4-MMC synthesis

Berlin777

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After some failures due to my lack of patients finally got some good results thanks to @William Dampier @Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton and passive spectator @G.Patton

My first batches were pretty shit because I rushed too much and didn't use appropriate equipment. For instance I used 250ml drip funnel and I waited only for couple of minutes for the layers separation because I wanted to finish asap and that was the result (1st picture) , I'm gonna blend it, rinse it and crystallize it.
For the first batches I used BK4 and MA40%

After few fuck ups things started getting better, recipe changed a little bit because there are some issues with MA40% but I feet comfortable with current method.

Current method is cold synthesis, works good for me:
500g BK4 is dissolved in 1500ml DCM in 6L flat bottom flask using magnetic stirrer
500g of NaOH is dissolved in 1L H2O cooled (about 10 C) down and added to the flask
750g MA HCl is added to the flask in small batches so the temperature doesn't raise too much, roughly 100g - 150g every 10-15 minutes
The lid is closed and it's left for 16 - 24h hours on the stirrer

After that salt has to be filtered with buchner funnel, then the layers separated prepared for washing.
For first washing I use 3L filtered water with 150g sodium bicarbonate heated up to 30 C
Second washing just 3L of filtered water.

Once it's washed I use about 160ml and 800ml acetone for acidification and to get mephedrone powder, once pH 5 or lower is reached I put it to the freezer and leave overnight.
On the next day I filter as much as possible and leave it to dry. When I skipped that and filtered still wet mephedrone the yield was 240g, yesterday I done it Marvins way and it was 258g.
Marvins way
1. Filter
2. Dry
3. Rinse (cold acetone)
4. Dry
5. crystallize

Crystallization
1:2 powder mephedrone to water and alcohol 50% of the amount of water

I just pour the water to the pyrex glass bowl add mephedrone heat it up until little bubbles appear, boil for 5 minutes, switch the heating off and add alcohol the pour it to the crystallization dish and wait.

So if we compare how it stared and how it's going it's a big difference.
 

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cascade

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Berlin777

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Congratulations!! Beautiful crystals my friend. Patience and persistence will always pay off if given the right resources :D

Do you have a m.p. on the product?
cascadeSorry but I don't know what m.p. is
 
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Berlin777

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Melting point. Did you start from 2B4M?
cascadeI don't have it but I will check it, didn't realize it's important. Thanks for your advice, I should have put more details...

I use 2B4M, DCM, MA HCl and NaOH solution. Going put more details a bit later
 

BitcoinScam

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I don't have it but I will check it, didn't realize it's important. Thanks for your advice, I should have put more details...

I use 2B4M, DCM, MA HCl and NaOH solution. Going put more details a bit later
Berlin777crystal no look perfect but is no so bad u have to hot in room i see on picture.
U made the same way like gordon ?
u put all and mix on dcm ??
 

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Yes not perfect, a little discoloration and not as pretty or big of crystals as possible. Also definitely still wet crystals which will give you innacurate yield weight & make your dosing imprecise. You should throw in a sealed container with silica gel as a DIY vacuum dessicator or at least dry under fan & light to dry the xtals. Did you wash thoroughly on the filter with acetone? Some say the neurotoxicity of some 4mmc batches is due to manganese impurities. These impurities should be sufficiently washed away in acetone.

Personally, I use ethyl acetate over DCM in this reaction nowadays because I can find it slightly cheaper & is more commercially available now that many commercial sources of DCM have switched to substitute chemicals (like EtOAc). Should also be able to use benzene or toluene in place but I'd advise against benzene just due to toxicity & carcinogenicity.

To answer your question about doing this the same way as gordon, yes this is the main route I follow just beginning from the bromoketone as the source is readily available now, whereas in the past I would have to start the reaction OTC and make the bromoketone myself following Kinetic's procedure from The Hive (https://chemistry.mdma.ch/hiveboard/novel/000423945.html)
cascadeCan you describe your synthesis step by step with photos, which reactions take place much better, you can see it in the photos
 

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I've never documented one of my mephedrone synths, my friend. I will do another run in December and record then for you. As of now we are only manufacturing synthetic cannabinoids at the moment!! Apologies :(
cascadeok thanks
 

Berlin777

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crystal no look perfect but is no so bad u have to hot in room i see on picture.
U made the same way like gordon ?
u put all and mix on dcm ??
BitcoinGoing to put more detail about the synthesis on the next post
 

Berlin777

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Yes not perfect, a little discoloration and not as pretty or big of crystals as possible. Also definitely still wet crystals which will give you innacurate yield weight & make your dosing imprecise. You should throw in a sealed container with silica gel as a DIY vacuum dessicator or at least dry under fan & light to dry the xtals. Did you wash thoroughly on the filter with acetone? Some say the neurotoxicity of some 4mmc batches is due to manganese impurities. These impurities should be sufficiently washed away in acetone.

Personally, I use ethyl acetate over DCM in this reaction nowadays because I can find it slightly cheaper & is more commercially available now that many commercial sources of DCM have switched to substitute chemicals (like EtOAc). Should also be able to use benzene or toluene in place but I'd advise against benzene just due to toxicity & carcinogenicity.

To answer your question about doing this the same way as gordon, yes this is the main route I follow just beginning from the bromoketone as the source is readily available now, whereas in the past I would have to start the reaction OTC and make the bromoketone myself following Kinetic's procedure from The Hive (https://chemistry.mdma.ch/hiveboard/novel/000423945.html)
cascadeI do rinse it with ice cold acetone after drying mephedrone powder
 

🍒cherry

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Got precipitation and powder waiting for crystal step with help of patton and william me too thank you guys
Any suggestions in crystallization steps...
 

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BitcoinScam

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Got precipitation and powder waiting for crystal step with help of patton and william me too thank you guys
Any suggestions in crystallization steps...
cherryindiahow much gram powder u get 4mmc
 
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Berlin777

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After some failures due to my lack of patients finally got some good results thanks to @William Dampier @Marvin "Popcorn" Sutton and passive spectator @G.Patton
Berlin777I didn't realize people will be interested in the synthesis so I do my best to describe it without missing anything.

My first batches were pretty shit because I rushed too much and didn't use appropriate equipment. For instance I used 250ml drip funnel and I waited only for couple of minutes for the layers separation because I wanted to finish asap and that was the result (1st picture) , I'm gonna blend it, rinse it and crystallize it.
For the first batches I used BK4 and MA40%

After few fuck ups things started getting better, recipe changed a little bit because there are some issues with MA40% but I feet comfortable with current method.

Current method is cold synthesis, works good for me:
500g BK4 is dissolved in 1500ml DCM in 6L flat bottom flask using magnetic stirrer
500g of NaOH is dissolved in 1L H2O cooled (about 10 C) down and added to the flask
750g MA HCl is added to the flask in small batches so the temperature doesn't raise too much, roughly 100g - 150g every 10-15 minutes
The lid is closed and it's left for 16 - 24h hours on the stirrer

After that salt has to be filtered with buchner funnel, then the layers separated prepared for washing.
For first washing I use 3L filtered water with 150g sodium bicarbonate heated up to 30 C
Second washing just 3L of filtered water.

Once it's washed I use about 160ml and 800ml acetone for acidification and to get mephedrone powder, once pH 5 or lower is reached I put it to the freezer and leave overnight.
On the next day I filter as much as possible and leave it to dry. When I skipped that and filtered still wet mephedrone the yield was 240g, yesterday I done it Marvins way and it was 258g.
Marvins way
1. Filter
2. Dry
3. Rinse (cold acetone)
4. Dry
5. crystallize

Crystallization
1:2 powder mephedrone to water and alcohol 50% of the amount of water

I just pour the water to the pyrex glass bowl add mephedrone heat it up until little bubbles appear, boil for 5 minutes, switch the heating off and add alcohol the pour it to the crystallization dish and wait.

So if we compare how it stared and how it's going it's a big difference.
 

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BitcoinScam

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cold way is shit way because your product no get euphoria dcm u need only heat.
dmso nmp THF u dont need u can do like u say now.
i never no made m40% form M HCL.
M40% i buy for 14€/L but if thet ban good to know how to made m40% form M hcl
 
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cold way is shit way because your product no get euphoria dcm u need only heat.
dmso nmp THF u dont need u can do like u say now.
i never no made m40% form M HCL.
M40% i buy for 14€/L but if thet ban good to know how to made m40% form M hcl
BitcoinThere is no way heating affects euphoricity, only reaction time. Don't be misled.
If the reaction is done correctly, you will not be able to tell from the quality of the product the method used to produce it.
This topic is about the method used by Berlin777 .
You can post your personal syntheses separately in a suitable topic.
 
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Berlin777

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Yeah the first ones looked very dirty, I only showed them to compare to current ones, which are cleaner, I am aware of mistakes which I’m trying to fix, ordering few things to improve production and quality.

If you can safely ship MA40% to the UK I will be happy to buy it.
 

Berlin777

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It’s cleaner compared to my first batches
 

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Berlin777

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can u send more picture how to look freebase when and how too looks like 2b4m in dcm when u throw naoh water and later m hcl?
BitcoinI usually don't save such pictures on my phone. Only sometimes take a picture to send it and delete it right away. I do have only one 2L separation funnel, do you think that would work to use hose and vacuum to pump out the layer from the flask?
 
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