonous.
> 
> 2:37-4:28 - The most important part of the process is the reduction of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene on aluminium amalgam. The reaction is exothermic, proceeds with abundant heat release. During the process, it is necessary to carefully monitor the temperature, in case of excessive overheating, to cool in an ice bath, it is allowed to add cold water to the flask. There are cases when the reaction does not start, in which case it is necessary to warm the reaction mass thoroughly, and with a properly prepared amalgam, the reaction begins. The reaction proceeds with the release of the smell of a boiling alcohol and acetic acid mixture. To capture vapours, a spherical irrigation condenser is used, the efficiency of which can be increased by connecting running cold water to it or simply pouring cold water into.
> 
> 5:04 - You can rinse the flask with a little alcohol and rinse the unreacted aluminium with it to collect residues and increase the yield.
> 
> 5:13 - There should be little unreacted aluminium left. By the residues, you can determine the amount of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene reacted.
> 
> 5:16-6:13 - Alkalinization. The reaction proceeds with the release of heat. The remains of unreacted aluminium will additionally enter into reaction with alkali and heat the mixture, as well as create by-products.
> In the process of allowing the mixture to rest after alkalinization, separation into visible layers occurs within 30 minutes. The pH of the top layer should be 11-12.
> 
> 6:18-7:23 - Decantation: collect the top layer containing amphetamine base in alcohol. It can be dried a little with anhydrous magnesium sulfate, and the slag can be additionally extracted with a non-polar solvent (ether, benzene, toluene), the solvent is then evaporated.
> 
> 7:24-8:50 - Preparing a solution of sulphuric acid in acetone. It is made softer acidification of the product to be smoother. If concentrated sulphuric acid is used, there may be local over-acidification of the product.
> 
> 8:51-10:53 - Product acidification - obtaining amphetamine sulfate. To the upper yellow layer collected at the previous stage, a prepared solution of sulphuric acid is added dropwise. Flakes of salt will form with each drop. This stage is very important, it is necessary to carefully monitor the pH, avoiding over-acidification. Acidification is continued until pH 5.5-6 (neutral). The over-acidified product will be pinkish in colour. In case of global over-acidification, the product will be lost.
> 
> 10:55-11:38 - Filtration of amphetamine sulfate from solvents in a Buchner funnel under vacuum. At this stage, the product can be additionally rinsed with cold acetone by pouring it through the funnel with the substance.
> 
> 11:41-12:28 Filtration using improvised means. Any thick fabric can be used as a filter.
> The resulting product is dried in a warm dry place for several hours to remove residual solvents. It is recommended to store it in a vacuum package.
> 
> The yield is 60-70%.



HIGGS BOSSONDecantation: collect the top layer containing amphetamine base in alcohol. It can be dried a little with anhydrous magnesium sulfate, and the slag can be additionally extracted with a non-polar solvent (ether, benzene, toluene), the solvent is then evaporated.


----------



## Mo0odi

Mo0odi said:


> Decantation: collect the top layer containing amphetamine base in alcohol. It can be dried a little with anhydrous magnesium sulfate, and the slag can be additionally extracted with a non-polar solvent (ether, benzene, toluene), the solvent is then evaporated.



Mo0odiCan you explain this part more because I don't understand?


----------



## Mo0odi

Mo0odi said:


> Decantation: collect the top layer containing amphetamine base in alcohol. It can be dried a little with anhydrous magnesium sulfate, and the slag can be additionally extracted with a non-polar solvent (ether, benzene, toluene), the solvent is then evaporated.



Mo0odiCan someone teach me how to dry it


----------



## Curiousonion

Mo0odi said:


> Can someone teach me how to dry it



Mo0odi








Sodium Sulphate Anhydrous (Na2SO4) – A Drying Agent


Sodium sulphate anhydrous, one of the drying agents is used in many industrial sectors. Read more about sodium sulphate anhydrous as a drying agent.




www.chemtradeasia.com


----------



## G.Patton

Mo0odi said:


> Can you explain this part more because I don't understand?



Mo0odiHello. You can use English language only for publication. Please, read about Decantation in Decantation, gravity filtration and liquid transferring post.
Magnesium sulfate (MgSO4) is added to organic solution and it absorbs molecules of water from solution. MgSO4 is powder becomes solid piece, when absorbed water. You have to add MgSO4 until it will not absorb water any more.


----------



## Mo0odi

G.Patton said:


> Hello. You can use English language only for publication. Please, read about Decantation in Decantation, gravity filtration and liquid transferring post.
> Magnesium sulfate (MgSO4) is added to organic solution and it absorbs molecules of water from solution. MgSO4 is powder becomes solid piece, when absorbed water. You have to add MgSO4 until it will not absorb water any more.



G.PattonThank you


----------



## Mo0odi

Than



Curiousonion said:


> Sodium Sulphate Anhydrous (Na2SO4) – A Drying Agent
> 
> 
> Sodium sulphate anhydrous, one of the drying agents is used in many industrial sectors. Read more about sodium sulphate anhydrous as a drying agent.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.chemtradeasia.com



CuriousonionThank you


----------



## s3v3n

When adding the acid at the and, would IT also be possible to dilute the acid with more ipa? And what pH should i aim for when i use phosphoric acid and want the monobasic Salt? Thanks a Lot


----------



## G.Patton

s3v3n said:


> When adding the acid at the and, would IT also be possible to dilute the acid with more ipa? And what pH should i aim for when i use phosphoric acid and want the monobasic Salt? Thanks a Lot



s3v3nYou have to add equimolar quantity of orthophosphoric acid to obtained amphetamine free base to get mono amphetamine phosphate.


----------



## s3v3n

yes, i understand that, but how do i know how much freebase i have, yield can be quite different


----------



## G.Patton

s3v3n said:


> yes, i understand that, but how do i know how much freebase i have, yield can be quite different



s3v3nDo you know that you can measure it with a cylinder or a scale?


----------



## Oppenheimer

I am going to attempt my first synthesis later this month. I am a post grad and I have access to some lab equipment where I can basically do anything without needing someone to sign off on it. I will just need to make sure I properly sanitize everything after, but it's not a problem. I am excited to share my progress on here with all of you.


----------



## G.Patton

Oppenheimer said:


> I am going to attempt my first synthesis later this month. I am a post grad and I have access to some lab equipment where I can basically do anything without needing someone to sign off on it. I will just need to make sure I properly sanitize everything after, but it's not a problem. I am excited to share my progress on here with all of you.



OppenheimerWe would like to see your synthesis report, good luck.


----------



## G.Patton

Mo0odi said:


> Can someone teach me how to dry it



Mo0odi









Your browser is not able to display this video.


Download Video






Drying of Organic Liquids



__ G.Patton
__ Sep 11, 2022
__ 2
__
drying agent
drying of organic liquids
mgso4
na2so4




Drying of Organic Liquids...


----------



## Mo0odi

G.Patton said:


> Your browser is not able to display this video.
> 
> 
> Download Video
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drying of Organic Liquids
> 
> 
> 
> __ G.Patton
> __ Sep 11, 2022
> __ 2
> __
> drying agent
> drying of organic liquids
> mgso4
> na2so4
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drying of Organic Liquids...



G.PattonThank you


----------



## KokosDreams

This just depends on your source of NaBH4, I am testing a new supplier for it soon that will offer it for 128€/Kg which makes it competible to the Al/Hg route.

On an industrial scale precursors and chemicals could be ordered from overseas (India, China, Pakistan), where they would get so cheap with Al/Hg and the CuCL2/NaBH4 route that both routes could be reduced to below 300€/Liter Freebase (from my calculations)


----------



## GhostOfHiroshima

hi there, i'm new to this and someone mentioned that sulfuric acid is substitutable with phosphoric acid. now i have some questions: which concentration is needed? what i found is acid with 37 % (but i think this is only working for dentists) and concentrations from 75 to 85 %. is this okay for use and is the procedure exactly the same like shown in the video? furthermore i had the same problems with the other ingredients: glacial acetic acid, IPA and acetone, what concentration is needed? my guess would have been, the purer, the better but since i'm absolutely new to this, i thought asking for it is no mistake. and finally, the mercury nitrate, it is really hard to get. i couldn't even find oldschool thermometers, at least where i come from. does anyone know suppliers in europe?


thanks in advance


----------



## s3v3n

GhostOfHiroshima said:


> hi there, i'm new to this and someone mentioned that sulfuric acid is substitutable with phosphoric acid. now i have some questions: which concentration is needed? what i found is acid with 37 % (but i think this is only working for dentists) and concentrations from 75 to 85 %. is this okay for use and is the procedure exactly the same like shown in the video? furthermore i had the same problems with the other ingredients: glacial acetic acid, IPA and acetone, what concentration is needed? my guess would have been, the purer, the better but since i'm absolutely new to this, i thought asking for it is no mistake. and finally, the mercury nitrate, it is really hard to get. i couldn't even find oldschool thermometers, at least where i come from. does anyone know suppliers in europe?



GhostOfHiroshimaThe procedure for phosphoric acid is similar but you cant use pH for this, you have to determine the moles of freebase you have and Put the Same amount of moles of phosphoric acid. Higher concetration is good, because Amphetamine Phosphate is soluable in water and If you drain the solvents some of your Produkt will get lost, but IT really isnt much If you have 85% phosphoric acid and you can evaporate the solvent to get Higher yields


----------



## KokosDreams

GhostOfHiroshima said:


> hi there, i'm new to this and someone mentioned that sulfuric acid is substitutable with phosphoric acid. now i have some questions: which concentration is needed? what i found is acid with 37 % (but i think this is only working for dentists) and concentrations from 75 to 85 %. is this okay for use and is the procedure exactly the same like shown in the video? furthermore i had the same problems with the other ingredients: glacial acetic acid, IPA and acetone, what concentration is needed? my guess would have been, the purer, the better but since i'm absolutely new to this, i thought asking for it is no mistake. and finally, the mercury nitrate, it is really hard to get. i couldn't even find oldschool thermometers, at least where i come from. does anyone know suppliers in europe?
> 
> 
> thanks in advance



GhostOfHiroshimaHey there, I'd say you do nothing wrong with choosing higher concentrated ingredients especially for the sulfuric acid.
My assumption would be that impure ingredients have negative influences on yields and the final product quality.

As for IPA, Glacial Acetic Acid and Acetone, you're best of with the highest concentration you can find.

As for the Mercury (II) Nitrate - it is definitely not easy to find currently but I could recommend you a vendor from russia, that sells it.
I found that Mercury (II) Chloride is way easier to source though, you can get from the following shops/vendors

@Constantylious777 quite costy at 2.350EUR/Kg
Website: Organic Chemistry Poland 168EUR/Kg

I hope I could help


----------



## GhostOfHiroshima

thank you very much guys!!!


----------



## KokosDreams

GhostOfHiroshima said:


> thank you very much guys!!!



GhostOfHiroshimaWelcome


----------



## contol

Without a reflux condenser, we will deal with the evaporation of alcohol. If the precipitate turns into a stone, add pure alcohol to the reaction again. Fully sealed barrel is not suitable, as we will deal with strongly increasing pressure


----------



## G.Patton

contol said:


> Without a reflux condenser, we will deal with the evaporation of alcohol. If the precipitate turns into a stone, add pure alcohol to the reaction again. Fully sealed barrel is not suitable, as we will deal with strongly increasing pressure



contolYou have to use reflux condenser as described in HIGGS BOSSON explanation under this video


> Smells of a boiling alcohol and acetic acid are released during reaction. Allihn reflux condenser is used for a vapors capturing. The efficiency of Allihn reflux condenser can be increased by a running cold water, which can be connected to it.


----------



## meribel

Hello guys,

How to do an acid-base extraction for the freebase ? Can i use Toluene and a Separatory funnel ?

I couldn't get hold of sulfuric acid unfortunately so I will use phosphoric acid.
Should I just add phosphoric acid or mix it with acetone like with sulfuric acid?
For 10ml of freebase amphetamine for example how much acid should I add? I tried to understand the g/mol but I can't..

Thank you for your answers !! 

Meribel.


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

meribel said:


> Hello guys,
> 
> How to do an acid-base extraction for the freebase ? Can i use Toluene and a Separatory funnel ?
> 
> I couldn't get hold of sulfuric acid unfortunately so I will use phosphoric acid.
> Should I just add phosphoric acid or mix it with acetone like with sulfuric acid?
> For 10ml of freebase amphetamine for example how much acid should I add? I tried to understand the g/mol but I can't..
> 
> Thank you for your answers !!
> 
> Meribel.



meribelPage 81, no dillution, 85% added as in in equimolar amounts to freebase.Idk about toluene.



https://ia600202.us.archive.org/34/items/Pharmaceutical_Manufacturing_Encyclopedia_Vols_12_2nd_Ed/Pharmaceutical_Manufacturing_Encyclopedia_Vols_12_2nd_Ed.pdf


----------



## G.Patton

meribel said:


> How to do an acid-base extraction for the freebase ? Can i use Toluene and a Separatory funnel ?



meribelHello. You can't carry out A/B extraction for free base. It is possible to do only with amphetamine salts. You can read manual from main page of Amphetamines section Amphetamine purification by acid-base extraction



meribel said:


> or mix it with acetone like with sulfuric acid?


Yes, you have to make solution like a sulfuric acid with acetone.



meribel said:


> For 10ml of freebase amphetamine for example how much acid should I add? I tried to understand the g/mol but I can't..


To cound how much acid do you need we will take *10 ml of amph free base* as in example. 10ml of amph base / 0.936 g/ml = 10.6838 g. You have to count amount of moles: 10.6838g /135.21 g/mole = 0.079 moles of amphetamine. To produce monoamphetamine phosphate you have to take same amount of acid as amphetamine. 
Hence: 0.079 moles * 97.994 g/mole = 7.743g of pure H3PO4. In case you have 70% acid solution, you have to take (7.743g * 100) / 70 = *11.06 ml of 70% H3PO4.*


----------



## G.Patton

UWe9o12jkied91d said:


> Page 81, no dillution, 85% added as in in equimolar amounts to freebase.Idk about toluene.



UWe9o12jkied91dThere is (p.82) clearly written that solution of amphetamine was made with acetone:


> 135 g (1 mol) of amphetamine (lphenyl-2-aminopropane) were stirred into 300 cc of acetone
> in a stainlesssteel vessel. To the resultant solution there were slowly added under constant
> agitation 115.3 g of 85% phosphoric acid (containing 1 mol of HBPO~),care being taken to
> avoid any sudden rise in temperature or local overheating due to the considerable amount of
> heat that is evolved. During the addition of the phosphoric acid a fine, white, flocculent pre-
> cipitate appears which becomes more and more dense and abundant, as the quantity of added
> acid increases.


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Oops, yes, exactly why I linked source, my bad.



G.Patton said:


> There is (p.82) clearly written that solution of amphetamine was made with acetone:



G.Patton


----------



## meribel

G.Patton said:


> Hello. You can't carry out A/B extraction for free base. It is possible to do only with amphetamine salts. You can read manual from main page of Amphetamines section Amphetamine purification by acid-base extraction
> 
> 
> Yes, you have to make solution like a sulfuric acid with acetone.
> 
> 
> To cound how much acid do you need we will take *10 ml of amph free base* as in example. 10ml of amph base / 0.936 g/ml = 10.6838 g. You have to count amount of moles: 10.6838g /135.21 g/mole = 0.079 moles of amphetamine. To produce monoamphetamine phosphate you have to take same amount of acid as amphetamine.
> Hence: 0.079 moles * 97.994 g/mole = 7.743g of pure H3PO4. In case you have 70% acid solution, you have to take (7.743g * 100) / 70 = *11.06 ml of 70% H3PO4.*



G.Pattonthanks for the explanations, they are very clear as usual! 

and for the quantity of acetone to add do I have to calculate it too?


----------



## meribel

Can't edit my post but if 7.743g of pure H3PO4 is needed for 10ml of freebase amph, with a 85% solution we take (7.743*100)/85 = 9.109g of 85% H3PO4.
Density of phosphoric acid is 1.6845 g/cm3 then 5.40ml is needed ? 
Or i'm totally out ? 

Thanks for answer


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

keep in mind in the procedure solvent is evaporated to leave only freebase that in turn gets dilluted with acetone, if you just extract with non polar without evaporating dilluting might not be the best idea.


----------



## G.Patton

meribel said:


> Density of phosphoric acid is 1.6845 g/cm3 then 5.40ml is needed ?
> Or i'm totally out ?



meribel9.109g / 1,6845 g/cm3 = 5.40ml of 85% H3PO4 You are right!  Take into account that *density of acid solution depends on concentration*.


----------



## meribel

G.Patton said:


> 9.109g / 1,6845 g/cm3 = 5.40ml of 85% H3PO4 You are right!  Take into account that *density of acid solution depends on concentration*.



G.PattonThanks for clarification Sir! 
About acetone how much i need to add ? Some calcul to do or a ladder to respect ?


----------



## G.Patton

meribel said:


> Thanks for clarification Sir!
> About acetone how much i need to add ? Some calcul to do or a ladder to respect ?



meribelread there


----------



## meribel

Then if i resume,
I have to mix phosphoric acid with a ratio 1:10 to acetone, and i don't search to reach Ph 6 but i add the entire mixture and stir for get phosphate amphetamine ?

Thanks everyone for answer


----------



## Mo0odi

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> Your browser is not able to display this video.
> 
> 
> Download Video
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Amphetamine synthesis from P2NP via Al/Hg (video)
> 
> 
> 
> __ HEISENBERG
> __ May 27, 2022
> __ 5
> __
> adderall
> amphetamine
> amphetamine synthesis
> amphetamine video
> amphetamines
> amphetamines salts
> cas 300-62-9
> cas 705-60-2
> p2np
> video synthesis
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://bbgate.com/threads/synthesis-of-amphetamine-from-p2np-via-al-hg-video.196/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View media item 64​



HIGGS BOSSONWhat quantities are used in this video?
I mean the new video


----------



## KokosDreams

Mo0odi said:


> What quantities are used in this video?
> I mean the new video



Mo0odi
10 g 1-Phenyl-2-nitropropene (P2NP);
100 ml Isopropyl alcohol (IPA);
50 ml Glacial acetic acid (AcOH);
50 g Sodium hydroxide (NaOH);
12 g Aluminium (in the form of sliced household foil);
0.1g Mercury (II) nitrate (Hg(NO3)2);
2 ml Sulphuric acid (H2SO4);
50 ml Acetone;
Distilled water;
First comment of this post you can find the description


----------



## Mo0odi

KokosDreams said:


> 10 g 1-Phenyl-2-nitropropene (P2NP);
> 100 ml Isopropyl alcohol (IPA);
> 50 ml Glacial acetic acid (AcOH);
> 50 g Sodium hydroxide (NaOH);
> 12 g Aluminium (in the form of sliced household foil);
> 0.1g Mercury (II) nitrate (Hg(NO3)2);
> 2 ml Sulphuric acid (H2SO4);
> 50 ml Acetone;
> Distilled water;
> First comment of this post you can find the description



KokosDreamsThank you


----------



## KokosDreams

Mo0odi said:


> Thank you



Mo0odiYou're welcome


----------



## user123qwe

G.Patton said:


> Hello. We would like to get feedback from you about this supplier. Please, share us result of your deal.



G.PattonHi! I have just bought Sulphuric Acid and Nitric Acid from Aurelio. In the beginning they ask for proof of commercial activity, and I sent him a pdf indicating I am an independent researcher. And that´s all. I paid via Paypal and next day my order was delivered with tracking number. It arrived in 6 days.


----------



## G.Patton

user123qwe said:


> Hi! I have just bought Sulphuric Acid and Nitric Acid from Aurelio. In the beginning they ask for proof of commercial activity, and I sent him a pdf indicating I am an independent researcher. And that´s all. I paid via Paypal and next day my order was delivered with tracking number. It arrived in 6 days.



user123qweThank you for information!


----------



## KokosDreams

user123qwe said:


> Hi! I have just bought Sulphuric Acid and Nitric Acid from Aurelio. In the beginning they ask for proof of commercial activity, and I sent him a pdf indicating I am an independent researcher. And that´s all. I paid via Paypal and next day my order was delivered with tracking number. It arrived in 6 days.



user123qweWhat was the quantity ordered? I'd assume this technique works fine for smaller quantities but not that well for bulk?


----------



## user123qwe

KokosDreams said:


> What was the quantity ordered? I'd assume this technique works fine for smaller quantities but not that well for bulk?



KokosDreamsIt was 1 liter each. The minimum possible. But it looks like you can order 20l with no problem.


----------



## KokosDreams

user123qwe said:


> It was 1 liter each. The minimum possible. But it looks like you can order 20l with no problem.



user123qweWould you mind sending me an example of such an PDF via DM? Doesn't needs to be the exact PDF you have sent but an example would be super useful


----------



## Benz88

user123qwe said:


> Hi! I have just bought Sulphuric Acid and Nitric Acid from Aurelio. In the beginning they ask for proof of commercial activity, and I sent him a pdf indicating I am an independent researcher. And that´s all. I paid via Paypal and next day my order was delivered with tracking number. It arrived in 6 days.



user123qweHey can you show me how it looks like your pdf ? Got the Same problem with aurelio now .


----------



## BRKNGBD45

is the free base of amphetamin the same as the ampethaminoil ( a-oil ) what i can buy online in the internet? and does it mean that i can make the same steps like in the video (Synthesis from P2NP via Al/Hg)
with the (a-oil) if i join at minute 7:24?


----------



## wannabeechemist

What is sold online is basically amphetamine, which is illegal and diluted with solvents. The amount of freebase amine is equal to amount of amph salt you have. you can make sulfate, hydrochloride or phosphate salt and you ll see how little you actually made


----------



## G.Patton

BRKNGBD45 said:


> is the free base of amphetamin the same as the ampethaminoil ( a-oil ) what i can buy online in the internet? and does it mean that i can make the same steps like in the video (Synthesis from P2NP via Al/Hg)
> with the (a-oil) if i join at minute 7:24?



BRKNGBD45Yes, it is the same.


----------



## teodor

hello.i have a problem with the synthesis.everything goes well until the moment of adding alkali.the mixture thickens and the layers cannot be separated.what should i do


----------



## wannabeechemist

Is your P2NP clean? did you keep RM between 50-55 degrees? Did you add enough IPA? Is ph of the final mess 11?


----------



## teodor

the quality of the reagent is good. the temperature may have been a bit off. I added 20 ml more alcohol


----------



## G.Patton

teodor said:


> the moment of adding alkali



teodorHave you added alkali solid or alkali aq solution?


----------



## teodor

my alkalis are hard. I dissolved 40g in 120ml of water


----------



## teodor

tomorrow I will try again and upload pictures of the chemicals and reactions. wouldn't it be better to use a thick foil. that way it won't turn out to be a gray mess


----------



## ASheSChem

teodor said:


> my alkalis are hard. I dissolved 40g in 120ml of water



teodorfor me, for 10gr P2NP the alkali solution is 50gr NAoH + 150ml H2O


----------



## teodor

I made a third attempt. this time everything worked out and I got a pretty good product. the problem was alkalizing. I added a little


----------



## G.Patton

teodor said:


> my alkalis are hard. I dissolved 40g in 120ml of water



teodorYou have to use aq solution


teodor said:


> I made a third attempt. this time everything worked out and I got a pretty good product. the problem was alkalizing. I added a little


good luck


----------



## teodor

experience 3 4 5 everything is now great. every time the product is white with a very slight smell of vinegar. average yield per batch 8g per 10g of nitropropene


----------



## teodor

8.1g


----------



## Yiazo

Hello 
I have some questions

can we replace the 0,3g mercury (II) nitrate by the cloride (II) mercury?
I'm looking for someone who can provide me with 95/99% sulfuric acid
I know this is not the right topic but I could not find anywhere to make my request. I apologize
thank


----------



## ASheSChem

Yiazo said:


> I'm looking for someone who can provide me with 95/99% sulfuric acid



Yiazo





KELFORT Rioolontstopper 96% zwavelzuur 1 LITER | Keller's IJzerhandel B.V.


Krachtige vloeibare ontstopper voor afvoeren en riolen. Het vernietigt snel allerlei organische stoffen. Uitsluitend bedoeld voor professioneel gebruik. Niet gebruiken bij niet hittebestendige, flexibele leidingen, niet in combinatie met reeds gebruikte andere ontstoppingsmiddelen en niet in...




www.keller.nl












Kelfort Rioolontstopper 1LTR 96% ZW.ZU.


Bestel de Kelfort Rioolontstopper 1LTR 96% ZW.ZU. bij Toolsvoordelig. Voor 22:00u besteld, morgen in huis!




www.toolsvoordelig.nl




...


----------



## KokosDreams

Yiazo said:


> Hello
> I have some questions
> 
> can we replace the 0,3g mercury (II) nitrate by the cloride (II) mercury?
> I'm looking for someone who can provide me with 95/99% sulfuric acid
> I know this is not the right topic but I could not find anywhere to make my request. I apologize
> thank



YiazoYes, the Nitrate can be replaced with Chloride


----------



## user123qwe

I have a question. Are these crystals that appear in the bottom gray layer of the base solution P2NP that has not reacted? It is curious, they have appeared just the time I have had the active reaction for about two hours, longer than usual. (I usually allow half an hour to pass before proceeding with the basification)



The resulting yield has been very high (75%, more or less), and I think the final appearance is quite satisfactory.


----------



## Mdp2p

Is it advisable to use fine aluminum so that it reacts faster and better?


----------



## G.Patton

Mdp2p said:


> Is it advisable to use fine aluminum so that it reacts faster and better?



Mdp2pbetter to use clean thin foil


----------



## Mdp2p

G.Patton said:


> mejor usar papel de aluminio limpio y delgado



G.Patton


G.Patton said:


> better to use clean thin foil


Reynolds aluminum foil. Cut them into 1x1?


----------



## G.Patton

user123qwe said:


> I have a question. Are these crystals that appear in the bottom gray layer of the base solution P2NP that has not reacted? It is curious, they have appeared just the time I have had the active reaction for about two hours, longer than usual. (I usually allow half an hour to pass before proceeding with the basification)



user123qweAre these crystals formed after P2NP reduction on Al/Hg? Probably it is complex salt of Al


----------



## G.Patton

Mdp2p said:


> Reynolds aluminum foil. Cut them into 1x1?



Mdp2pI have already written about it in Aluminium amalgam (Al/Hg) summary


----------



## Mdp2p

G.Patton said:


> I have already written about it in Aluminium amalgam (Al/Hg) summary



G.Pattoninteresting! Thank you very much! I wrote you a private message to see if you would be so kind to help me. That way I don't bore people with my questions


----------



## user123qwe

G.Patton said:


> Are these crystals formed after P2NP reduction on Al/Hg? Probably it is complex salt of Al



G.PattonYes, these crystals are formed after P2NP reduction on Al/Hg. This is not the first time I see them, that's why I have picture them.


----------



## G.Patton

user123qwe said:


> Yes, these crystals are formed after P2NP reduction on Al/Hg. This is not the first time I see them, that's why I have picture them.



user123qweAre they dissolve in water?


----------



## user123qwe

G.Patton said:


> Are they dissolve in water?



G.PattonYes


----------



## teodor

hello. i need advice. today during the synthesis the vessel burst and the reaction mass mixed with a large amount of water. the reaction was at the beginning of recovery and everything stopped. now i have a large amount of solution without separation of layers and without sediment. these were 50 grams of propene. can anything be done to at least recover some of it


----------



## G.Patton

user123qwe said:


> Yes



user123qweLikely, it is complex Al salt Na[Al(OH)4], it forms during followings reactions:
2Al + 2NaOH + 6H2O ==> 2Na[Al(OH4)] + 3H2
NaOH + Al (OH)3 ---> Na[Al(OH)4]

It also soluble in water.


----------



## G.Patton

teodor said:


> hello. i need advice. today during the synthesis the vessel burst and the reaction mass mixed with a large amount of water. the reaction was at the beginning of recovery and everything stopped. now i have a large amount of solution without separation of layers and without sediment. these were 50 grams of propene. can anything be done to at least recover some of it



teodoryou can evaporate water and get some p2np back


----------



## ymaaah

I have a little question, when he do the aluminium amalgam, why nothing is joined to the condenser?


----------



## teodor

however, I also added the base hoping that some oil would float out, no, nothing happened. I have to filter the aluminum, but when I evaporate the water, won't there be a mixture of soda and propene left? I'm sorry for the stupid questions, but I'm a beginner



G.Patton said:


> you can evaporate water and get some p2np back



G.Patton


----------



## G.Patton

teodor said:


> however, I also added the base hoping that some oil would float out, no, nothing happened. I have to filter the aluminum, but when I evaporate the water, won't there be a mixture of soda and propene left?



teodorYes, you have to recrystallize your p2np after this procedure. Don't be sorry and hesitate to ask questions. Everyone here was a beginner once.


----------



## teodor

G.Patton said:


> Yes, you have to recrystallize your p2np after this procedure. Don't be sorry and hesitate to ask questions. Everyone here was a beginner once.



G.Pattonok. so I filter then evaporate to dryness and then add isopropyl alcohol, will only the propene dissolve or the soda also


----------



## melk

*SCAMMER ALLERT P2NP*

*THE USER **[email protected] // [email protected] // *

*I buy P2NP 2000gr after payment, they don't answer you 
I got the name from this forum
so people don't trust any new add on this forum because they scam you*

*SCAM allert ! ! ! ! ! *

Wickr: *[email protected]*

Telegram: *@discreetonly*

Email: [email protected]


----------



## KokosDreams

melk said:


> *SCAMMER ALLERT P2NP*
> 
> *THE USER **[email protected] // [email protected] // *
> 
> *I buy P2NP 2000gr after payment, they don't answer you
> I got the name from this forum
> so people don't trust any new add on this forum because they scam you*
> 
> *SCAM allert ! ! ! ! ! *
> 
> Wickr: *[email protected]*
> 
> Telegram: *@discreetonly*
> 
> Email: [email protected]



melkToo bad - Sorry for your loss man.

If you need reliable P2NP vendor that are not overpriced, let me know


----------



## melk

KokosDreams said:


> Too bad - Sorry for your loss man.
> 
> If you need reliable P2NP vendor that are not overpriced, let me know



KokosDreamsyes thanks if possible post here so other people see it to 
and from the moment there is a problem other people see it and replay to it .


----------



## KokosDreams

melk said:


> yes thanks if possible post here so other people see it to
> and from the moment there is a problem other people see it and replay to it .



melkI do not post too sensitive information public but with some research my contacts are public knowledge on the forum


----------



## melk

No, thanks, it is at the moment too dangerous to trust offers in private messages. 
They are sellers, this is dark net, what is the problem ?
With dread, offline scammers can do what they want.
*People don't trust any offers in private messages for now*
if they are legit, they post it here in the forum if they don't want to do this
find someone else


----------



## KokosDreams

melk said:


> No, thanks, it is at the moment too dangerous to trust offers in private messages.
> ...
> if they are legit, they post it here in the forum if they don't want to do this
> find someone else



melk


----------



## G.Patton

melk said:


> No, thanks, it is at the moment too dangerous to trust offers in private messages.
> They are sellers, this is dark net, what is the problem ?
> With dread, offline scammers can do what they want.
> *People don't trust any offers in private messages for now*
> if they are legit, they post it here in the forum if they don't want to do this
> find someone else



melkAgree. Better to use BB Listing. Also, you can use BB Escrow service it order to avoid scam and save your money. In addition, we going to move Black list of supplier on the main page, @HEISENBERG is already work with this issue.


----------



## G.Patton

@melk 
These sellers are scammers!​


----------



## melk

G.Patton said:


> @melk
> These sellers are scammers!​



G.Pattondone thx


----------



## SD850IS

I can not seem to locate Anhydrous Acetone...Whenever I used acetone in the past for a synthesis it was acetone from a 
hardware store, the brand is called klean strip. What is the difference, and can a hardware store acetone be use in the 
Amphetamine synthesis???​


----------



## m03

Just asking out curiosity...if we were unable to acquire the 2L flat bottom flask seen in the first video and substituted it with something like a milk gallon, would the heat cause it to melt and essentially contaminate the synthesis? 
Also, in the same first video, do we use all 50g of the Sodium Hydroxide for the solution?


----------



## G.Patton

m03 said:


> Just asking out curiosity...if we were unable to acquire the 2L flat bottom flask seen in the first video and substituted it with something like a milk gallon, would the heat cause it to melt and essentially contaminate the synthesis?



m03You can carry out an experiment: pour 60-70 deg hot water into this kind bottle and keep it for 10-15 min. Take into account that you can't attach reflux condenser to this bottle.


m03 said:


> Also, in the same first video, do we use all 50g of the Sodium Hydroxide for the solution?


yes


----------



## m03

G.Patton said:


> You can carry out an experiment: pour 60-70 deg hot water into this kind bottle and keep it for 10-15 min. Take into account that you can't attach reflux condenser to this bottle.
> 
> yes



G.Pattonwill the use of no reflux cause any issues within the synthesis?


----------



## G.Patton

m03 said:


> will the use of no reflux cause any issues within the synthesis?



m03Solvent will be evaporated partially or completely.


----------



## ImOut

melk said:


> No, thanks, it is at the moment too dangerous to trust offers in private messages.
> They are sellers, this is dark net, what is the problem ?
> With dread, offline scammers can do what they want.
> *People don't trust any offers in private messages for now*
> if they are legit, they post it here in the forum if they don't want to do this
> find someone else



melkI disagree with you, you can make quite accurate determinations if a person is legitimate or not buy asking a few questions.

And no, the reason for SMART people is to not give out their contacts publicly, everything that is public is suddenly under law enforcements watch list. Less people know of some suppliers the better for people who are serious and work large scale operations.

I would disagree with G.Patton to a certain extent, yes BBlistings offer legitimate sources, but they are unregulated when it comes to prices. I've spoken to some and their arguments are laughable.

The prices should be regulated on the forum matching the outside market and keep on being regulated and not use the U.S. "open market" value system.


----------



## G.Patton

eyelow said:


> I would disagree with G.Patton to a certain extent, yes BBlistings offer legitimate sources, but they are unregulated when it comes to prices. I've spoken to some and their arguments are laughable.
> 
> The prices should be regulated on the forum matching the outside market and keep on being regulated and not use the U.S. "open market" value system.



eyelowIt means a market economy. Nobody will sell with a loss. If we will regulate prices, nobody will work with us. We just can regulate deal fulfilling as escrow service.


----------



## ImOut

G.Patton said:


> It means a market economy. Nobody will sell with a loss. If we will regulate prices, nobody will work with us. We just can regulate deal fulfilling as escrow service.



G.PattonG.Patton, 

I would have to disagree with you on this post also.

People will work here if there is a market, and the request as we can see is high on the forum. 

Regulating a market has does not mean loss for sellers, this is not how economy works. If you have a regulated market it means more prospects will be interested in working on the forum and the members will feel more safe.

Let's for instance make an example:

One of you actuall sellers here on BB-list, sells P2nP / 1KG for 200$ the target price in Europe is 100$. Which means the vendor makes atleast 100% profit, how is it a loss if the market would be regulated to 100$/KG? Ofcourse they will make a profit, not 100% but maybe 20% instead. 

This is a business and should be treated accordingly, I believe the forum will make more losses in the long run because of an unregulated market because as you can see, majority of members are actually looking for sources outside of the forum because people know the market is much cheaper outside of the forum and the quality is equal.


----------



## melk

eyelow said:


> I disagree with you, you can make quite accurate determinations if a person is legitimate or not buy asking a few questions.
> 
> And no, the reason for SMART people is to not give out their contacts publicly, everything that is public is suddenly under law enforcements watch list. Less people know of some suppliers the better for people who are serious and work large scale operations.
> 
> I would disagree with G.Patton to a certain extent, yes BBlistings offer legitimate sources, but they are unregulated when it comes to prices. I've spoken to some and their arguments are laughable.
> 
> The prices should be regulated on the forum matching the outside market and keep on being regulated and not use the U.S. "open market" value system.



eyelowYou are a very strange person. 
If people ask for a product you claim you always can find it and allot below the normal price .
but you never answer directly . Only true, in a very sneaky way. 
I don't trust you to be honest.


----------



## ImOut

melk said:


> You are a very strange person.
> If people ask for a product you claim you always can find it and allot below the normal price .
> but you never answer directly . Only true, in a very sneaky way.
> I don't trust you to be honest.



melkI did not understand your point.

If you want to discuss this topic further, please, send me a PM.


----------



## andre010

Hello, can you please help me ?

Is it possible to take Lithiumaluminiumhydrid in THF (LiAlH4) instead of Al/Hg with your method shown in the video ?

Can I copy your way of synthesis with using LiAlH4 in THF ?


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

andre010 said:


> Hello, can you please help me ?
> 
> Is it possible to take Lithiumaluminiumhydrid in THF (LiAlH4) instead of Al/Hg with your method shown in the video ?
> 
> Can I copy your way of synthesis with using LiAlH4 in THF ?



andre010No, sir. LiAH is for lab use only, it is VERY pyrophoric.Read saftey data sheet of what you want to work with please!Also, you have procedure for LiAH reduction somewhere in this section, if you search and see you will indeed notice they are very different.

NaBH4 is a good substitute, check the thread.


----------



## andre010

ACAB said:


> Ich denke, dass sich keine Blasen mehr bilden, sobald der zugängliche Teil des Aluminiums reagiert hat, es schwimmen keine Moleküle im Wasser, Aluminium ist ein Metall, das bildlich gesprochen schichtweise abgetragen werden muss. Das bedeutet, dass unter der Schicht noch genug umwandelbares Aluminium vorhanden ist, um zu HgAl zu und dann das P2NP zu reduzieren, dh die Kettenreaktion ist beendet, sobald die Oberfläche der Folie angekratzt ist. Anschließend wird das Wasser abgelassen und das Amalgam in Verbindung mit dem Luftsauerstoff eine Oxidschicht gebildet, die das Amalgam wieder reaktionsunfähig macht. Unsere P2NP-Lösung WIRD hinzugefügt und wir haben kein reaktives Amalgam zur Verfügung, also fügen wir viel Quecksilbersalz hinzu, das sterbende Reaktion und Reduktion gestartet, sichtbar durch die vielen kleinen Blasen, die erscheinen,
> Wir haben normalerweise einen Überschuss an Folie drin, um das gesamte P2NP umzuwandeln, aber wenn am Ende viel mehr Aluminium übrig ist, ist die Reduktion nicht vollständig und nicht das gesamte P2NP wurde umgewandelt, was weniger Ausbeute bedeutet, und das bedeutet, dass wir haben nicht genug Amalgam gebildet, um alles umzuwandeln. Was wir tun, wenn wir nicht warten, bis bei der Verschmelzung keine Blasen mehr aufsteigen.
> Meine Meinung, ich weiß es nicht.
> 
> Kein Aluminium und kein machbares P2NP wäre das theoretische Optimum, das niemals erreicht wird.



ACAB


UWe9o12jkied91d said:


> Nein Herr. LiAH ist nur für Laborzwecke, es ist SEHR pyrophor. Lesen Sie bitte das Sicherheitsdatenblatt darüber, womit Sie arbeiten möchten! Außerdem haben Sie irgendwo in diesem Abschnitt Verfahren zur LiAH-Reduzierung, wenn Sie suchen und sehen, werden Sie tatsächlich feststellen, dass sie sehr stark anders sind.
> 
> NaBH4 ist ein guter Ersatz, siehe Thread.


auch mit LiAH-Reduzierung


UWe9o12jkied91d said:


> Nein Sir. LiAH ist nur für Laborzwecke, es ist SEHR pyrophor. Lesen Sie bitte das Sicherheitsdatenblatt darüber, womit Sie arbeiten möchten! Außerdem haben Sie irgendwo in diesem Abschnitt Verfahren zur LiAH-Reduzierung, wenn Sie suchen und sehen, werden Sie tatsächlich feststellen, dass sie sehr stark sind anders.
> 
> NaBH4 ist ein guter Ersatz, siehe Thread.


so with NaBH4 instead of Lialh4 in THF I could kopie the procedure from your video ?


----------



## Benz88

Hey guys, I have successfully completed this synthesis several times with very good results. Unfortunately, the smell of isopropanol disturbs. What about ethyl acetate? Is it possible to replace iso with ethyl acetate? Thank you in advance dear community.


----------



## andre010

UWe9o12jkied91d said:


> No, sir. LiAH is for lab use only, it is VERY pyrophoric.Read saftey data sheet of what you want to work with please!Also, you have procedure for LiAH reduction somewhere in this section, if you search and see you will indeed notice they are very different.
> 
> NaBH4 is a good substitute, check the thread.



UWe9o12jkied91dDo you know a procedure to synthesis Amphetamine from reduction with LiAlH4 in THF to describe quickly and short ?


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

andre010 said:


> Do you know a procedure to synthesis Amphetamine from reduction with LiAlH4 in THF to describe quickly and short ?



andre010





Amphetamine synthesis via 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene LAH reduction


Reagents: Lithium aluminum hydride (LAH; cas 16853-85-3) 12 g; 1,4-Dioxane 300 ml; 1-Phenyl-2-nitropropene (P2NP; cas 705-60-2) 10 g; Sodium hydroxide (25% NaOH) aq. solution; Acetone ~50 ml; Sulfuric acid ~10 ml; Equipment and glassware: Two-naked round bottom flask 1 L; Retort stand and...




bbgate.com





here you go, please don't burn your house down
shulgin also describes this a few tens of times in pikhal


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

andre010 said:


> so with NaBH4 instead of Lialh4 in THF I could kopie the procedure from your video ?



andre010 Not exactly, look for NaBH4 procedure in this subforum.First one's free the second one you find yourself


----------



## workworkwork

eyelow said:


> One of you actuall sellers here on BB-list, sells P2nP / 1KG for 200$ the target price in Europe is 100$. Which means the vendor makes atleast 100% profit, how is it a loss if the market would be regulated to 100$/KG? Ofcourse they will make a profit, not 100% but maybe 20% instead.



eyelow
Could you share this supplier or send me in private message?


----------



## Jack

Cam somebody in great detail describe to me the exact moment I should pour off the mercuric solution from the aluminum when preparing an aluminum amalgam? It is unclear if there needs to be a heavy gray thick precipitate or not.


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Jack said:


> Cam somebody in great detail describe to me the exact moment I should pour off the mercuric solution from the aluminum when preparing an aluminum amalgam? It is unclear if there needs to be a heavy gray thick precipitate or not.



JackIf your precipitate is thick and the mass has turned an opaque light gray you are way past your point.If most of your aluminium sinks ay first a good indication is when most of it floats to the top.Also make sure youre using enough salt for the amount of Al, too little and amalgamation itself is too violent, turns white, bubbles like crazy etc.


----------



## Jack

If I add the reaction mixture and no reaction begins, I must heat it to start it yes?


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

You mean adding salt to aluminium? It should be a reaction but very gentle, I head using 0.1 / 10-12g Al is best.After adding mercuric salt swil amd observe , no need to heat.
If you mean adding p2np sol over amalgam then most likely your amalgam is incorrect.


----------



## andre010

Hello again, I found a vendor for Mercury Nitrate, it is cas: 7783-34-8 Mercury (II) nitrate Monohydrate !

Is this the correct Mercury Nitrate ?

btw. many thanks for your work and your help here !


----------



## andre010

andre010 said:


> Hello again, I found a vendor for Mercury Nitrate, it is cas: 7783-34-8 Mercury (II) nitrate Monohydrate !
> 
> Is this the correct Mercury Nitrate ?
> 
> btw. many thanks for your work and your help here !



andre010Found the answer myself, thank you anyway...

the recherche for my book is complete now ;-)


----------



## Jack

Can anybody tell me how important to the reaction proceeding is the presence of water in the reaction mixture?


----------



## lemon

Can aluminium foil with a thickness of 0,018mm be used? From a well-known chemical manufacturer

And regarding the acetic acid, I can get technical grade 80% and food grade 80%, which is the better option?

Thanks


----------



## G.Patton

Jack said:


> Can anybody tell me how important to the reaction proceeding is the presence of water in the reaction mixture?



JackIt is necessary to produce hydrogen H2 gas. You can read about reaction in this topic.



lemon said:


> And regarding the acetic acid, I can get technical grade 80% and food grade 80%, which is the better option?


You can. It's better to use food grade.


----------



## lemon

Is the condenser only needed for health reasons due to the vapor?

If I'm outside can I work without condenser? Wouldn't have some big losses?


----------



## G.Patton

lemon said:


> Is the condenser only needed for health reasons due to the vapor?
> 
> If I'm outside can I work without condenser? Wouldn't have some big losses?



lemonWith all my respect to beginners, you can open comment section and read. This question is already discussed here.


----------



## Foryou

welcome everybody
I want to share with you my experiences, I tried to cook amphetamine
, I failed in the first experiment
and I failed in the second experiment
, but I succeeded in the third experiment

My third experience was like this

I added 12 grams of aluminum in a 3 liter beaker and added to it 4 ml of mercury nitrate and one liter of distilled water and left it to react for ten minutes
, after which I removed the contaminated water, 
then cleaned it with two parts of water
....
Next, I added a solution of isopropyl alcohol, acetic acid, and p2np, 
and after that the temperature went up,
I cooled it down a bit and left it to react for about 30 minutes





.....
Then I dumped it into a container and added a sodium hydroxide solution to 11 ph









....
After that, amphetamine oil was extracted




.....
Then add acetone with sulfuric acid to drip amphetamine oil to pH 6




....
8 grams of amphetamine were obtained






....

Special thanks to teacher 
G.patton 
for helping me


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Foryou said:


> welcome everybody
> I want to share with you my experiences, I tried to cook amphetamine
> , I failed in the first experiment
> and I failed in the second experiment
> , but I succeeded in the third experiment
> 
> My third experience was like this
> 
> I added 12 grams of aluminum in a 3 liter beaker and added to it 4 ml of mercury nitrate and one liter of distilled water and left it to react for ten minutes
> , after which I removed the contaminated water,
> then cleaned it with two parts of water
> ....
> Next, I added a solution of isopropyl alcohol, acetic acid, and p2np,
> and after that the temperature went up,
> I cooled it down a bit and left it to react for about 30 minutes
> 
> View attachment 8171
> .....
> Then I dumped it into a container and added a sodium hydroxide solution to 11 ph
> View attachment 8172
> View attachment 8173
> View attachment 8174
> ....
> After that, amphetamine oil was extracted
> 
> View attachment 8175
> .....
> Then add acetone with sulfuric acid to drip amphetamine oil to pH 6
> 
> View attachment 8177
> ....
> 8 grams of amphetamine were obtained
> 
> View attachment 8178
> 
> 
> ....
> 
> Special thanks to teacher
> G.patton
> for helping me



ForyouNice, grats


----------



## nkd23

Hi 
I have problems to get H2SO4 conc in Europe/AT 

H2SO4 15% is the strongest I'm able to get 
Is it possible to produce with 15% ?


----------



## Gale

Amalgamation problems,

My solvent temp is around 0c starting and when I add merc to aluminum it takes forever to start and I've ruined some product adding it to soon. Seems like it will take like 3 hours in this temp. Am i right? I lost my shit at the lab I was really upset waiting there so late after I finally sourced some ultra pure Ai I thought it would speed things up, it was getting dull, but I had to leave at that point and I was so upset.

My ai is like .06 I think it was cut like nails, not how I asked and wanted so I decided to take initiative and cut it with scissors I got blisters lol


----------



## hjames

Is it better thicker or thinner alu foil?
I can obtain 9,10,11,12 microns thickness


----------



## Foryou

I used regular kitchen aluminum foil that you can get from any store


----------



## Jack

Can the acetic acid be replaced with formic acid?


----------



## G.Patton

Jack said:


> Can the acetic acid be replaced with formic acid?



JackYou can don't use acid at all. I told about in in this topic.


----------



## hjames

If I understood correctly in one video freebase is mixed with acetone 1:1 and used only Sulfuric acid, and in another video sulfuric acid is used diluted with acetone
What is better? What is an advantage if freebase is mixed 1:1 with acetone?


----------



## G.Patton

hjames said:


> What is better? What is an advantage if freebase is mixed 1:1 with acetone?



hjamesThere is no difference.


----------



## hjames

I only have 4000ml round bottom flask right now, I hope it won't be "too big" for a small scales like 10gr? 
I apologize for my (stupid) questions


----------



## Pavel

hjames said:


> Is it better thicker or thinner alu foil?
> I can obtain 9,10,11,12 microns thickness



hjames0.1mm or 0.2 mm .... 0.5 mm or even more like 1mm depend of quantity. Dear sir G.Patton Perhaps it would be valuable to add to the recipe that it is better to use a sheet of aluminium instead of foil. This calms the reaction and does not limit the quantity. you can also attach these sheets to the line and when the reaction becomes too violent you can pull out a few sheets until it calms down.


----------



## G.Patton

hjames said:


> I only have 4000ml round bottom flask right now, I hope it won't be "too big" for a small scales like 10gr?
> I apologize for my (stupid) questions



hjamesIt would be not convenient, but okay.


----------



## G.Patton

Pavel said:


> 0.1mm or 0.2 mm .... 0.5 mm or even more like 1mm depend of quantity. Dear sir G.Patton Perhaps it would be valuable to add to the recipe that it is better to use a sheet of aluminium instead of foil. This calms the reaction and does not limit the quantity. you can also attach these sheets to the line and when the reaction becomes too violent you can pull out a few sheets until it calms down.



PavelYou have to use thin Al. Al sheets are to thick. Your idea with line won't work as you imagine.


----------



## Pavel

Again, I apologize for tagging you and not the author. I am from a poor country where experimenters can only dream of such equipment as in the video. And the people involved professionally do not use this method. We could have: an electric stove, a pot, a wine rack, a jar, a bottle, a bucket. - This type of equipment. and with 0.25kg of aluminum everything will boil and fly out.... But if you use sheet metal....


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Pavel said:


> Again, I apologize for tagging you and not the author. I am from a poor country where experimenters can only dream of such equipment as in the video. And the people involved professionally do not use this method. We could have: an electric stove, a pot, a wine rack, a jar, a bottle, a bucket. - This type of equipment. and with 0.25kg of aluminum everything will boil and fly out.... But if you use sheet metal....



PavelThere is somebody here experimenting with thicker alu supposedly doing 1kg reactions, but patton is right, foil works best.You are welcome to try but you will beat your head against the wall.I personally tried discs, pellets, sheet NOTHING worked better than 0.25 thickness aluminium obtained from weighting discs, it's almost foil but not quite.
Also I refuse to believe you don't have plastic barrels and piping. Jacketed reactor with a barrel within a larger barrel, condenser a big pipe inside a small one, smaller tubes fitted for water flow boom you have a really good reactor setup.


----------



## Foryou

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> 100 ml Isopropyl alcohol (IPA)



HIGGS BOSSONCan I use ethanol instead of isopropyl alcohol?


----------



## G.Patton

Foryou said:


> Can I use ethanol instead of isopropyl alcohol?



ForyouI think yes, P2NP is soluble in EtOH.


----------



## Foryou

G.Patton said:


> I think yes, P2NP is soluble in EtOH.



G.PattonThank you for all your efforts
You will always be the mountain I lean on


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Ethanole doesn't separate as well as isopropanol, this _might _lower your yield


----------



## Foryou

In my country, it is difficult to obtain isopropyl alcohol, but it is easy to obtain ethanol


----------



## G. Chauich

If done correctly, how many grams of amphetamine should be able to be produced?


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

G. Chauich said:


> If done correctly, how many grams of amphetamine should be able to be produced?



G. Chauich*"The yield is 60-70%."*


----------



## Xiaoyan

Hello, 

How can I be sure that I have cleaned all the mercury residues in the amalgamation process??

What other product can be used to reduce sulfuric acid?? 
other than acetone, to avoid such a strong smell...


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Xiaoyan said:


> Hello,
> 
> How can I be sure that I have cleaned all the mercury residues in the amalgamation process??
> 
> What other product can be used to reduce sulfuric acid??
> other than acetone, to avoid such a strong smell...



XiaoyanAs long as there is enough aluminium your mercury salts will get eaten up by it, turning into metallic mercury and making an alloy with the Al.Now rinsing will get rid of residual water soluble salts and solvent extraction will ensure minimal contamination (Neither metallic mercury or salts are soluble in water too well).These extracts are dried with drying agent, further driving water and it's contaminants away.If you still feel iffy after these steps you can go ahead and steam distill.
If you mean to dillute sulphuric acid you can use IPA.


----------



## Xiaoyan

UWe9o12jkied91d said:


> As long as there is enough aluminium your mercury salts will get eaten up by it, turning into metallic mercury and making an alloy with the Al.Now rinsing will get rid of residual water soluble salts and solvent extraction will ensure minimal contamination (Neither metallic mercury or salts are soluble in water too well).These extracts are dried with drying agent, further driving water and it's contaminants away.If you still feel iffy after these steps you can go ahead and steam distill.
> If you mean to dillute sulphuric acid you can use IPA.



UWe9o12jkied91dTo clean aluminum, what I do is rinse it several times with distilled water, but it keeps coming out dirty gray, does that mean it's contaminated? or why is this happening?


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Xiaoyan said:


> To clean aluminum, what I do is rinse it several times with distilled water, but it keeps coming out dirty gray, does that mean it's contaminated? or why is this happening?



XiaoyanThat is just fine alumina coming off the pieces of aluminium.


----------



## nkd23

Is it possible to cock at home (not more then 10g P2NP) 
Should you use a gass mask? ( because of the hg)


----------



## Pavel

nkd23 said:


> Is it possible to cock at home (not more then 10g P2NP)
> Should you use a gass mask? ( because of the hg)



nkd231. good ventilation
1. Eye protection
2. face protection
2. hand protection
3. gas mask -??? ok! - you know what type of filter need to use??
hg is poisoning but please think Your grandma possible broke couple of hg thermometer....
MAIN PROBLEM is eat hg not smell, do not touch face, especially lips, eye, do not eat or drink before wash. be careful when go toilet


----------



## G.Patton

nkd23 said:


> Should you use a gass mask? ( because of the hg)



nkd23It worth to use protection, you have just one body.


----------



## nkd23

I have tyvak full body suits and mask dräger xplore 3500 mask with A1B1E1K1 filter 

Is it safe to do small batches (5-15g P2NP) at home?


And what do you do with the waste?


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

nkd23 said:


> I have tyvak full body suits and mask dräger xplore 3500 mask with A1B1E1K1 filter
> 
> Is it safe to do small batches (5-15g P2NP) at home?
> 
> 
> And what do you do with the waste?



nkd23Just run tubing from your condenser to the outside if you are so inclined.But just so you know it takes entire grams of mercury salts directly ingested to kill you in the near future.If you are potentially exposed take a regimen of 50mg alpha lipoic acid for a month or so *a few days after potential exposure. Do not take more than 50mg / day.*

Everything is possible with the right attitude.


----------



## nkd23

That's the reasen I asked 

I don't wanna poisen me or an other

The filter for the mask is for hg and all the bad stuff 

Tub out of the window is a good idea 

Can I put the tube from the condenser in an beaker with liquid that binds or neutralize the hg/mercury vapors?


And what are you doing with the waste for example the amalgamation (water rinses)?


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Xiaoyan said:


> Hello,
> 
> How can I be sure that I have cleaned all the mercury residues in the amalgamation process??
> 
> What other product can be used to reduce sulfuric acid??
> other than acetone, to avoid such a strong smell...



XiaoyanAs long as there is enough aluminium your mercury salts will get eaten up by it, turning into metallic mercury and making an alloy with the Al.Now rinsing will get rid of residual water soluble salts and solvent extraction will ensure minimal contamination (Neither metallic mercury or salts are soluble in water too well).These extracts are dried with drying agent, further driving water and it's contaminants away.If you still feel iffy after these steps you can go ahead and steam distill.
If you mean to dillute sulphuric acid you can use IPA.


----------



## Xiaoyan

UWe9o12jkied91d said:


> As long as there is enough aluminium your mercury salts will get eaten up by it, turning into metallic mercury and making an alloy with the Al.Now rinsing will get rid of residual water soluble salts and solvent extraction will ensure minimal contamination (Neither metallic mercury or salts are soluble in water too well).These extracts are dried with drying agent, further driving water and it's contaminants away.If you still feel iffy after these steps you can go ahead and steam distill.
> If you mean to dillute sulphuric acid you can use IPA.



UWe9o12jkied91dTo clean aluminum, what I do is rinse it several times with distilled water, but it keeps coming out dirty gray, does that mean it's contaminated? or why is this happening?


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Xiaoyan said:


> To clean aluminum, what I do is rinse it several times with distilled water, but it keeps coming out dirty gray, does that mean it's contaminated? or why is this happening?



XiaoyanThat is just fine alumina coming off the pieces of aluminium.


----------



## nkd23

Is it possible to cock at home (not more then 10g P2NP) 
Should you use a gass mask? ( because of the hg)


----------



## Pavel

nkd23 said:


> Is it possible to cock at home (not more then 10g P2NP)
> Should you use a gass mask? ( because of the hg)



nkd231. good ventilation
1. Eye protection
2. face protection
2. hand protection
3. gas mask -??? ok! - you know what type of filter need to use??
hg is poisoning but please think Your grandma possible broke couple of hg thermometer....
MAIN PROBLEM is eat hg not smell, do not touch face, especially lips, eye, do not eat or drink before wash. be careful when go toilet


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

nkd23 said:


> That's the reasen I asked
> 
> I don't wanna poisen me or an other
> 
> The filter for the mask is for hg and all the bad stuff
> 
> Tub out of the window is a good idea
> 
> Can I put the tube from the condenser in an beaker with liquid that binds or neutralize the hg/mercury vapors?
> 
> 
> And what are you doing with the waste for example the amalgamation (water rinses)?



nkd23I know for sure germany has collection for free of chemical waste, maybe you have it too.


----------



## nkd23

Yes in at it could be too.
But I hope they don't ask and don't monitor.
I have to try it with something ordernary


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

nkd23 said:


> Yes in at it could be too.
> But I hope they don't ask and don't monitor.
> I have to try it with something ordernary



nkd23just say your process metals or something


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

nkd23 said:


> Yes in at it could be too.
> But I hope they don't ask and don't monitor.
> I have to try it with something ordernary



nkd23Also you can treat the wastewater with sodium hydroxide, then sulphur to make it flushable, but I'm not 100% on the details , maybe procedure is different, ask an expert.


----------



## Costa

Hi, some questions

1.- I have Mercury Chloride instead of Mercury (II) nitrate. Do I have to use 0,1g Mercury Chloride (HgCl2)? 
2.- I have Acetic Acid 80%, so I used 62,5 ml. Is this OK?
3.- I prepared the sulphuric acid solution in IPA? Is OK? or must be Acetone?

Thanks


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Costa said:


> Hi, some questions
> 
> 1.- I have Mercury Chloride instead of Mercury (II) nitrate. Do I have to use 0,1g Mercury Chloride (HgCl2)?
> 2.- I have Acetic Acid 80%, so I used 62,5 ml. Is this OK?
> 3.- I prepared the sulphuric acid solution in IPA? Is OK? or must be Acetone?
> 
> Thanks



CostaAs long as it's mercuric and not mercurous chloride yes, same.Maybe little more, maybe less, dosent matter so much.
You can do this reaction in only IPA and water, so yes
Yes, its fine, acetone is better, but yes


----------



## Costa

UWe9o12jkied91d said:


> As long as it's mercuric and not mercurous chloride yes, same.Maybe little more, maybe less, dosent matter so much.
> You can do this reaction in only IPA and water, so yes
> Yes, its fine, acetone is better, but yes



UWe9o12jkied91dThanks so much for your quick reply!


----------



## Skinny_Pete_

Hello, I've read almost all the comments, I know i can use HgCl2 instead of Hg(NO3)2
But, can someone that tried using it, tell me how much HgCl2 i have to use for 10g of P2NP. Someone said it doesn't matter a lot... But I want to be sure i use the optimal quantity. 
Also, the most concentrated Sulphuric Acid I can find in the forum listings, it says min95% will this concentration work.
So if thouse 5% in the acid is water content will this spoil the salt falling.


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Skinny_Pete_ said:


> Hello, I've read almost all the comments, I know i can use HgCl2 instead of Hg(NO3)2
> But, can someone that tried using it, tell me how much HgCl2 i have to use for 10g of P2NP. Someone said it doesn't matter a lot... But I want to be sure i use the optimal quantity.
> Also, the most concentrated Sulphuric Acid I can find in the forum listings, it says min95% will this concentration work.
> So if thouse 5% in the acid is water content will this spoil the salt falling.



Skinny_Pete_I always just try to be in the range of 0,1g/10-12g of Al, a little more is better than a little less in this case.A good indicator is your aluminium floating to the top, if some time has passed and there is still aluminium on the bottom add a dash more, swirl well, give it a minute or two and drain.But this rarley happens to me, 0,1g is perfect most of the time.I used chloride, oxide, acetate, nitrate all amalgamated well with 0,1g.

It is a conflict of interest for me to answer the second question but I will anyway.If your organic extract is well dry (30-1h MgSO4 siccum) you shouldn't even notice the difference between 95 and 98 sol. If by any means you are using an acid with less conc. it helps to put your mass in the freezer to reduce solubility a bit and filter cold preferably on vacuum.


----------



## Skinny_Pete_

UWe9o12jkied91d said:


> I always just try to be in the range of 0,1g/10-12g of Al, a little more is better than a little less in this case.A good indicator is your aluminium floating to the top, if some time has passed and there is still aluminium on the bottom add a dash more, swirl well, give it a minute or two and drain.But this rarley happens to me, 0,1g is perfect most of the time.I used chloride, oxide, acetate, nitrate all amalgamated well with 0,1g.
> 
> It is a conflict of interest for me to answer the second question but I will anyway.If your organic extract is well dry (30-1h MgSO4 siccum) you shouldn't even notice the difference between 95 and 98 sol. If by any means you are using an acid with less conc. it helps to put your mass in the freezer to reduce solubility a bit and filter cold preferably on vacuum.



UWe9o12jkied91dThanks for the useful info. 
In the video captions it says 1:30 MgSO4 to extract, does that means 1part per weight for every 30 parts of extract, or this means something else ? 
How can i tell if my MgSO4 is anhydrous, they sell it in the pharmacy, but did u know if this one is anhydrous ?
Will it dry faster if i use a lot or there is limit ?

When the extract is mixed 1:1 with IPA can i still dulite the acid with some IPA aswell to avoid the eventual excess of acid ?


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Skinny_Pete_ said:


> Thanks for the useful info.
> In the video captions it says 1:30 MgSO4 to extract, does that means 1part per weight for every 30 parts of extract, or this means something else ?
> How can i tell if my MgSO4 is anhydrous, they sell it in the pharmacy, but did u know if this one is anhydrous ?
> Will it dry faster if i use a lot or there is limit ?
> 
> When the extract is mixed 1:1 with IPA can i still dulite the acid with some IPA aswell to avoid the eventual excess of acid ?



Skinny_Pete_Maybe extract is not the right term, unless you mean extracting the water, but anyways.It’s a good reference to follow (1:30) until you get a sense for it, I just add by eye, putting in about a finger or two on the bottom (discounting the voids).More drying agent can be used and they can help with very wet solution if you have a visible water layer you should add more, if the sol. is simply turbid you add less.If you’ve added some and don’t see a clearing of the sol. add a bit more.Not too much as it may arrest some of your organic material, use common sense.
The one in the pharmacy is heptahydrate, meaning there’s 7 molecules of water for every 1 of sulphate.You can test the water content by performing a calcination.1-2 hour at 100 C, 4 hours at 500 C , 4h at 1000C, weigh before and after and the difference is the water.Ofcourse this is to analytical standard, you can blast it at 300 C in a conventional oven to get simillar results.
Yes, it is a good idea to use dillute sulphuric acid. You might have local over-acidification with conc. 
Keep in mind after drying try a drop or two, see how it precipitates, you may not need dillution.If it precipitates well you can try adding some cold ipa after reaching the right pH, see if more crashes out, if yes keep adding, if no toss that sucker in the freezer and give it a few hours.You will be able to decant most of your solvent with minimal loss and the product filtration will be quick and easy.


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Skinny_Pete_ said:


> Hello, I've read almost all the comments, I know i can use HgCl2 instead of Hg(NO3)2
> But, can someone that tried using it, tell me how much HgCl2 i have to use for 10g of P2NP. Someone said it doesn't matter a lot... But I want to be sure i use the optimal quantity.
> Also, the most concentrated Sulphuric Acid I can find in the forum listings, it says min95% will this concentration work.
> So if thouse 5% in the acid is water content will this spoil the salt falling.



Skinny_Pete_Oh and it helps to prepare your solution for precipitation and basification beforehand and park them in the freezer, This helps improve yield under less than ideal conditions.


----------



## Jcjchh

what if i don't use a vacuum source?


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Jcjchh said:


> what if i don't use a vacuum source?



JcjchhWhat of it? You can do this 100% without vaccum.


----------



## Xiaoyan

Hello, 
I have a question about laboratory equipment,

Apart from borosilicate glass, what other types of materials can be used as reactor?
Would it affect the quality of the synthesis?

What equipment is recommended to synthesize 500 P2NP g.??

Thank you


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Xiaoyan said:


> Hello,
> I have a question about laboratory equipment,
> 
> Apart from borosilicate glass, what other types of materials can be used as reactor?
> Would it affect the quality of the synthesis?
> 
> What equipment is recommended to synthesize 500 P2NP g.??
> 
> Thank you



XiaoyanPP. HDPE or even metal if you apply a protective PTFE coating to the *whole* interior surface.
Barrel in barrel, so you can cool and heat. Large condenser made from pipe in pipe.Hole for condenser, hole for teflon overhead stirring adapter (Or a large cement mixing drill hooked up to a regulator).Your aluminium needs to be thicker than sub 50-100g reactions, much thicker or else it will go out the condenser.The limit is 100g is said, but I am fairly convinced you can scale up a lot more.There is 1 person here that I know of that does 1kg reactions with this method and by what he says it takes "hours" to amalgamate and aluminium sheet is used.


----------



## Xiaoyan

UWe9o12jkied91d said:


> PP. HDPE or even metal if you apply a protective PTFE coating to the *whole* interior surface.
> Barrel in barrel, so you can cool and heat. Large condenser made from pipe in pipe.Hole for condenser, hole for teflon overhead stirring adapter (Or a large cement mixing drill hooked up to a regulator).Your aluminium needs to be thicker than sub 50-100g reactions, much thicker or else it will go out the condenser.The limit is 100g is said, but I am fairly convinced you can scale up a lot more.There is 1 person here that I know of that does 1kg reactions with this method and by what he says it takes "hours" to amalgamate and aluminium sheet is used.



UWe9o12jkied91dThank you so much!!

I am ussing a 5L glass flask to synthetize aprx 30-40g...
But i want to try some bigger..

I would like to do my own "DIY" eqipment to scale up the reaction.

I thought about using an empty 25/50-L bottle of those intended to contain chemical products.

Is it a good idea?
The quality of the synthesis would be affected using plastic equipmen???


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Xiaoyan said:


> Any recommendations on the thickness of the aluminum that I should use and how to make the amalgam with that
> aluminum?
> Should I cut it to some size?



XiaoyanI worked well with 0.25mm-3mm "sheet" ,I say in quotes because its bendable by hand easily. I cut into small sizes and do 1-2 sec blitz in coffee grinde/blender just for a bit of surface area


----------



## Xiaoyan

UWe9o12jkied91d said:


> I worked well with 0.25mm-3mm "sheet" ,I say in quotes because its bendable by hand easily. I cut into small sizes and do 1-2 sec blitz in coffee grinde/blender just for a bit of surface area



UWe9o12jkied91d3mm aluminum, for what amount of p2np is it recommended?
Does it grind well with a coffee grinder?


----------



## Xiaoyan

Hello, 
I have a question about laboratory equipment,

Apart from borosilicate glass, what other types of materials can be used as reactor?
Would it affect the quality of the synthesis?

What equipment is recommended to synthesize 500 P2NP g.??

Thank you


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Xiaoyan said:


> Hello,
> I have a question about laboratory equipment,
> 
> Apart from borosilicate glass, what other types of materials can be used as reactor?
> Would it affect the quality of the synthesis?
> 
> What equipment is recommended to synthesize 500 P2NP g.??
> 
> Thank you



XiaoyanPP. HDPE or even metal if you apply a protective PTFE coating to the *whole* interior surface.
Barrel in barrel, so you can cool and heat. Large condenser made from pipe in pipe.Hole for condenser, hole for teflon overhead stirring adapter (Or a large cement mixing drill hooked up to a regulator).Your aluminium needs to be thicker than sub 50-100g reactions, much thicker or else it will go out the condenser.The limit is 100g is said, but I am fairly convinced you can scale up a lot more.There is 1 person here that I know of that does 1kg reactions with this method and by what he says it takes "hours" to amalgamate and aluminium sheet is used.


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Xiaoyan said:


> Thank you so much!!
> 
> I am ussing a 5L glass flask to synthetize aprx 30-40g...
> But i want to try some bigger..
> 
> I would like to do my own "DIY" eqipment to scale up the reaction.
> 
> I thought about using an empty 25/50-L bottle of those intended to contain chemical products.
> 
> Is it a good idea?
> The quality of the synthesis would be affected using plastic equipmen???



XiaoyanNo, it should not affect quality, but watch out, at room temp. both hdpe and pp are fine in almost anything but at 110*C they start deforming especially under solvents, acids etc.


----------



## Xiaoyan

UWe9o12jkied91d said:


> No, it should not affect quality, but watch out, at room temp. both hdpe and pp are fine in almost anything but at 110*C they start deforming especially under solvents, acids etc.



UWe9o12jkied91dOk.
The ideal temperature range for a good synthesis is between 50 and 70°C aprx, right?


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Xiaoyan said:


> Ok.
> The ideal temperature range for a good synthesis is between 50 and 70°C aprx, right?



XiaoyanYes, but at the first addition the temp. may suddenly rise higher than that


----------



## Xiaoyan

UWe9o12jkied91d said:


> Yes, but at the first addition the temp. may suddenly rise higher than that



UWe9o12jkied91dAny recommendations on the thickness of the aluminum that I should use and how to make the amalgam with that
aluminum?
Should I cut it to some size?


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Xiaoyan said:


> Any recommendations on the thickness of the aluminum that I should use and how to make the amalgam with that
> aluminum?
> Should I cut it to some size?



XiaoyanI worked well with 0.25mm-3mm "sheet" ,I say in quotes because its bendable by hand easily. I cut into small sizes and do 1-2 sec blitz in coffee grinde/blender just for a bit of surface area


----------



## Xiaoyan

UWe9o12jkied91d said:


> I worked well with 0.25mm-3mm "sheet" ,I say in quotes because its bendable by hand easily. I cut into small sizes and do 1-2 sec blitz in coffee grinde/blender just for a bit of surface area



UWe9o12jkied91d3mm aluminum, for what amount of p2np is it recommended?
Does it grind well with a coffee grinder?


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

0.25-0.3 , pardon me


----------



## Xiaoyan

Oook
I am ussing 0.04 mm Al to synthetize 50 P2NP
Can i use the same Al to synthetize 100?? 200?? 300???

And another question, if you don't mind, 
What kind of Teflon spray can be used to cover a drum??

I'm looking and I can only find spray for lubrication....


----------



## Pavel

Xiaoyan said:


> Oook
> I am ussing 0.04 mm Al to synthetize 50 P2NP
> Can i use the same Al to synthetize 100?? 200?? 300???
> 
> And another question, if you don't mind,
> What kind of Teflon spray can be used to cover a drum??
> 
> I'm looking and I can only find spray for lubrication....



XiaoyanPlease start from small amount. when You see problem with cooling think how solve it. You can have easy 1/2 of stuff on floor - (better option). Worst on You. mean all you place is dirty with mercury ;( my opinion painting the barrel is a dead end.


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Fep Coating - Buy Fep Coating,Fep Dispersion Liquid,Fep Liquid Product on Alibaba.com


Fep Coating - Buy Fep Coating,Fep Dispersion Liquid,Fep Liquid Product on Alibaba.com



www.alibaba.com





Here you go, right in your backyard, this is 1 example, they have many more, check specifications, temperature, substrate, room temp or heat cure etc


----------



## purple_rain

How do I know whether my respirator protects against mercury vapours or not? (I am synthesising Mercury(II) nitrate myself via mercury and nitric acid so some mercury vapour will be produced).
Does it matter whether I use glacial acetic acid or just acetic acid? I'm finding it hard to find a supplier for glacial acetic acid.


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

purple_rain said:


> How do I know whether my respirator protects against mercury vapours or not? (I am synthesising Mercury(II) nitrate myself via mercury and nitric acid so some mercury vapour will be produced).
> Does it matter whether I use glacial acetic acid or just acetic acid? I'm finding it hard to find a supplier for glacial acetic acid.



purple_rainMaybe a test strip for toxic stuff? They sell it at lab stores. Wet down the used filter and blot the strip I supose.
But I think you are over-worrying.Mercury has a very high boiling point 360 ish degrees C, your condenser will take care of it and even IF some mercury vapors get carried by other gasses outside the condenser it so minute in quantity you're probably ingesting more eating salmon.
You can even use just water, so naturally 80% or whatever you can find is ok.


----------



## purple_rain

UWe9o12jkied91d said:


> Maybe a test strip for toxic stuff? They sell it at lab stores. Wet down the used filter and blot the strip I supose.
> But I think you are over-worrying.Mercury has a very high boiling point 360 ish degrees C, your condenser will take care of it and even IF some mercury vapors get carried by other gasses outside the condenser it so minute in quantity you're probably ingesting more eating salmon.
> You can even use just water, so naturally 80% or whatever you can find is ok.



UWe9o12jkied91dAh okay, thanks for the advice.


----------



## dirktem

HIGGS BOSSON said:


> Your browser is not able to display this video.
> 
> 
> Download Video
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Amphetamine synthesis from P2NP via Al/Hg (video)
> 
> 
> 
> __ HEISENBERG
> __ May 27, 2022
> __ 5
> __
> adderall
> amphetamine
> amphetamine synthesis
> amphetamine video
> amphetamines
> amphetamines salts
> cas 300-62-9
> cas 705-60-2
> p2np
> video synthesis
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://bbgate.com/threads/synthesis-of-amphetamine-from-p2np-via-al-hg-video.196/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your browser is not able to display this video.
> 
> 
> Download Video
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alphamethylphenethylamine (amphetamine) synthesis
> 
> 
> 
> __ Novator
> __ Sep 27, 2022
> __ 3
> __
> adderall
> amphetamine
> amphetamine salts
> amphetamine synthesis
> amphetamine video
> cas 300-62-9
> cas 705-60-2
> p2np
> phenethylamines
> video synthesis
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 479Mb (.mp4)
> Reductive amination of 1-phenyl-2-nitropropene to α-methylphenethylamine by...



HIGGS BOSSONWhy it play mdma music when making amphetamine. can not delete


----------



## purple_rain

Instead of using an item of clothing to filter the amphetamine sulfate, can i use filter paper? Also, Since I will make a solution of elemental mercury and nitric acid, how should I store it as I won't need the entire solution for one batch of amphetamine?


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

purple_rain said:


> Instead of using an item of clothing to filter the amphetamine sulfate, can i use filter paper? Also, Since I will make a solution of elemental mercury and nitric acid, how should I store it as I won't need the entire solution for one batch of amphetamine?



purple_rainYou can use coffee filters from the grocery store, better than paper.
Depends on the conc. of the acid, up to 70% it should be ok in hdpe


----------



## purple_rain

UWe9o12jkied91d said:


> You can use coffee filters from the grocery store, better than paper.
> Depends on the conc. of the acid, up to 70% it should be ok in hdpe



UWe9o12jkied91dThanks


----------



## Heartburn

Since my very first succesful synthesis few months ago, I've tried many various combinations of synth. optimization, mainly related to easier/cheaper purification. So I've got for you some *kitchen tips and tricks*:

*1.* For the first acidification of decanted Rm use gaseous HCl instead of liquid solutions. Why? if you are going to make AB extraction anyway, then intermediate ion doesn't really matter, but also it's almost impossible to accidentally overacidify Rm, due to freebase's solution anhydrous environment, excessive HCl just go straight to fume vent. I've noticed that this process appeared noticeably more, time- and cost-effective if you bubble trough diffusor, not just straight rubber hose (imho best and easiest to obtain is firmly porous aerator stone for aquarium, but it can't be made of natural basalt or other HCl-vulnerable rocks) and use narrow, tall beaker. 
*2.* This tip could be very useful for ppl working with relatively huge volumes of freebase at one time. It's really not that complicated as it might be written. If the first salt precepitation appeared to be so easy and stress free, but you can make the next acidification to be nearly the same as previous. I bet you are equipped with some precise scale and some sort of drying chamber (bake oven), so you can sample around few ca. 200mg samples of filtered salt, and just simply conduct gravimetric designation of moisture content, this ISO standard procedure can be read in some all-is-free internet libraries. How much is 'few', it's up to your judgement. After last dry-weighting these samples can go back to their batch. Why would you even had to be keen on doing some ordinarily optional process? Well, firstly you'd be able to decently precise calculate your raw Rm yield by applying dry mass content for rest of still wet batch. So it's that everything useful? No, not really. You can do some fabulously easy stoichiometric equations and very precisely calculate total amount of solution to get pH.6. Simply check calc. twice and calmly dump 80-90% of total acid. The rest is added dropwise as it always was.
*3.* If you'd had a chance to catch an opportunity to buy a "short expiration date" bottle of HPLC grade isooctane for a small fracture of it's price; You'd better read it carefully: it's not mouldy, just stability and purity certification won't be guaranteed. But it doesn't bother us anyway. I always conduct the last AB precipitation with base extract in isooct, solution, and acetone/food grade phosphoric (V) acid. Why it's so wonderful? No heavy metals content like fairly frequent had eg. petroleum ether, also polarity index 0.1 what makes this solvent 2nd most insoluble liquid in water, and whole bunch of properties. But it can separate totally in funnel under 5 minutes while freezing cold, and somehow magically acts like most precise pH quench indicator in the world. In quick, you got casually milk, porridge, and very often using pH papers,. but in isooctane/acetone solution stirred in magstir max rpm, always "The last drop" makes the foggy solution bind together in characteristic powdery clouds, making the top of solution totally clear in seconds also giving ideal pH at the time . (do we have any PhD of chemistry to try explain it for whole community?) Also if ABExtraction was done properly, you can repeatedly reuse it as the best of available reaction buffer. 
Feel free to ask about these.


----------



## G.Patton

Heartburn said:


> Since my very first succesful synthesis few months ago, I've tried many various combinations of synth. optimization, mainly related to easier/cheaper purification. So I've got for you some *kitchen tips and tricks*:
> 
> *1.* For the first acidification of decanted Rm use gaseous HCl instead of liquid solutions. Why? if you are going to make AB extraction anyway, then intermediate ion doesn't really matter, but also it's almost impossible to accidentally overacidify Rm, due to freebase's solution anhydrous environment, excessive HCl just go straight to fume vent. I've noticed that this process appeared noticeably more, time- and cost-effective if you bubble trough diffusor, not just straight rubber hose (imho best and easiest to obtain is firmly porous aerator stone for aquarium, but it can't be made of natural basalt or other HCl-vulnerable rocks) and use narrow, tall beaker.
> *2.* This tip could be very useful for ppl working with relatively huge volumes of freebase at one time. It's really not that complicated as it might be written. If the first salt precepitation appeared to be so easy and stress free, but you can make the next acidification to be nearly the same as previous. I bet you are equipped with some precise scale and some sort of drying chamber (bake oven), so you can sample around few ca. 200mg samples of filtered salt, and just simply conduct gravimetric designation of moisture content, this ISO standard procedure can be read in some all-is-free internet libraries. How much is 'few', it's up to your judgement. After last dry-weighting these samples can go back to their batch. Why would you even had to be keen on doing some ordinarily optional process? Well, firstly you'd be able to decently precise calculate your raw Rm yield by applying dry mass content for rest of still wet batch. So it's that everything useful? No, not really. You can do some fabulously easy stoichiometric equations and very precisely calculate total amount of solution to get pH.6. Simply check calc. twice and calmly dump 80-90% of total acid. The rest is added dropwise as it always was.
> *3.* If you'd had a chance to catch an opportunity to buy a "short expiration date" bottle of HPLC grade isooctane for a small fracture of it's price; You'd better read it carefully: it's not mouldy, just stability and purity certification won't be guaranteed. But it doesn't bother us anyway. I always conduct the last AB precipitation with base extract in isooct, solution, and acetone/food grade phosphoric (V) acid. Why it's so wonderful? No heavy metals content like fairly frequent had eg. petroleum ether, also polarity index 0.1 what makes this solvent 2nd most insoluble liquid in water, and whole bunch of properties. But it can separate totally in funnel under 5 minutes while freezing cold, and somehow magically acts like most precise pH quench indicator in the world. In quick, you got casually milk, porridge, and very often using pH papers,. but in isooctane/acetone solution stirred in magstir max rpm, always "The last drop" makes the foggy solution bind together in characteristic powdery clouds, making the top of solution totally clear in seconds also giving ideal pH at the time . (do we have any PhD of chemistry to try explain it for whole community?) Also if ABExtraction was done properly, you can repeatedly reuse it as the best of available reaction buffer.
> Feel free to ask about these.



HeartburnDo you produce amphetamine*HCl for personal use?


----------



## Heartburn

G.Patton said:


> Do you produce amphetamine*HCl for personal use?



G.PattonIt's just an intermediate form among all of purification steps. Final ion is usually sulphate by choice. Because none of known titration indicator is applicable for this specific case, You must use tons of indicative papers to catch endpoint of unknown concentration solution, I can't just cheap and quickly get valuable quality sight on the most important step. As is commonly suspected, gasing out freebase by bubbling some seriously nasty toxic gas made in modern adaptation of antique Kipp aparatus, when critically essential, is probably the most danger and the least cost effective way of salting. But it is simply impossible to overacidify anhydrous freebase solution, especially when actual yield is a lottery. Excessive HCl just bubble out to happily catch moisture from air and chew any metal surface over time. By getting more familiar with al/hg reduction, I've decided to enact A-B extraction in my slightly updated version of this recipe. Since then I make full A-B as mandatory synthesis step, even if first freebase layer looks almost colourless. It's just for my own health. I've made roughly 15-20 batches, always 10-20grams, and it comes out different almost every time. Not just appearance differs but also how it will effect your behaviour when boozed.
For me; as longtime analytic laboratory worker, my average reproducibility factor is serious reason to be self ashamed. Literallly everytime it gets different, no matter if they're made from sub's taken from the same as yesterday, including deionised water. Now by the "describe every detail' method, i'm trying to catch a pattern of which process detail can affect final product when neglected. Sometimes effort on making Mr. Hyde as professional as like Dr. Jekyll is so uneven to make seriously doubt in myself as professional. In particular, when it comes to comparison of my final result vs expected target as it was presented in this topic video. @G.Patton you can DM me to share some knowledge with each other.


----------



## Camilo

Will this work for MDphenylacetone? If not, can someone recommend me a proccess to synthezise MDA from Safrole? thanks in advance


----------



## G.Patton

Camilo said:


> Will this work for MDphenylacetone? If not, can someone recommend me a proccess to synthezise MDA from Safrole? thanks in advance



CamiloRead following methods. You have to get MDP2P from Safrole, then you can get MDA via described below method.
Complete MDMA synthesis from Sassafras oil with Al/Hg
Amphetamine from P2P (phenyl-2-propanone)


----------



## jazzthatguy

I had no problems with the synthesis up to the point to make the freebase a salt by adding sulfuric acid to 6 PH.
I got a clear yellow amphetamine freebase from taking it off the top layer of the IPA, P2NP, GAA, NaHO and Hg/Al mixture. The freebase amphetamine was around 9PH and I brought it down to 6~ PH by adding sulfuric acid along with 20mL acetone, but the freebase amphetamine has not turned into a salt / paste yet and is still liquid.

It does seem like there is a salt up to about the 5mL fill line and the amphetamine freebase goes to about the 135mL fill line. I used 10g p2np.

Anyone have an idea of what went wrong here? Can I still turn my mixture into amphetamine sulfate, or is the product waste?

I will note that I used Fiji water instead of deionized or distilled water because I could not find any distilled. It didn't seem to affect the reaction at all, but could this be the cause? I also did not dry the freebase with magnesium sulfate because I did not have any


----------



## G.Patton

jazzthatguy said:


> I had no problems with the synthesis up to the point to make the freebase a salt by adding sulfuric acid to 6 PH.
> I got a clear yellow amphetamine freebase from taking it off the top layer of the IPA, P2NP, GAA, NaHO and Hg/Al mixture. The freebase amphetamine was around 9PH and I brought it down to 6~ PH by adding sulfuric acid along with 20mL acetone, but the freebase amphetamine has not turned into a salt / paste yet and is still liquid.
> 
> It does seem like there is a salt up to about the 5mL fill line and the amphetamine freebase goes to about the 135mL fill line. I used 10g p2np.
> 
> Anyone have an idea of what went wrong here? Can I still turn my mixture into amphetamine sulfate, or is the product waste?
> 
> I will note that I used Fiji water instead of deionized or distilled water because I could not find any distilled. It didn't seem to affect the reaction at all, but could this be the cause? I also did not dry the freebase with magnesium sulfate because I did not have any



jazzthatguyHi. Probably your amphetamine sulphate is dissolved in water.


> I also did not dry the freebase with magnesium sulfate because I did not have any



Was the amphetamine oil (free base) dissolved in something?


> The freebase amphetamine was around 9PH and I brought it down to 6~ PH by adding sulfuric acid along with 20mL acetone, but the freebase amphetamine has not turned into a salt / paste yet and is still liquid.


Can you load pic of your product? I'll try to help you.


----------



## jazzthatguy

G.Patton said:


> Hi. Probably your amphetamine sulphate is dissolved in water.
> 
> 
> Was the amphetamine oil (free base) dissolved in something?
> 
> Can you load pic of your product? I'll try to help you.



G.PattonI think the amph freebase was dissolved in IPA (according to higgs bosson's video). I added some more acetone and it started to turn a cloudy white color, which I'm assuming is a good thing, but the mixture will not thicken up (possibly because of water presence?)
This is my amphetamine freebase mixture after roughly 12 hours of leaving it overnight. The color turned from a very light yellow to this dark yellow.





This is how it looks after I added some more acetone to the mixture




Should I keep adding acetone to the mixture? Is there any easy way to remove the water at this point?


----------



## Heartburn

jazzthatguy said:


> I had no problems with the synthesis up to the point to make the freebase a salt by adding sulfuric acid to 6 PH.
> I got a clear yellow amphetamine freebase from taking it off the top layer of the IPA, P2NP, GAA, NaHO and Hg/Al mixture. The freebase amphetamine was around 9PH and I brought it down to 6~ PH by adding sulfuric acid along with 20mL acetone, but the freebase amphetamine has not turned into a salt / paste yet and is still liquid.
> 
> It does seem like there is a salt up to about the 5mL fill line and the amphetamine freebase goes to about the 135mL fill line. I used 10g p2np.
> 
> Anyone have an idea of what went wrong here? Can I still turn my mixture into amphetamine sulfate, or is the product waste?
> 
> I will note that I used Fiji water instead of deionized or distilled water because I could not find any distilled. It didn't seem to affect the reaction at all, but could this be the cause? I also did not dry the freebase with magnesium sulfate because I did not have any



jazzthatguyIf your freebase isn't getting cloudy after adding acid/acetone, you can extract i with some strongly non-polar solvent like hexane or petroleum ether. If you have already neutralized whole solution, add some more concentrated NaOH solution, and some of the solvent mentioned above. After extraction pour it to narrow cylinder, and you should be able to see 3-layers of liquid phase. Upper layer- clear should contain hexane+amph freebase and very little acetone, mid layer- yellow is IPA + leftover freebase mixed with all the polar impurities and acetone, lower is of course alkaline water solution of NaOH. Take the upper hexane layer and repeat the extraction several times. Freebase surely won't go up to hexane in a single run, since it's soluble in both of them. Then you can dilute obtained hexane freebase solution with acetone and try again to precipitate salt. Once i had some shitty IPA which turned out later is roughly 82% instead of 99.5% and also I haven't dried it, because idk why. Also my freebase titration looked just like yours, and this procedure, I've mentioned above helped me to regain somesome of quite good purified salt.


----------



## G.Patton

Heartburn said:


> If your freebase isn't getting cloudy after adding acid/acetone, you can extract i with some strongly non-polar solvent like hexane or petroleum ether. If you have already neutralized whole solution, add some more concentrated NaOH solution, and some of the solvent mentioned above. After extraction pour it to narrow cylinder, and you should be able to see 3-layers of liquid phase. Upper layer- clear should contain hexane+amph freebase and very little acetone, mid layer- yellow is IPA + leftover freebase mixed with all the polar impurities and acetone, lower is of course alkaline water solution of NaOH. Take the upper hexane layer and repeat the extraction several times. Freebase surely won't go up to hexane in a single run, since it's soluble in both of them. Then you can dilute obtained hexane freebase solution with acetone and try again to precipitate salt. Once i had some shitty IPA which turned out later is roughly 82% instead of 99.5% and also I haven't dried it, because idk why. Also my freebase titration looked just like yours, and this procedure, I've mentioned above helped me to regain somesome of quite good purified salt.



HeartburnLooks correct, @jazzthatguy . Probably you have wet IPA and the wet is key of your problem.


----------



## Costa

Hi, I made 2ml sulf 98% in 50ml acetone, but the final product has an horrible smell to acetone. 
Do you think that could be a good idea to use IPA instead of acetone? What should be the quantities?
There is other product intead ipa or acetone, to decrease this strong smell?


----------



## G.Patton

Costa said:


> Hi, I made 2ml sulf 98% in 50ml acetone, but the final product has an horrible smell to acetone.
> Do you think that could be a good idea to use IPA instead of acetone? What should be the quantities?
> There is other product intead ipa or acetone, to decrease this strong smell?



CostaYou have to evaporate acetone from your product with vacuum quite fast. IPA not so goo option. *Vacuum desiccators*
You also, can dry it well on Suction (vacuum) filtration Buchner funnel.


----------



## Xiaoyan

G.Patton said:


> You have to evaporate acetone from your product with vacuum quite fast. IPA not so goo option. *Vacuum desiccators*
> You also, can dry it well on Suction (vacuum) filtration Buchner funnel.



G.PattonWhat can we do to separate IPA from the free base oil??


----------



## G.Patton

Xiaoyan said:


> What can we do to separate IPA from the free base oil??



Xiaoyanevaporate IPA


----------



## Xiaoyan

Sorry, I have a question, 
I was doing a synthesis and the reduction reaction didn't start, so I was thinking it was wrong. I have left it aside, but after 2 hours I have returned and it was reacting.
Could the reaction have gone wrong somehow by not monitoring it???


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Xiaoyan said:


> Sorry, I have a question,
> I was doing a synthesis and the reduction reaction didn't start, so I was thinking it was wrong. I have left it aside, but after 2 hours I have returned and it was reacting.
> Could the reaction have gone wrong somehow by not monitoring it???



Xiaoyanits too vague for anybody to tell, sounds a little like weak/incorrect amalgamation?


----------



## Xiaoyan

And another question is how long it should be reacting,
Because after 30 or 40 minutes the temperature starts to drop below 40 degrees and I'm not sure if it's still doing something.
Thankyou


----------



## UWe9o12jkied91d

Xiaoyan said:


> And another question is how long it should be reacting,
> Because after 30 or 40 minutes the temperature starts to drop below 40 degrees and I'm not sure if it's still doing something.
> Thankyou



XiaoyanYou can check reaction completion by TLC, you can easily make plates or buy.You check for presence/conc. of raw material.
Or reflux to keep the reaction going once it's cooling off the peak until the Al is gone.Careful with the temp.


----------



## G.Patton

Xiaoyan said:


> And another question is how long it should be reacting,
> Because after 30 or 40 minutes the temperature starts to drop below 40 degrees and I'm not sure if it's still doing something.
> Thankyou



XiaoyanThin-layer chromatography (TLC) of drugs


----------

