CrystalBee

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P2np to p2p



Add to a 500ml Round bottomed boiling flask (RBF) with 3 necks
central neck has an overhead stirrer - IMPORTANT has to be an overhead stirrer and has to be powerful enough to keep iron powder from settling on the bottom, cannot use magnetic stirring as it does not have enough power to keep the iron powder up in the solution and the iron messes with the magnetic stirring anyway.
side neck has a long reflux condenser with cold water supplied
2nd side neck has a pressure-equalising addition funnel filled with 0.197 mole of conc. hydrochloric acid 35.5% in the below example thats is 20.2 ml

The RBF is in a water or oil bath to keep internal reaction temperature at 85 to 95 degC.

Add to RBF:
0.1 mole of P2NP (P2NP 163.2 g/mole) = 16.23g of P2NP
0.715 mole of iron (Fe 55.85 g/mole) = 40g of iron (Fe) - cast iron turnings or ideally 40 mesh iron powder (powder 0.4 mm size)
Note: Activate a metal normally involves rinsing it with a strong mineral acid like hydrochloric acid or alkali like sodium hydroxide solution for a few minutes to remove any layer of oxidation that prevents it from reacting, after this rinse with distilled water twice and use immediately else store under non-polar liquid until ready use required.
However in this reduction of nitroalkene to ketone, hydrochloric acid is one of the reagents, therefore activation can occur in situ.

75ml of distilled water
0.1g of ferric chloride - acts as an initialization catalyst - helps reaction start faster

Acid from addition funnel is added slowly over 5 to 6 hours, so as to keep the reaction going but not explosively so, reflux should never reach over half way up the reflux condenser.
At the end the reaction mixture was then basified with 25% NaOH solution until pH 11 and then steam distill the P2P oil over to a receiver.
Yield should be 75 to 77% P2P from the P2NP ie. P2P 134.3 g/mol so 0.1 mole is 13.42g and 0.75 to 0.77 % yield = 10g (9.94ml) to 10.3g (10.24ml) (Density of P2P is 1.006 g/mL)

This reaction can be scalled up to quite a large size, the molar equivalents are:
molar ratio of Fe/alkene = 7.15
molar ratio of HCl/Alkene = 1.97
1.97 x 0.1 mole of p2NP=0.197 moles of HCl x HCl 36.458 g/mol = 7.18g HCl
if you have concentrated hydrochloric acid 35.5% that means it has 355g/L, or 35.5g/100ml so 718g / 0.355 = 20.2ml of concentrated hydrochloric acid 35.5% to be added via addition funnel

So a 1 mole reaction would use a 5L RBF with 163.2 g of P2NP, 7.15 mole of Fe (7.15 x 55.85 g/mol) = 400g of iron powder, 750ml of distilled water, 1g of Ferric Chloride and 202ml of concentrated hydrochloric acid 35.5%
Yield would be 100g (99.4ml) to 103g (102.4ml) of P2P


Note: For a cheap overhead stirrer:
From ebay you can get a cheap PTFE stirrer bearing to fit the correct size of your boiling flask central neck, you can get a steel stirrer coated in PTFE to protect it from the acid, you can get a bench supply that supplies 0-30V 0-3A for about £30, and you can get a DC motor from certain handheld blenders cheap which you can take apart and connect motor shaft to stirrer shaft, stirrer shaft goes through bearing (pre-grease internal bearing ring with vaseline to help reduce friction), connect the motor to the bench power supply, set the current high enough to supply to motor, then vary speed by increasing/decreasing voltage.

PTFE Standard Stopper Lab Stirrer Bearing Adapter Stirrer Accessory No.29
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/313672059695
£10.84
This will fit a 29/32 socket on a boiling flask, it uses a stirrer shaft of 8mm diameter
Findind a PTFE coated stirrer with shaft diameter 8mm tricky most on ebay 7mm so it maybe best to order both items from laborxing that's 2 weeks to arrive but they have high quality equipment.

https://www.laborxing.com/products/ptfe-stirrer-bearing-adapter-joint-stopper
https://www.laborxing.com/products/ptfe-stirring-blades-propeller-2-winged-length-250-mm-to-750-mm

Bench power supply 0-30V 0-10A - potentially this is powerful enough to run electrochemical reactions, and peltier cooling modules
https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B09ZQBFZ4C
£44.99
You should be able to find a cheaper one because you only need 0-3A, maybe if the motor you pick up is high torque then 0-5A
 

Rollin88

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P2np to p2p



Add to a 500ml Round bottomed boiling flask (RBF) with 3 necks
central neck has an overhead stirrer - IMPORTANT has to be an overhead stirrer and has to be powerful enough to keep iron powder from settling on the bottom, cannot use magnetic stirring as it does not have enough power to keep the iron powder up in the solution and the iron messes with the magnetic stirring anyway.
side neck has a long reflux condenser with cold water supplied
2nd side neck has a pressure-equalising addition funnel filled with 0.197 mole of conc. hydrochloric acid 35.5% in the below example thats is 20.2 ml

The RBF is in a water or oil bath to keep internal reaction temperature at 85 to 95 degC.

Add to RBF:
0.1 mole of P2NP (P2NP 163.2 g/mole) = 16.23g of P2NP
0.715 mole of iron (Fe 55.85 g/mole) = 40g of iron (Fe) - cast iron turnings or ideally 40 mesh iron powder (powder 0.4 mm size)
Note: Activate a metal normally involves rinsing it with a strong mineral acid like hydrochloric acid or alkali like sodium hydroxide solution for a few minutes to remove any layer of oxidation that prevents it from reacting, after this rinse with distilled water twice and use immediately else store under non-polar liquid until ready use required.
However in this reduction of nitroalkene to ketone, hydrochloric acid is one of the reagents, therefore activation can occur in situ.

75ml of distilled water
0.1g of ferric chloride - acts as an initialization catalyst - helps reaction start faster

Acid from addition funnel is added slowly over 5 to 6 hours, so as to keep the reaction going but not explosively so, reflux should never reach over half way up the reflux condenser.
At the end the reaction mixture was then basified with 25% NaOH solution until pH 11 and then steam distill the P2P oil over to a receiver.
Yield should be 75 to 77% P2P from the P2NP ie. P2P 134.3 g/mol so 0.1 mole is 13.42g and 0.75 to 0.77 % yield = 10g (9.94ml) to 10.3g (10.24ml) (Density of P2P is 1.006 g/mL)

This reaction can be scalled up to quite a large size, the molar equivalents are:
molar ratio of Fe/alkene = 7.15
molar ratio of HCl/Alkene = 1.97
1.97 x 0.1 mole of p2NP=0.197 moles of HCl x HCl 36.458 g/mol = 7.18g HCl
if you have concentrated hydrochloric acid 35.5% that means it has 355g/L, or 35.5g/100ml so 718g / 0.355 = 20.2ml of concentrated hydrochloric acid 35.5% to be added via addition funnel

So a 1 mole reaction would use a 5L RBF with 163.2 g of P2NP, 7.15 mole of Fe (7.15 x 55.85 g/mol) = 400g of iron powder, 750ml of distilled water, 1g of Ferric Chloride and 202ml of concentrated hydrochloric acid 35.5%
Yield would be 100g (99.4ml) to 103g (102.4ml) of P2P


Note: For a cheap overhead stirrer:
From ebay you can get a cheap PTFE stirrer bearing to fit the correct size of your boiling flask central neck, you can get a steel stirrer coated in PTFE to protect it from the acid, you can get a bench supply that supplies 0-30V 0-3A for about £30, and you can get a DC motor from certain handheld blenders cheap which you can take apart and connect motor shaft to stirrer shaft, stirrer shaft goes through bearing (pre-grease internal bearing ring with vaseline to help reduce friction), connect the motor to the bench power supply, set the current high enough to supply to motor, then vary speed by increasing/decreasing voltage.

PTFE Standard Stopper Lab Stirrer Bearing Adapter Stirrer Accessory No.29
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/313672059695
£10.84
This will fit a 29/32 socket on a boiling flask, it uses a stirrer shaft of 8mm diameter
Findind a PTFE coated stirrer with shaft diameter 8mm tricky most on ebay 7mm so it maybe best to order both items from laborxing that's 2 weeks to arrive but they have high quality equipment.

https://www.laborxing.com/products/ptfe-stirrer-bearing-adapter-joint-stopper
https://www.laborxing.com/products/ptfe-stirring-blades-propeller-2-winged-length-250-mm-to-750-mm

Bench power supply 0-30V 0-10A - potentially this is powerful enough to run electrochemical reactions, and peltier cooling modules
https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B09ZQBFZ4C
£44.99
You should be able to find a cheaper one because you only need 0-3A, maybe if the motor you pick up is high torque then 0-5A
CrystalBeeI’ve tried this reaction with these exact ratio’s, and I just can not seem to get any p2p. I am following the procedure exactly - as hard as it is to get my addition funnel to drip that slow, I’m matching every parameter.My solution turns green. The RBF is a mess that I can hardly see in. I don’t know if I’m overstirring or not but there;’s iron pieces trapped in the ground glass fittings for the addition funnel and reflex condenser. Not sure if that’s normal…When I basify, I have gone a little past 11 one time, which seemed to produce a good bit of smoke in the flask. I added a couple more drops of Hcl to bring it back down to 11 and it seemed fine. I flood the same dirty RBF with iron still in there with water, and run a 1 flask steam distillation on the reaction mixture, which is very dark at this point, with the black iron particles staining everything. The distillate that then comes over is always clear, with a fogginess or haziness too it, but no real color. No orange. I figure this is oil and water mix but when I extract with DCM (ph is double checked here and is 11.1) it stays in the water later and the DCM just seems like crystal clear DCM, maybe with a super slight pink tinge. If the DCM is clear does that tell me there’s zero P2P? I don’t want to waste more time on it I’d rather just try again. I don’t know what parameters to change. I’m using triple re-crystallized p2np purchased from a reputable overseas verndor, I’m using ‘iron filings for synthesis’ that look legit, I bought FeCl3 from the science company.com and hcl is acs grade from alliance chemical. I am using high quality glassware, an overhead stirrer from vevor with a PFTE shaft and paddle. I was thinking of trying next with Zinc powder and ZnCl2 to start the reaction, given this is my fourth time without seeminingly getting anywhere. First 2 tries were .1M and the last was .2M, as I figured maybe a bigger vessel would be more forgiving, but all 3 fail. This last one turned a nice green color after 18h, but it has like green slime formed on the inside of the glassware that made it almost impossible to see above the waterline.

Any help is appreciated.
 

PNicole

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This reaction works well in water only. What is the purpose of the toluene? Once HCl is added, basify using 50% NaOH solution (contents will urn blueish). You do not need a baking soda wash if done that way. Flood the flask with water and steam distill the P2P. It will be clear/slightly yellow as it distills. Once neon orange color is coming over, its more than done. Use DCM to extract P2P from water, dry and remove with distillation. Apply vacuum and distill pure P2P. Surprisingly this reaction works better at larger scale in the 81-87% yield if things are tweaked. Lower scale you achieve 73-75% (not very good) to 77-78%.

You also do not need 5-6 hours to add Acid.
 

Alchemik

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Is this good method to receive substituted 2-phenylethylamines from nitrostyrenes? Zn/HCl is good, but you have to add Zn gradually. At this method you add all substrates immediately (in one time) and waiting.
 

choose

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Is this good method to receive substituted 2-phenylethylamines from nitrostyrenes? Zn/HCl is good, but you have to add Zn gradually. At this method you add all substrates immediately (in one time) and waiting.
AlchemikI was reading about using zn in this reaction.As far as I know, You have to crush cleaned p2np crystals to make fine powder and mix it with zinc powder in a certain proportion and then add in parts to RF, like when you add hcl when using Fe powder. I want to try this alternative because I dont have overhead stirrer with matching ptfe plug. Has anyone tried this before?
 

T0lek511

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Can I use 1.5ml of 40% aqueous FeCl3 solution instead of 0.6g of solid FeCl3? In my country, only the aqueous solution is available to the average citizen.
 
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