Σύνθεση αμφεταμίνης μιας κατσαρόλας από P2NP με NaBH4/CuCl2 (κλίμακα 1 kg)

SelfExper1menter

Don't buy from me
New Member
Joined
Apr 4, 2023
Messages
17
Reaction score
2
Points
3
Γεια σε όλους. Προσπάθησα να φτιάξω λίγη αμφεταμίνη χρησιμοποιώντας αυτή τη συνταγή σε μικρή κλίμακα, αλλά απέτυχα. Όλα φαίνονταν εντάξει, μετά την ξήρανση το προϊόν μου έμοιαζε με λευκή σκόνη με μια απόχρωση ερυθρότητας. Αν επρόκειτο για θειική αμφεταμίνη (την οποία προσπαθούσα να φτιάξω), η απόδοση θα ήταν 84%. Το πρόβλημα είναι ότι δεν πρόκειται για αμφεταμίνη.

Φυσιολογικές επιδράσεις
Δοκίμασα 20-30 mg, υπήρξε σίγουρα διέγερση, αλλά επίσης προκάλεσε πυρετό και, προφανώς, μείωση της ανοσίας: και τις δύο φορές που το πήρα για αρκετές ημέρες στη σειρά, αρρώστησα με λοιμώξεις του αναπνευστικού (την πρώτη φορά νόμιζα ότι ήταν σύμπτωση). Ένα άλλο άτομο που το πήρε δεν είχε βιώσει καμία διέγερση από έως και 90 mg, μόνο κάποια ξηρότητα στο στόμα. Κανείς από τους δύο μας δεν έχει ανοχή στα διεγερτικά.

Χημικές δοκιμές
1 g σκόνης διαλύεται πλήρως σε 10 ml H2O.
Όταν πρόσθεσα περίσσεια διαλύματος NaOH σε μια μετρημένη μάζα της σκόνης σε δοκιμαστικό σωλήνα, πήρα έναν περίπου σωστό όγκο ελεύθερης βάσης που μύριζε αμμωνία. Διαχώρισα το στρώμα της ελεύθερης βάσης, το στέγνωσα με CaCl2 και προσπάθησα να το τιτλοδοτήσω με οξύ. Ως αποτέλεσμα, μέτρησα τη μοριακή μάζα της ελεύθερης βάσης να είναι περίπου 171 (και για την αμφεταμίνη είναι 135). Αν και οι μετρήσεις μου δεν ήταν πολύ ακριβείς, η διαφορά εξακολουθεί να είναι πολύ μεγάλη για να εξηγηθεί μόνο από σφάλματα μέτρησης.

Οι αποκλίσεις μου από τη διαδικασία

1) Κατά την προσθήκη του P2NP, συνειδητοποίησα ότι θα έπαιρνε ώρες, οπότε ανυπομονούσα και βύθισα τη φιάλη αντίδρασης σε υδατόλουτρο θερμοκρασίας δωματίου. Μετά από αυτό μπόρεσα να προσθέσω το P2NP σχεδόν όλο μαζί και η θερμοκρασία του μίγματος δεν ξεπέρασε τους 40-50 °С.
2) Ακολουθούσα το βίντεο, οπότε δεν εξατμίσαμε το IPA και πρόσθεσα απευθείας conc. θειικό οξύ στο στρώμα IPA/freebase.
3) Δεν είχα εκείνη τη στιγμή ακετόνη, οπότε δεν την πρόσθεσα πριν από την οξίνιση και ξέπλυνα τη φιλτραρισμένη πάστα "θειικής αμφεταμίνης" με IPA.
4) Το IPA είναι λιγότερο πτητικό από την ακετόνη, οπότε έπρεπε να βάλω το ίζημα μου σε φούρνο για αρκετές ώρες για να στεγνώσει σε σταθερό βάρος. Η θερμοκρασία στο φούρνο δεν ξεπερνούσε τους 80 °С.

Έτσι, το μεγάλο ερώτημα είναι, πού πήγε στραβά; Δεν θα με εξέπληττε μια χαμηλή απόδοση ή καθόλου προϊόν, αλλά να πάρω μια καλή απόδοση μιας αμίνης που δεν είναι αμφεταμίνη;!
 
View previous replies…

OneTensionSkyRed

Don't buy from me
Resident
Language
🇺🇸
Joined
Dec 24, 2024
Messages
15
Reaction score
4
Points
3
That's what I was thinking. This reaction produces N-OH-amphetamine instead of pure amine. People can clearly tell the difference between their physiological activity.
 

pekonias

Don't buy from me
Resident
Language
🇺🇸
Joined
Jun 26, 2024
Messages
7
Reaction score
4
Points
3
I don't anderstand what is happening? I used 300g NaBH4 2.07 L IPA, 1.03 L dH2O, 173g P2Np 22g CuCl.2H2O and everything went well - reaction over and I add 0.4 L 25% NaOH sol. to get (pH 13.5) separate layers but... there's wery little separation. The aq. layer was only 0.3L so now I have 2.2 L organic layer, more than starting IPA + H2O (2.1 L). So does organic layer now contains NaOH? The pH after reaction was ~12 and there was no layer separation so I added the 0.4 L NaOH sol. What should I do now? Add more NaOH sol. and vacuum distill? Maybe acidify to pH <=3 and distill. Please advice guys.
 

pekonias

Don't buy from me
Resident
Language
🇺🇸
Joined
Jun 26, 2024
Messages
7
Reaction score
4
Points
3
Obviously I can't count, actually got correct volume for the organic part and also extracted the sludge with 0.3L IPA. It's very confusing when told to add NaOH to pH 12 when it's already at that after reaction. Also aq. part seems to small but it's mostly in the black mud. Going to go ahead with water aspirator vacuum distilling off the IPA and hopefully not lose all product like last time. I think got too hot 80C with -28" Hg vacuum last time. Maybe report how it went tomorrow if has any luck.
 

OneTensionSkyRed

Don't buy from me
Resident
Language
🇺🇸
Joined
Dec 24, 2024
Messages
15
Reaction score
4
Points
3
You need to add more NaOH in dry form or at least concentrated NaOH solution if you don't want to heat RM from dry NaOH to separate IPA layer. The densities are similar and that prevents IPA from salting out. Have you destroyed borate adducts afther the reaction?
 

two777

Don't buy from me
Member
Language
🇺🇸
Joined
Oct 27, 2024
Messages
4
Reaction score
0
Points
1
what is the optimal temperature for a-oil, before you start the extraction/ crystallization process using sulfuric acid? Usually im working with room temperature oil, and adding acid gradually, by not extending temperatures above 40c.
 

pekonias

Don't buy from me
Resident
Language
🇺🇸
Joined
Jun 26, 2024
Messages
7
Reaction score
4
Points
3
Follow up to my previous post, copule observations made during the process I think are important to share. This was really my very first success at this. From 173g P2NP I got ~130ml clear oil. What I wanna say is that now, compared to the previous experiment, was very different at the step when CuCl added. Previously added it dropwise and the temperature didn't increase at all, no storm in flask and only gave test subjects a runny nose. Now had twice as much and better quality P2NP. Also 10% of the NaBH4 was added later, after most P2NP had been added but it don't seem make no difference. So the CuCl was added added in 3 bursts of 10ml each and very violent reaction was observed (~1/4 CuCl soln. was left unadded). After each 10ml addition the reaction almost came out of the flask but not quite and the temperature increased dramatically. The Rm was 3.1 L in 5 L RBF. Temp reached 78C after third addition and the surface / foam level stayed really high for a minute and the reflux from the two ball condensers poured down IPA/H2O like hell. Unreal sight but it happened and I think the reflux prevented temp. going > 78C. So I much rather want the violent reaction then I know something is really cooking and reacting. The organic layer was condensed in -26.25" Hg vacuum BP 37-38C. Vacuum dist. stopped when 1.8 / 2.2 L liquid was removed (BP. was 41.8C at end). Then steam distilled. First 100ml of distillate thought to be water and almost thrown away! It's A-Oil! Thinking drying some of it by mixing 50ml Oil with 300ml? dry IPA and giving it 20g silica gel and let sit overnight. How much H2O should the vacuum distilled IPA contain? Would be nice to re-use it. I measured its density to be ~0.8g/ml which is that of IPA (0.786g/ml) within the measurement accuracy?
 

Attachments

  • RZx3oQeIzW.png
    RZx3oQeIzW.png
    538 KB · Views: 14

keras

Don't buy from me
New Member
Language
🇺🇸
Joined
Jan 18, 2025
Messages
1
Reaction score
0
Points
1
So to cook 1kg of amph would cost more than to make 1kg 3cmc?
Becausd borohydride I see costly in poland , also p2np add up. While 3cmc is one main precursor.
And how these guys sell amp paste for less than 1k per kg. Where profit comes from ?
 

dobrytowar55

Don't buy from me
Member
Language
🇵🇱
Joined
Sep 21, 2024
Messages
4
Reaction score
0
Points
1
So then i Ask for most beacuse i knows on netherland production cost is between 300-600euro. How ? I dont mnie but meaby someone tell me herę 😅
 

dobrytowar55

Don't buy from me
Member
Language
🇵🇱
Joined
Sep 21, 2024
Messages
4
Reaction score
0
Points
1
Hi. Can someone tell me what the cost of ingredients and equipment for producing 1kg is? I would be grateful if someone could tell me if it is enough to scaling up everything to get a larger amout or does that cause any discrepancies? Also can someone tell me what is the CAS of this final product?
 
Last edited:

OneTensionSkyRed

Don't buy from me
Resident
Language
🇺🇸
Joined
Dec 24, 2024
Messages
15
Reaction score
4
Points
3
It would be really REALLY great if someone could run a TLC analysis of the products from this reaction. I've read that NaBH4/Cu reduction mainly produces N-hydroxylamines instead of amines for alpha-alkyl nitrostyrenes. Because of similar melting points for their salts and similar boiling points, the only way to separate and identify N-OH-amphetamine is by chromatography. The N-OH product is also active as a stimulant but it is different to amphetamine. I wonder if this is really true.
 

GhostChemist

Expert
Joined
Nov 20, 2022
Messages
199
Reaction score
329
Points
63
what source reports this information?
all compounds tested with qualitative and quantitative analysis
N-OH group can be formed as an intermediate compound if the experiment is not carried out correctly
 

chemdogpal

Don't buy from me
New Member
Language
🇺🇸
Joined
Mar 4, 2025
Messages
6
Reaction score
0
Points
1
at what temperature does amphetamine start to evaporate ?
 
Top